Did Christ die for them that are perishing ?

[brightfame52]

It made them Righteous or Justified !

Many today in false religion do deny that Christ's Death alone, in and of itself, for those He died in behalf of, that it constituted them Righteous or Justified. However that is exactly what Rom 5:19 teaches Rom 5:19

19 For as by one man's disobedience many were made sinners, so by the obedience of one shall many be made righteous.

The One here in the second section is Jesus Christ, and the obedience is His Death as Per Phil 2:8

8 And being found in fashion as a man, he humbled himself, and became obedient unto death, even the death of the cross.

His Obedience is His Death of the Cross. Now pay attention to its sure effects, it made many Righteous, which is to be Justified. The word Justified in scripture : The greek word dikaioo:


to render righteous or such he ought to be

2) to show, exhibit, evince, one to be righteous, such as he is and wishes himself to be considered

So His Death, His Obedience will show many to be made Righteous.

The word made in Rom 5:19 is the word kathistēmi:

to set, place, put

a) to set one over a thing (in charge of it)

b) to appoint one to administer an office

c) to set down as, constitute, to declare, show to be

d) to constitute, to render, make, cause to be

e) to conduct or bring to a certain place

f) to show or exhibit one's self

1) come forward as


So, this is an accomplishment of the Death of Chris alone, for the Many He died for, all of them.

To deny this effect and result of the Sole Death of Christ is denying Christ, its against Christ !

Everyone Christ died for is declared Righteous, which also means they have Christ's Righteousness Imputed to them.

All for whom He died have His Complete Obedience as The Son of God in the flesh charged to their account, just as their sins and demerit were charged to His Account. 14

 

[brightfame52]

It saves from the power of sin.

One of the accomplishments of the Death of Christ for all whom He died, is that He saves them from the power of sin. To be saved from the power of sin is to be also saved from unbelief, yes unbelief in one is because the power of sin is reigning in them. They are while in unbelief under the power of darkness Col 1:13

Who hath delivered us from the power of darkness, and hath translated us into the kingdom of his dear Son:

Or from the domain or authority of darkness. As such are minds are blinded from believing the Gospel 2 Cor 4:3-4

3 But if our gospel be hid, it is hid to them that are lost:

4 In whom the god of this world hath blinded the minds of them which believe not, lest the light of the glorious gospel of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine unto them.

That word for blindness actually means to darken the mind, which is part of the power of darkness. Before we can believe we must be delivered from this power and Christ's Death accomplishes that, Redemption.14

 

[BruceLeiter]

It made them Righteous or Justified !

Many today in false religion do deny that Christ's Death alone, in and of itself, for those He died in behalf of, that it constituted them Righteous or Justified. However that is exactly what Rom 5:19 teaches Rom 5:19

19 For as by one man's disobedience many were made sinners, so by the obedience of one shall many be made righteous.

The One here in the second section is Jesus Christ, and the obedience is His Death as Per Phil 2:8

8 And being found in fashion as a man, he humbled himself, and became obedient unto death, even the death of the cross.

His Obedience is His Death of the Cross. Now pay attention to its sure effects, it made many Righteous, which is to be Justified. The word Justified in scripture : The greek word dikaioo:


to render righteous or such he ought to be

2) to show, exhibit, evince, one to be righteous, such as he is and wishes himself to be considered

So His Death, His Obedience will show many to be made Righteous.

The word made in Rom 5:19 is the word kathistēmi:

to set, place, put

a) to set one over a thing (in charge of it)

b) to appoint one to administer an office

c) to set down as, constitute, to declare, show to be

d) to constitute, to render, make, cause to be

e) to conduct or bring to a certain place

f) to show or exhibit one's self

1) come forward as


So, this is an accomplishment of the Death of Chris alone, for the Many He died for, all of them.

To deny this effect and result of the Sole Death of Christ is denying Christ, its against Christ !

Everyone Christ died for is declared Righteous, which also means they have Christ's Righteousness Imputed to them.

All for whom He died have His Complete Obedience as The Son of God in the flesh charged to their account, just as their sins and demerit were charged to His Account. 14

Your first sentence threw me off, @brightfame52. What are you denying and what are you saying? You need to follow Paul's whole argument in this chapter to get his full meaning. Also, you keep saying things about all those "for whom Christ died." Are you saying that Christ died for everyone and that therefore all people are declared righteous and justified? You might just answer this question yes or no to be clear.

