What is sin?

[psalms 91]

I was not asking for an interpretation of the verses. I only wanted to encourage you to notice that there are sins that are mortal and sins that are not mortal.

Still doesnt come down to how you view those verses?

 

[MoreCoffee]

Still doesnt come down to how you view those verses?

If any one sees his brother committing what is not a mortal sin, he will ask, and God will give him life for those whose sin is not mortal. There is sin which is mortal; I do not say that one is to pray for that. All wrongdoing is sin, but there is sin which is not mortal. (1 John 5:16-17)

There is mortal sin and there is sin that is not mortal. It is very clear to see. No interpretation is needed. The words are in the passage.

 

[visionary]

 

[Alithis]

If any one sees his brother committing what is not a mortal sin, he will ask, and God will give him life for those whose sin is not mortal. There is sin which is mortal; I do not say that one is to pray for that. All wrongdoing is sin, but there is sin which is not mortal. (1 John 5:16-17)

Have you considered the above verses?

I have. And he speaks of error ..if we see a person acting in an erronious manner. As paul did with peter in the case that peter did not eat with gentiles .paul even names it as "sin" .. Does it threaten peters salvation..? No it is a sin..an error that needed correction ..and paul gave that correction in no uncertain terms..and more importantly.peter ACCEPTED the admonishment by paul and corrected his ways.
Had peter not done so he would have progressed into rebellion against the holy spirit.so of course he repented of his present error. Such is a sin..a missing of the mark that does not lead to death.for there is no direct unambiguous command that "thou shalt eat with gentiles" that he was transgressing against.
But if he was traveling in the gospel work and sleeping with some strange woman ..that woukd be a direct transgression of what he kniws to be right.it would be a sin unto death ifhe does not repent of it and cease .if he were to die in an unrepentant state..he would perish in his sin. It would be a sin unto death in that it is a direct rebellous violation against the known will of God.not an erronious behavior.
Just as lying is .and stealing and refusing to forgive.and porn which is adultory..and masterbation..which is the outward action purposly fed by the sinful desire to please the insatiable evil desires of the flesh by the sin of uncovering the nakedness of one whom you have no right to uncover.
It also..unrepented of,is a sin unto death.
No part of the text has anything what so ever to do with the old rcc pugatory .and swapping the definitions now is just an admission that the doctrine has always been false.

 

[TurtleHare]

Concerning Justification all sins are to be considered mortal but in the case of sanctification there are mortal and venial sins although they are not defined in the same way that the roman catholic church does.

 

[MoreCoffee]

If any one sees his brother committing what is not a mortal sin, he will ask, and God will give him life for those whose sin is not mortal. There is sin which is mortal; I do not say that one is to pray for that. All wrongdoing is sin, but there is sin which is not mortal. (1 John 5:16-17)

Have you considered the above verses?

I have. And he speaks of error ...

No, he doesn't speak of "error" he writes of "mortal sin".

 

[MoreCoffee]

If any one sees his brother committing what is not a mortal sin, he will ask, and God will give him life for those whose sin is not mortal. There is sin which is mortal; I do not say that one is to pray for that. All wrongdoing is sin, but there is sin which is not mortal. (1 John 5:16-17)

Have you considered the above verses?

Concerning Justification all sins are to be considered mortal but in the case of sanctification there are mortal and venial sins although they are not defined in the same way that the roman catholic church does.

No. What you've written is not right. It is not true that all sins are mortal sins. The passage explicitly says "there is sin which is not mortal"

 

[Alithis]

No, he doesn't speak of "error" he writes of "mortal sin".

and sin is missing the mark ,, so we can miss the mark in ways that do not lead unto death (ambiguous things which require the guidance of the holy Spirit and differ from individual to individual depending on what the lord is dealing with them about)
there is a sin unto one man that is not a sin unto another .. for example Jonah was in error (disobedience ) when he fled and did not go to nineveh ,, but visionary caught the next boat away from nineveh and was not sinning by doing the same thing jonah was doing .. because visionary was not directly told by God to go to nineveh . such sins are not unto death (though jonah's bought him very near to it )but need prayer in regard to the person being corrected and turned away from thier error .

and then- there is missing the mark on things we know darn well we are missing the mark on -better know as SIN -as clearly defined by the 10 commandments .

we dont get to decide if sin based on a direct violation of these absolutes is mortal..or not . the word of God already stated it is so,

for if we yield our members a servant to obey such things .. the result is DEATH .
we dont get to word play with it .we get to repent and be saved or refuse to repent and perish .

