Why are Some Saved and Not Others?

[Albion]

Is the book of concord inspired by God?

It summarizes the church's understanding of Gods word. As Lamm said, the contents amount to the official POV of the Lutheran Church, which is what matters when it comes to saying that Lutherans are synergistic or Arminian...or not. The Book of Concord opposes both of those. However, there is no accounting for what any individual might think, as you noted when you said that you personally know some Lutherans who think otherwise than as their church teaches.

 

[MennoSota]

Since you persist in repeating that mantra about Lutherans and synergism, the ONLY WAY it can make any sense is if you are speaking of individual persons you know who do not understand their own religion terribly well.

That would probably be more likely in a part of the country where there are many Lutherans who grew up with the faith than in other regions of the country. And of course it is true of many other denominations as well; their members, when quizzed, often express beliefs that are shockingly out of step with what their church actually teaches and believes.

Have you ever talked with people from Luther Seminary in St Paul? You know, the seminary that famously promoted the incredibly liberal and debunked Jesus Seminar...
I'm not one to believe in signs, but it was ironic that a tornado knocked down the spire of a Lutheran Church in Mpls when the ELCA national convention, meeting at that church, voted to accept gay clergy persons as an act of inclusion.
I'm afraid Martin Luther would not recognize much of modern American Lutheranism.

 

[MennoSota]

It summarizes the church's understanding of Gods word. As Lamm said, the contents amount to the official POV of the Lutheran Church, which is what matters when it comes to saying that Lutherans are synergistic or Arminian...or not. The Book of Concord opposes both of those. However, there is no accounting for what any individual might think, as you noted when you said that you personally know some Lutherans who think otherwise than as their church teaches.

It's much like the Mishna and other commentaries that supplant the Bible in Judaism. Or like the Roman catechism that supplants the Bible for most Roman church members.
Perhaps I will sit down for a read to see where the synergism lies. ☺

 

[Albion]

It's much like the Mishna and other commentaries that supplant the Bible in Judaism. Or like the Roman catechism that supplants the Bible for most Roman church members.

I cannot speak for the Mishna, but the others do not supplant anything.

The Book of Concord asserts that the Bible is the final word on doctrine. The BofC merely outlines what the Lutheran church believes the Bible is saying.

 

[Albion]

Have you ever talked with people from Luther Seminary in St Paul? You know, the seminary that famously promoted the incredibly liberal and debunked Jesus Seminar...
I'm not one to believe in signs, but it was ironic that a tornado knocked down the spire of a Lutheran Church in Mpls when the ELCA national convention, meeting at that church, voted to accept gay clergy persons as an act of inclusion.
I'm afraid Martin Luther would not recognize much of modern American Lutheranism.

Not that particular Lutheran body, no, but don't judge all Lutherans or all Lutheran churches or Lutheranism in history on the basis of what the "Evangelical Lutheran Church in America" has to say. Most of us know that it went off the rails some time ago.

 

[MoreCoffee]

Not at all. There might be people who go to a Lutheran church who believe differently than what Lutherans believe, but Lutherans subscribe to the Book of Concord as the true exposition of what the Bible teaches. If they do not hold to what the Book of Concord believes then they by definition are not Lutheran.

Cool,is the book of concord like the infallible portions of the canons a church council approved by the pope - given that you can't be a true Lutheran unless you subscribe to it.

 

[Lamb]

Is the book of concord inspired by God?

No, why would it be? It's an exposition of what the bible teaches.

Would you like to start a thread to go over Lutherans and what they believe?

 

[MoreCoffee]

No, why would it be? It's an exposition of what the bible teaches.

Would you like to start a thread to go over Lutherans and what they believe?

Yes, that would be interesting for me. I'll start it now. I'll name it, God willing, What do Lutherans believe?

 

[MennoSota]

No, why would it be? It's an exposition of what the bible teaches.

Would you like to start a thread to go over Lutherans and what they believe?

Doesn't it fit with why are some saved and some not?

 

[Josiah]

The thread has wandered far away from the topic at hand.....

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Why are BOTH John Calvin and Jakob Arminius WRONG?


Why are HUMAN attempts to Make God Simple and Logical WRONG?


Why are there NOT just two Options: Greek Fate or Free Will?


Why BOTH Arminians and Calvinists must ignore LOTS of Scriptures to "answer" this question?




This video is part of a class lecture and is 32 minutes long (I realize, too long for many) but he comes to the crux of things around minute 15 (listen to the rest for sure). I invite you to listen to the whole 32 minutes as he explains both Calvin and Arminius - the two theories that prevail today in modern Western Christianity.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cAqrIOchEN8



The teacher here is Dr. Joel Biermann from Concordia Seminary in Saint Louis.



- Josiah



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[MennoSota]

The thread has wandered far away from the topic at hand.....








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What are the scriptures that Calvinists must ignore?
What are the scriptures that Arminians must ignore?
What is the reconciliation between the two that a semi-pelagian provides whereby he addresses all verses?

 

[Imalive]

What are the scriptures that Calvinists must ignore?
What are the scriptures that Arminians must ignore?
What is the reconciliation between the two that a semi-pelagian provides whereby he addresses all verses?

none
none

http://jesussaidfollowme.org/calvinismarminianism.htm
I agree w a lot of this but not all. He says you're first born again and then you repent. No you hear, He gives you the gift of faith and repenting and confessing is a work of that faith and then you're born again. It's not your work anyway. He works it in us and it's His faith. He ignores if you believe w your heart and confess w your mouth Jesus Christ is Lord you will be saved.

 

[Josiah]

What are the scriptures that Calvinists must ignore?
What are the scriptures that Arminians must ignore?

See the video in the opening post.

See the several posts in the this thread with references.

What is the reconciliation between the two

There is none. Calvinism and Arminianism are not reconcilable. They are just both wrong.



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[MennoSota]

See the video in the opening post.

See the several posts in the this thread with references.





There is none. Calvinism and Arminianism are not reconcilable. They are just both wrong.



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Spoken like a good semi-pelagian synergist.
How about just list the passages you think Calvinists ignore and the passages you think Arminians ignore. Then tell us both the correct semi-pelagian interpretation based upon the book of Concord.

 

[MoreCoffee]

See the video in the opening post.
See the several posts in the this thread with references.
There is none. Calvinism and Arminianism are not reconcilable. They are just both wrong.

You stated your opinion well.

Plaudits for being succinct.

 

[Imalive]

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[Imalive]

why am i even reading all this nonsense on internet.

 

[MoreCoffee]

why am i even reading all this nonsense on internet.

It's a mystery

 

[Albion]

Spoken like a good semi-pelagian synergist.

You made your point several times before. Then you were corrected. To keep on repeating the claim now in an attempt to be funny really is in bad taste (whether or not a smilie is included).

 

[MennoSota]

You made your point several times before. Then you were corrected. To keep on repeating the claim now in an attempt to be funny really is in bad taste (whether or not a smilie is included).

I was not corrected. The other person merely provided a different opinion, which I deem wrong.