 

[brightfame52]

Your first sentence threw me off, @brightfame52. What are you denying and what are you saying? You need to follow Paul's whole argument in this chapter to get his full meaning. Also, you keep saying things about all those "for whom Christ died." Are you saying that Christ died for everyone and that therefore all people are declared righteous and justified? You might just answer this question yes or no to be clear.

I can tell you haven't paid a bit of attention to my threads and posts asking questions like that.

 

[BruceLeiter]

I can tell you haven't paid a bit of attention to my threads and posts asking questions like that.

I don't have time to read all the posts in all the threads in the three forums I'm in, because God has also given me a ministry writing books, @brightfame52. I haven't seen your "yes" or "no."

 

[brightfame52]

Saved from God's Wrath !

1 Jn 2:2

2 And he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world.

The whole world [jew and gentile people] here is a propitiated world, and as such, they have been saved from God's Wrath through Christ's Blood Rom 5:9

9 Much more then, being now justified by his blood, we shall be saved from wrath through him.

Rom 3:25

25 Whom God hath set forth to be a propitiation through faith in his blood, to declare his righteousness for the remission of sins that are past, through the forbearance of God;

All who Christ's Blood propitiated God's wrath for or in behalf of, are given Faith in His Blood.

His Blood has saved them from wrath. It has delivered them from going down into the pit Zech 9:11

As for thee also, by the blood of thy covenant I have sent forth thy prisoners out of the pit wherein is no water.

 

[brightfame52]

I don't have time to read all the posts in all the threads in the three forums I'm in, because God has also given me a ministry writing books, @brightfame52. I haven't seen your "yes" or "no."

Then I dont have time to answer your questions, which things have already been discussed in my posts.

 

[BruceLeiter]

Then I dont have time to answer your questions, which things have already been discussed in my posts.

Okay.

 

[brightfame52]

Okay.

okay

 

[brightfame52]

Christ's Healing Stripes !

1 Peter 2:24

24 Who his own self bare our sins in his own body on the tree, that we, being dead to sins, should live unto righteousness: by whose stripes ye were healed.

Christ's Healing stripes results in those He died for, those whose sins He bear in His own Body on the tree, results in them living unto righteousness, which is to live by Faith. 14

 

[brightfame52]

Turns us into a Kingdom or Priests.

Christ's death alone is seen to effect and to save experimentally all for whom He Loved and died for here Rev 1:5-6

5 And from Jesus Christ, who is the faithful witness, and the first begotten of the dead, and the prince of the kings of the earth. Unto him that loved us, and washed us from our sins in his own blood,

6 And hath made us kings and priests unto God and his Father; to him be glory and dominion for ever and ever. Amen.

Now it is stated that through or by His Love and Blood [Death] that those he died for are experimentally made Kings and Priests. Notice the same Blessed Truth here Rev 5:9-10

9 And they sung a new song, saying, Thou art worthy to take the book, and to open the seals thereof: for thou wast slain, and hast redeemed us to God by thy blood out of every kindred, and tongue, and people, and nation;

10 And hast made us unto our God kings and priests: and we shall reign on the earth.

By His Blood or Death they were made Kings and Priests.

Now some translate it Rev 1:6

6 and he made us to be a kingdom, to be priests unto his God and Father; to him be the glory and the dominion for ever and ever. Amen.ASV


6 And formed us into a kingdom (a royal race), priests to His God and Father—to Him be the glory and the power and the majesty and the dominion throughout the ages and forever and ever. Amen (so be it).AMP

Which is why Peter says this 1 Peter 2:9

9 But ye are a chosen generation, a royal priesthood, an holy nation, a peculiar people; that ye should shew forth the praises of him who hath called you out of darkness into his marvellous light;

Nevertheless,this status was said to be effected solely by the Blood of Christ.

They were made said Vs 6

and hath made us kings and priests unto God and His Father, to Him be glory and dominion for ever and ever. Amen.

This word made both here and in Rev 5:10 is the greek word poieō:

1) to make

a) with the names of things made, to produce, construct, form, fashion, etc.

b) to be the authors of, the cause

c) to make ready, to prepare

d) to produce, bear, shoot forth

e) to acquire, to provide a thing for one's self

f) to make a thing out of something

g) to (make i.e.) render one anything

1) to (make i.e.) constitute or appoint one anything, to appoint or ordain one that

2) to (make i.e.) declare one anything

h) to put one forth, to lead him out

i) to make one do something

1) cause one to

j) to be the authors of a thing (to cause, bring about)

2) to do

a) to act rightly, do well

1) to carry out, to execute

b) to do a thing unto one

1) to do to one

c) with designation of time: to pass, spend

d) to celebrate, keep

1) to make ready, and so at the same time to institute, the celebration of the passover

e) to perform: to a promise

His Blood therefore made them to be Priests unto God or caused them to be.