 

[Josiah]

and sin is missing the mark

SO, disobedience, sin would be missing the mark, falling short of what is God's will. So, what IS God's will? And ARE YOU 100% fulfilling it - absolutely, perfectly, consistently...... 24/7....... in nature, attitude, throughts, words, deeds...... in what is done and what is left undone/said/felt/thought? 100%..... perfectly..... EXACTLY as and to the same extent as GOD iN HEAVEN? IF so, then there is obedience, there is sinlessness. Otherwise, there is SIN.... DISobedience.... FALLING short..... MISSING the mark

What is the Law?

The Law is the will of God - flowing from His absolute perfection and justice. It is, in essence, that we be as He is - not in terms of essence but character.

Psalm 51:5 "I was sinful at birth"

Genesis 8:21, "Every inclination of man's heart is evil from childhood."

Romans 5:12, "Sin entered the world through one man's sin, and death through sin, and therefore death came to all men for all have sinned."

First John 3:4, "Sin is lawlessness"

Romans 3:12, "There is no one who does good, not even one."

Mark 10:18, "There is none who is good but God exclusively."

First John 1:10, "If we claim we have no sin, we make God a liar and His word is not in us."




What does the Law mandate?

Essentially, that our character be identical to His.


Matthew 5:48, "You must be perfect, just as your Father in heaven is perfect."

1 Peter 1:16, "You must be holy even as God in heaven is holy."

John 15:12, "Love all people just as I (Jesus) first loved you."

Ephesians 4:32, "forgiving one another, just as God in Christ first forgave you."

First John 2:6, "Whoever claims to live in him must live as Jesus did."

Philippians 2:5, "You must have the same attitude that Christ did."



The word literally means "to miss the mark." In ancient Greece, if an archer missed the target, the therefore "sinned" because he missed the mark, missed the target. The Bible says "ALL fall short." IF you have absolutely, perfectly, divinely, 24/7 "hit" all the targets above, then you are obedient and free of sin. Otherwise...... Well, the Bible would be correct and not lying when it says that "NO ONE is righteous, no, not even one." "For ALL fall short." "NO ONE is good." "If you claim to have no sin (you hit the mark), then you lie and call God a liar."




.

- Josiah

 

[Alithis]

Josiah.. Do you have children?
Who knows.
But those who do will know that a father does not tell his children to do 100 things at the same time..
Thus we need only
concern ourselves with the one thing the holy spirit is speaking to us about presently.
A father does not say ..clean your room.mow the lawn,paint thebathroom go get your brother from the bus stop and do it all this instant.And then punish you for not being able to. He does not exasperate his children.
Obedience deals with the living relationship. Between us and our God.his spirit guides us into all truth and what the lord is presently speaking to us about, he expects us to be obedient in. And when we are obedient in the one thing he presently requires of us..then we are "obedient" and in christ are perfect in that obedience.

Then, he will deal with the next thing..
-disobedience is when we refuse to listen or do what he is speaking to us about and it begins with the gospel instruction to repent,be baptised and recieve the Holy Ghost .
You will never discredit nor seperate obedience from rightousness.
Peter tells us that we are sanctified..set apart..for "obedience" . to be sanctified is to be set apart from others for a specific purpose.. Peter states,we are set apart for the purpose of obedience.
Thus if we do not walk in obedience which we are called to and enabeld to and empowered to do that which He!..not us, has set us apart to do.then we are in rebellion which is sin.

What excuse then do we have for not doing that which God himself has chosen us and set us apart to do.. ? None- for He Has done it.
Obedience -It is inescapabable and wonderous .

 

[Lamb]

SO, disobedience, sin would be missing the mark, falling short of what is God's will. So, what IS God's will? And ARE YOU 100% fulfilling it - absolutely, perfectly, consistently...... 24/7....... in nature, attitude, throughts, words, deeds...... in what is done and what is left undone/said/felt/thought? 100%..... perfectly..... EXACTLY as and to the same extent as GOD iN HEAVEN? IF so, then there is obedience, there is sinlessness. Otherwise, there is SIN.... DISobedience.... FALLING short..... MISSING the mark







- Josiah

What is God's will? That we BELIEVE and trust in the Savior who doesn't miss the mark! That we know our sins are forgiven. That we are His children!

 

[Lamb]

Josiah.. Do you have children?
Who knows.
But those who do will know that a father does not tell his children to do 100 things at the same time..
Thus we need only
concern ourselves with the one thing the holy spirit is speaking to us about presently.
A father does not say ..clean your room.mow the lawn,paint thebathroom go get your brother from the bus stop and do it all this instant.And then punish you for not being able to. He does not exasperate his children.
Obedience deals with the living relationship. Between us and our God.his spirit guides us into all truth and what the lord is presently speaking to us about, he expects us to be obedient in. And when we are obedient in the one thing he presently requires of us..then we are "obedient" and in christ are perfect in that obedience.

