It's abhorrent.

[tango]

Actually they came seeking asylum from death and fleeing for their lives.
Seeking asylum is not a violation of any law on the books.




Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

There's just the question of how many are actually fleeing violence and how many are economic migrants.

The fact someone shows up at the border claiming persecution doesn't mean they are a genuine asylum seeker. People need to be checked out whatever their claim and whatever the circumstances under which they arrive at the border. Otherwise it becomes too easy to jump the queue by making false statements. It's generally a bad idea to reward untruthfulness.

 

[MennoSota]

Excuse me but that is stupid. Our country should be accessible to new immigrants like it used to be when the Pilgrims came here.

Ever ask a Native American about their opinion on an open border and people coming in unwanted?

 

[MennoSota]

Ask the Native Americans how that worked out for them...

They have been fighting against immigration since 1492...

A flea cannot swallow a camel...

The US cannot swallow the immigration world...

They need to give their own countries freedom...

We should help them...


Arsenios

...like in Syria...

 

[Arsenios]

...like in Syria...

Islamic cultures need oppressive regimes...

Assad protects Orthodox Christians in Syria...

That is one reason Russia, an Orthodox Christian country, is helping him...

Arsenios

 

[Albion]

Islamic cultures need oppressive regimes...

Assad protects Orthodox Christians in Syria...

That is one reason Russia, an Orthodox Christian country, is helping him...

Is there some reason for thinking that Putin and the other makers of Russias foreign policy really give a hoot about the Orthodox religion?

 

[Andrew]

Still doesnt make it right and the immigration bill that is being considered in Congress addresses that very issue, thankfully. To me there is a big difference between murder and rape and just simply walking across a border seeking a better life.

They can seek a better life the legal way.
It's not far for all the ones coming in the legal way who are willing to wait and pursue the procedure to gain a valid legal citizenship.

 

[MoreCoffee]

By all means arrest and detain families that cross the USA border without valid visas or other entry papers but that is no reason to separate children from their parents. There are plenty of ways to keep families together while in detention.

PS: There appears to be increasing opposition from Republican governors, republican state politicians, and republican federal politicians to the President's zero tolerance policy and the consequent child parent separations that it engenders. God willing it will end.

 

[MoreCoffee]

At the last Judgement the Lord Jesus will judge the deeds of Christian and non-Christian people. He will pronounce sentence based on what people did. Jeff Sessions invoked saint Paul in Romans 13 to justify separating children from their parents if the parents entered the USA without valid entry papers. So I want to invoke the words of the Lord himself on the matter

Matthew 25: 31 When the Son of Man comes in his glory with all his angels, he will sit on the throne of his glory. 32 All the nations will be brought before him; and, as a shepherd separates the sheep from the goats, 33 so will he do with them, placing the sheep on his right hand and the goats on his left. 34 The king will say to those on his right, ‘Come, blessed of my Father! Take possession of the kingdom prepared for you from the beginning of the world. 35 For I was hungry, and you fed me. I was thirsty, and you gave me something to drink. 36 I was a stranger, and you welcomed me into your home. I was naked, and you clothed me. I was sick, and you visited me. I was in prison, and you came to see me.’ 37 Then the righteous will ask him, ‘Lord, when did we see you hungry, and give you food; thirsty, and give you something to drink; 38 or a stranger, and welcome you; or naked, and clothe you? 39 When did we see you sick, or in prison, and go to see you?’ 40 The king will answer, ‘Truly I say to you: just as you did it for one of the least of these brothers or sisters of mine, you did it to me.’ 41 Then he will say to those on his left, ‘Go, cursed people, out of my sight, into the eternal fi re, which has been prepared for the devil and his angels! 42 For I was hungry, and you did not give me anything to eat; I was thirsty, and you gave me nothing to drink; 43 I was a stranger, and you did not welcome me into your house; I was naked, and you did not clothe me; I was sick, and in prison, and you did not visit me.’ 44 They, too, will ask, ‘Lord, when did we see you hungry, thirsty, naked or a stranger, sick or in prison, and did not help you?’ 45 The king will answer them, ‘Truly I say to you: just as you did not do it for one of the least of these, you did not do it for me.’ 46 And these will go into eternal punishment; but the just, to eternal life.”​

It's a very weighty matter to be judged by the Lord so harshly, the crime that brings such judgement ought never be entered into lightly. The consequences are very grave indeed. Christians especially ought to take the other route and hope to hear the words from the Lord on the last day "I was a stranger, and you welcomed me into your home".