What this means is that His Blood or Death produces them to live a devoted, consecrated life of Christian Service to God, as it was typed out by the OT Priests did in Israel.

We can say again, that as a result of His Redemptive Death, those He died for were caused to become a Kingdom of Priests, and to reign with Him in this Life spiritually Rom 5:17

17 For if by one man's offence death reigned by one; much more they which receive abundance of grace and of the gift of righteousness shall reign in life by one, Jesus Christ )

This had nothing to do with what they did themselves, to say so is detracting from the Work of Christ's Blood, against the scripture witness of His Saving Death. Those He Loved and died for shall be made a Priest unto God, period !

 

[brightfame52]

Christ's Healing Stripes ! 2

1 Pet 2:24-25

24 Who his own self bare our sins in his own body on the tree, that we, being dead to sins, should live unto righteousness: by whose stripes ye were healed.

25 For ye were as sheep going astray; but are now returned unto the Shepherd and Bishop of your souls.


Christ's stripes heals all those for whom He died, who took stripes in behalf of, with the healing results being their returning back to God, meaning their actual conversion to God in Faith and Repentance.

That's what Vs 25 tells us to be the effects of having Christ die for us. His stripes are responsible for our return to God. The word returned is the greek word verb epistrephó and means:


I turn (back) to (towards), (b) intrans: I turn (back) (to [towards]); I come to myself.

Its like the idea of the prodigal son when it reads of him Lk 15:17-18

17 And when he came to himself, he said, How many hired servants of my father's have bread enough and to spare, and I perish with hunger!

18 I will arise and go[returning] to my father, and will say unto him, Father, I have sinned against heaven, and before thee,

Also the word is used in the aroist indicative passive, which means e subject [person] is being returned or turned . Remember Jer 31:18

I have surely heard Ephraim bemoaning himself thus; Thou hast chastised me, and I was chastised, as a bullock unaccustomed to the yoke: turn thou me, and I shall be turned; for thou art the Lord my God.

That word turn and turned here is the Hebrew word shuwb and means:

to return, turn back

a) (Qal)

1) to turn back, return

a) to turn back

b) to return, come or go back

c) to return unto, go back, come back

d) of dying

e) of human relations (fig)

f) of spiritual relations (fig)

1) to turn back (from God), apostatise

2) to turn away (of God)

3) to turn back (to God), repent

4) turn back (from evil)

And that is what Christ's stripes/death effects for all whom He bare stripes in behalf of. It grants them conversion repentance to God. Each one of them during their life time will do as the prodigal did Lk 15:17-19

17 And when he came to himself, he said, How many hired servants of my father's have bread enough and to spare, and I perish with hunger!

18 I will arise and go to my father, and will say unto him, Father, I have sinned against heaven, and before thee,

19 And am no more worthy to be called thy son: make me as one of thy hired servants.

You see the prodigal son had an application of healing upon him. This parable was to teach God's People the Love of the Father in bringing His gone astray children back to Himself by the Work of Christ on the Cross. The prodigal did not heal himself, neither do those Christ died for, they were healed by His Stripes, which is His Death. 14

 

[BruceLeiter]

Amen, @brightfame52.

 

[brightfame52]

1 Jn 4:9 That we might live through him.

1 Jn 4:9-10

9 In this was manifested the love of God toward us, because that God sent his only begotten Son into the world, that we might live through him.

10 Herein is love, not that we loved God, but that he loved us, and sent his Son to be the propitiation for our sins.


Christ's Coming as having been sent by God the Father, it had purpose behind it, and that was that those who are believing might Live. In fact believing is living, and believing was the end to which He sent Christ to accomplish.

By His coming and putting away our sins, making full satisfaction for them to God's Law and Justice, we now are given the privilege [through New Birth] to live Spiritually unto God.

Christ's death for all whom He died ensures a deliverance for them from spiritual death, and the granting of Spiritual Life, to Live unto God. Paul taught the same thing here 2 Cor 5:14-15

14 For the love of Christ constraineth us; because we thus judge, that if one died for all, then were all dead:

15 And that he died for all, that they which live should not henceforth live unto themselves, but unto him which died for them, and rose again.