Then, he will deal with the next thing..
-disobedience is when we refuse to listen or do what he is speaking to us about and it begins with the gospel instruction to repent,be baptised and recieve the Holy Ghost .
You will never discredit nor seperate obedience from rightousness.
Peter tells us that we are sanctified..set apart..for "obedience" . to be sanctified is to be set apart from others for a specific purpose.. Peter states,we are set apart for the purpose of obedience.
Thus if we do not walk in obedience which we are called to and enabeld to and empowered to do that which He!..not us, has set us apart to do.then we are in rebellion which is sin.

What excuse then do we have for not doing that which God himself has chosen us and set us apart to do.. ? None- for He Has done it.
Obedience -It is inescapabable and wonderous .

Our obedience doesn't MAKE us his children.

 

[Alithis]

Our obedience doesn't MAKE us his children.

And because we are his children we are obedient.

As opposed to being the children of disobedience..who are not His children.

 

[psalms 91]

Yes obedience is one of the commandments of Christ

 

[Josiah]

And because we are his children we are obedient.

Document that with the full names and location of at least 10 living persons (just ten!) who are obedient to all God has commanded..... I'm not asking you to prove it for ALL His children (or even you!) but just 10 living persons, just 10. There are at least 613 commandments just in the OT, so you might want to start with those 613 - that this 10 obey them (perfectly, absolutely, always).... Then look to the NT, for example:



Matthew 5:48, "You must be perfect, just as your Father in heaven is perfect."

1 Peter 1:16, "You must be holy even as God in heaven is holy."

John 15:12, "Love all people just as I (Jesus) first loved you."

First John 2:6, "Whoever claims to live in him must live as Jesus did."

Matthew 28:18, "Go and make disciples of all people."

Philippians 2:5, "You must have the same attitude that Christ did."


After you document that these 10 have perfectly, divinely KEPT all 613 commandments in the OT, then that they are PERFECT just as and to the same extend that God is..... HOLY just as and to the same extent that God is.... LOVING to all to the same extent as Christ on the Cross.... that they LIVE exactly as Chrsit did.... that they have the SAME attitude as Christ had..... that they have made disciples of all people.....


I'm not asking that you document your point for "ALL GOD'S CHILDREN" (or even yourself) but for at least 10 living persons (just ten). Since I suspect such people would really stand out, that should be easy for you to do.





Of course, if you do - you'll prove the Bible is wrong when it says, "NO ONE is righteous, no, not even one." "NO ONE is good but God exclusively." "ALL fall short of the mark." "If any claims to be without sin, he lies and deceives himself."




Thank you.



- Josiah




.

 

[Alithis]

what on earth are you on about ..??613 commandments ??

we have already clarified Jesus is NOT speaking of those when he says if you love ME you will keep my commandments, in the same text he also says keep my sayings ..he is not talking about the mosaic law
he is speaking of relationship .. he is saying .if you love me you will do what i tell you to do ..you wil "obey me " the person who is speaking being jesus .
he places HIS spirit in us and HE (the holy Spirit) guide us into all truth teaching us .. we are to listen to him and do what he says
..it is NOTHING to do with some 6oo laws .

Jesus said" my sheep hear my voice and i know them and they follow me ... " to hear ,to know ,to follow JESUS the living word of GOD.. to walk and talk with the person to know our king and lord and savior .to be reconciled to the father there is no law in any of this .
i dont name your 10 because which 10 shall i choose who are clean and without sin out of millions/ for who are to to accuse the saints who are washed in the blood of the lamb and have been sanctified for obedience.. ,rescued out of the kingdom or darkness and bought into the kingdom of his son whom he loves .

so we are to live as those who are in his kingdom ,not as those who follow after wickedness .
the question has always remained and admittedly it goads .. but since we are in christ ,if we ARE in christ ,(having been BURIED with him in his death that we might be raised up again in his resurrection as a NEW creation) and thus FREE from the power and control of sin .. Then why continue to walk in it as though it is still our master ?

there is no reason to do so bar one .. we ourselves desire to because we love the pleasures of the flesh MORE than we love the lord JEsus .and are thus being disobedient to the Good news of JESUS

if that be the case and i can't say ,but each person knows -Then REPENT

 

[TurtleHare]

Denying that you don't sin seems to be lying to the world don't ya think?

 

[Alithis]

Denying that you don't sin seems to be lying to the world don't ya think?

so Jesus has not ,does not, cannot set you free..??is that what your saying?

i mean ,as i have stated elsewhere .,.make up your mind !..either agree with his promise and beleive he is able to do as he has said .. or stop pretending to be a beleiver .

 

[psalms 91]

Yup we all sin

 

[Alithis]

Yup we all sin

What specific sin do you speak of and why do you keep doing it?

Clarify




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