 

[TangledWeb]

The left sees the separation of children at the border as abhorrent but will fight for the right to separate a child from its mother's womb in an abortion. It's sickening if you ask me.

 

[Tigger]

Our boarders can be regulated with decency and equality with comprehensive legislation. Its because of political wrangling by both parties that these issues get so conflated. When are we going to wake up people!

 

[Albion]

There are plenty of ways to keep families together while in detention.

I'm waiting to hear what some of them are.

 

[Arsenios]

Is there some reason for thinking that Putin and the other makers of Russias foreign policy really give a hoot about the Orthodox religion?

Their support of Assad is one reason...
Putin having a monk as his Spiritual Father is another...
State support of the Orthodox Faith at home and abroad is another...

Personally, I applauded when Putin was asked a question about his friendship for some country's leadership:
"I am not your friend - I am the President of Russia."

otoh - He IS Old School, and that means giving no quarter...

Arsenios

 

[Arsenios]

By all means arrest and detain families that cross the USA border without valid visas or other entry papers but that is no reason to separate children from their parents. There are plenty of ways to keep families together while in detention.

PS: There appears to be increasing opposition from Republican governors, republican state politicians, and republican federal politicians to the President's zero tolerance policy and the consequent child parent separations that is engenders. God willing it will end.

Nobody likes it, including Trump - The question, in the face of bad laws and an opposition party that will not permit passage of good ones, is how to make humane the conditions of the children of those who are gaming the system of bad laws by stampeding the borders and overwhelming our facilities...

It is a great opportunity for great leadership...

Pray for our President and our Country to find a way forward...

As it is, I do not trust the perceptions...

Nobody wants children hurt by separation from parents...

Arsenios

 

[MoreCoffee]

Nobody likes it, including Trump - The question, in the face of bad laws and an opposition party that will not permit passage of good ones, is how to make humane the conditions of the children of those who are gaming the system of bad laws by stampeding the borders and overwhelming our facilities...

It is a great opportunity for great leadership...

Pray for our President and our Country to find a way forward...

As it is, I do not trust the perceptions...

Nobody wants children hurt by separation from parents...

Arsenios

It is not the law that separates children from their parents it is the decision to charge and then imprison the parents that brings about that sad situation and that decision is in the hands of Donald and Jeff. It was at the behest of Jeff Sessions that the new policy (created in April this year) that parents are imprisoned for entering the USA without valid entry paperwork.

 

[MoreCoffee]

The left sees the separation of children at the border as abhorrent but will fight for the right to separate a child from its mother's womb in an abortion. It's sickening if you ask me.

Abortion is abhorrent when entered into simply as a means of birth control. That is not the issue in this thread however. Here the issue is separating an already born child in its infancy or as a toddler or as a young one not yet able to fend for itself from its parents. That is abhorrent and it is being done at the behest of Donald and Jeff both of those men claim to be Christians but their deeds leave one asking "how can this be?"

 

[NewCreation435]

It is not the law that separates children from their parents it is the decision to charge and then imprison the parents that brings about that sad situation and that decision is in the hands of Donald and Jeff. It was at the behest of Jeff Sessions that the new policy (created in April this year) that parents are imprisoned for entering the USA without valid entry paperwork.

because they are breaking the law

 

[MoreCoffee]

because they are breaking the law

So is the person who parks in a no-parking space and the person who jay-walks across a road and the person who crosses the border without valid entry papers. All break a law. Perhaps you and I break a law every now and then. Shall every law breaker be imprisoned and their children taken from them? How would a Christian who advocates such a thing explain it to the Lord on judgement day? Would such a Christian hope that God overlooked it, saw only Jesus' righteousness and forgot the wickedness in the heart that led to such harshness towards others? Do you think heaven is ruled with compassion and love on the thrown or is it all justice without mercy?