Simply put, if any never receive New Spiritual Life [which is Eternal Life] to live unto God, then Christ did not die for them., nor were they Loved of Him, nor the Father, nor the Spirit. For any to remain in Spiritual death, to remain dead in trespasses and sins without being quickened Eph 2:4-5, then its safe to say Christ did not die for that one. 14

 

[brightfame52]

Amen, @brightfame52.

What you amening about ?

 

[BruceLeiter]

What you amening about ?

I'm amening about your post just above my amen, @brightfame52.

 

[fuddy]

Bruce - if you read all of brightflame's posts, you will understand that he is proclaiming that Jesus allowed himself to be crucified as a sacrifice for SOME people, not ALL people... that God indeed hates most people, and desires their eternal destruction in hell, as salvation is only made accessible to the Elect, and them exclusively. Brightflame states that this dispensation is by His sovereign will, and actually enhances and confirms Gods holy righteousness.

If you doubt my synopsis of his posts, I suggest you take a bit of time to read them for yourself.

To me, it is an absolutely hideous doctrine, but to each their own...

 

[brightfame52]

His Death actually redeems to God !

Rev 5:9

9 And they sung a new song, saying, Thou art worthy to take the book, and to open the seals thereof: for thou wast slain[Died], and hast redeemed us to God by thy blood out of every kindred, and tongue, and people, and nation;

Yes, that was the result and effect of His being slain. Remember Peter said Acts 2:23

Him, being delivered by the determinate counsel and foreknowledge of God, ye have taken, and by wicked hands have crucified and slain:

Jesus said Lk 9:21-22

21 And he straitly charged them, and commanded them to tell no man that thing;

22 Saying, The Son of man must suffer many things, and be rejected of the elders and chief priests and scribes, and be slain, and be raised the third day.

And so it is those He was slain in behalf of shall praise Him here Rev 5:9

9 And they sung a new song, saying, Thou art worthy to take the book, and to open the seals thereof: for thou wast slain, and hast redeemed us to God by thy blood out of every kindred, and tongue, and people, and nation;

10 And hast made us unto our God kings and priests: and we shall reign on the earth.

This His redemptive death made them believers. How so ? By making them into a Kingdom of Priests unto God, for in order to do that, we must be made believers. For our priesthood duties consist of 1 Pet 2:9

9 But ye are a chosen generation, a royal priesthood, an holy nation, a peculiar people; that ye should shew forth the praises of him who hath called you out of darkness into his marvellous light;

This we cannot do in unbelief dead in sin. So Christ's Redemptive death must do all to effect that and it did, hence why we read Rev 5:9-10 ! 14

 

[brightfame52]

I'm amening about your post just above my amen, @brightfame52.

What about it ? What specific points you agree with ?

 

[BruceLeiter]

Bruce - if you read all of brightflame's posts, you will understand that he is proclaiming that Jesus allowed himself to be crucified as a sacrifice for SOME people, not ALL people... that God indeed hates most people, and desires their eternal destruction in hell, as salvation is only made accessible to the Elect, and them exclusively. Brightflame states that this dispensation is by His sovereign will, and actually enhances and confirms Gods holy righteousness.

If you doubt my synopsis of his posts, I suggest you take a bit of time to read them for yourself.

To me, it is an absolutely hideous doctrine, but to each their own...

@fuddy, thank you for your post. Are you really sure that @brightfame52 thinks that "God indeed hates most people"? I think that according to the Bible, God has a universal love for his human creatures because he made us as well as a special love for believers whom he loved and chose before creation (Romans 8:28-30). He doesn't hate humans but grieves for their rebellion against him and hates their actions but not them. I agree with him that only the elect will be saved because that's what "elect" means that God chose believers before creation (Ephesians 1:3-6). God has never relinquished his control over his creation; Satan and humans are part of his plans, but he is not responsible for evil. The reason is that evil comes from Satan, humans' sinful natures, and the tempting world. And humans are fully responsible to end their rebellion.

Rom 8:28 And we know that for those who love God all things work together for good, for those who are called according to his purpose.
Rom 8:29 For those whom he foreknew he also predestined to be conformed to the image of his Son, in order that he might be the firstborn among many brothers.
Rom 8:30 And those whom he predestined he also called, and those whom he called he also justified, and those whom he justified he also glorified.

Eph 1:3 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who has blessed us in Christ with every spiritual blessing in the heavenly places,
Eph 1:4 even as he chose us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and blameless before him. In love
Eph 1:5 he predestined us for adoption to himself as sons through Jesus Christ, according to the purpose of his will,
Eph 1:6 to the praise of his glorious grace, with which he has blessed us in the Beloved.