 

[Arsenios]

It is not the law that separates children from their parents it is the decision to charge and then imprison the parents that brings about that sad situation and that decision is in the hands of Donald and Jeff. It was at the behest of Jeff Sessions that the new policy (created in April this year) that parents are imprisoned for entering the USA without valid entry paperwork.

That is the perception - It creates a divide between Law and Compassion - Forcing disregard of the Law in order to be compassionate, and thus establishing a basis for attacking the President as being not-compassionate... And it is working against the president so far... Yet it is a ginned up charge which was concealed under previous regimes, but not this one...

So yes, perhaps he needs to take executive action to mediate the problem - Establishing large encampments for families awaiting lengthly ajudication so they can stay together... Then there will be problems with the encampments...

I think you are arguing that we should just take in all who want to come to America? Or at least all family units that show up here?

Temporarily, that would be fine, but give it 20 years and we will be over-run...

We need to export limited government and freedom of mind and enterprise to the world...

THAT challenge we have not done all that well with in South and Central America, nor in Mexico...

We can take more, which is good...

Taking ALL is the enemy of the good...

Perfect is the enemy of good...

These are but the fore-runners of the gaming of our system...

Hundreds of millions, even billions, are waiting in the wings...

Arsenios

 

[MoreCoffee]

Leading US Catholic bishops have escalated their criticism of the Trump administration's immigration policies, calling new asylum-limiting rules "immoral" and rhetorically comparing the crackdown to abortion by saying it is a "a right to life" issue.

One bishop from the US-Mexico border region reportedly suggested "canonical penalties" - which could refer to withholding the sacrament of Communion - for Catholics involved in implementing the Trump policies.

The comments came as the US Conference of Catholic Bishops - the organising body of bishops - gathered for a biannual meeting in Fort Lauderdale. The topics of migration and asylum have long been a focus for the US church; more than 50 per cent of US Catholics under the age of 30 are Latinos.

The statements, including by the Conference's president, Cardinal Daniel DiNardo, archbishop of Galveston-Houston, came two days after Attorney General Jeff Sessions ruled that fear of domestic violence or gang violence aren't clear grounds for seeking asylum in the United States. Mr Sessions said asylum claims have expanded too broadly.

But the bishops said the ruling this week came on top of other Trump White House moves that they oppose. Those include ending a program that protected from deportation the "dreamers," young undocumented immigrants brought to the US as children, and reducing significantly the number of refugees allowed into the United States.

...


(source)

 

[ImaginaryDay2]

So is the person who parks in a no-parking space and the person who jay-walks across a road and the person who crosses the border without valid entry papers. All break a law. Perhaps you and I break a law every now and then. Shall every law breaker be imprisoned and their children taken from them? How would a Christian who advocates such a thing explain it to the Lord on judgement day? Would such a Christian hope that God overlooked it, saw only Jesus' righteousness and forgot the wickedness in the heart that led to such harshness towards others? Do you think heaven is ruled with compassion and love on the thrown or is it all justice without mercy?

There's no comparison here. I don't buy the fact that the class of asylum seekers to whom this law applies comes to the States with no knowledge of what's happening. That's just absurd. One who works in Child Protection (a better comparison) has a job of ensuring that a child/minor is not in a living situation that will endanger him/her. If so, the child can be removed and placed in Foster Care - Government sponsored. Do you really mean to suggest that these children, who are crossing with their parents, are in a safe and secure living situation if left with the parents?

I am fed up with pictures of children in "cages" (a media word), and having the world believe this is their permanent condition, while their poor illegal border-crossing parents are taken away. The new viral picture is of a child crying while their parent is being patted down. CNN was waxing quite eloquent last night with the photographer about taking the picture that "will be the defining moment of this crisis". And it is sad - I don't like to see it any more than anyone else. But you know where else that happens? In child protection cases where a child is potentially being removed from an unsafe living environment. It's traumatic. It's abhorrent that people flood American borders, knowing what's going to happen! You want to be angry. Good. I am, too. Someone in the line-up needs to tell these parents to "Please stop! They're taking your children"! But I guess no-one wants to think that way, because the assumption is these particular adults are just too naive to know.