Infant Baptism

[Lamb]

What do you do with Romans 10:9-10? I dont know any babies who can do this for salvation

Why is it important to you to know the response when it Is God who knows the heart? We are saved by grace through faith and faith grasps onto the forgiveness won at the cross. The response is just that.. a confession of faith that is already there. We are saved because we have a Savior not because of anything we do for we are not the Savior.

Babies who are baptized are taught the faith and their confession when they make it is an affirmation of faith that was given to them by His Word in the waters.

 

[psalms 91]

I agree that we do nothing it is God but I also read and see that we do have to do something to recieve it, it isnt just everyone is saved no matter what they do or believe which is what you are very close to professing

 

[Full O Beans]

Hundreds have been baptised by the faithful in my parish church. We baptise them as a community. The deacon or the priest officiates at the baptism. We all participate in prayer and in hearing the confession of faith offered by the catechumens and their sponsors, godparents, and parents. But I think you're asking how many people have I dunked into a pool of water. The answer to that is none. I am not a heretic.

Maybe someday.

 

[Full O Beans]

Faith comes by God's Word and in baptism it's God's Word with the water (Ephesians 5:26).

That's just made up.

 

[Full O Beans]

The Beroeans were Jews I am not aiming to change my faith to Judaism. If you have only a phone to use then you can give the chapter and verse, no need to quote.

So sorry you don't want to be wise as they.

 

[Full O Beans]

So you believe in TWO gospels for salvation instead of one!

I believe in the biblical Gospel that we are all saved in the same way, by grace through faith.

God's Word gives us faith and God's Word is in the waters of baptism. Hence, God gives babies faith in the waters of baptism. But not only in baptism, God can give faith while they are in the womb if parents go to church and there is scripture because babies can hear in the womb. God's Word does not return to Him empty.

Scripture does not have 2 gospels as you claim.

There is only one gospel and Jesus delineated it perfectly in John 3, where He never mentioned baptism.

 

[Full O Beans]

What do you do with Romans 10:9-10? I dont know any babies who can do this for salvation

I guess they believe in 2 different gospel messages. Maybe even 3.

 

[Full O Beans]

Babies who are baptized are taught the faith and their confession when they make it is an affirmation of faith that was given to them by His Word in the waters.

Where does God teach you that?

 

[MoreCoffee]

When you know God and His word, you know that He doesn't teach us to perform baptisms on unaware infants.

Where does holy scripture say that? It's just your opinion. It has no special value to anybody but you and those unfortunates who believe that same errors.The truth is far more liberating than your opinions. Baptism saves God's people and their age doesn't make any difference. Young and old, infant and great great grand parent all receive the same gift by the same means as a grace from God when they receive baptism. Nobody needs to pass a theology exam to receive it, nobody is proving a thing about how wonderful they are or how clever they were by accepting this or that doctrine from this or that denomination. Baptism is all about God's grace. It is all about what Jesus did FOR his people not what they do FOR him. I posted Romans 6:1-14 earlier, take the time to read it with care and see for yourself that baptism is about dying and rising by the power of God and not by anything you've done. As saint Paul says: For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: Not of works, lest any man should boast. (Ephesians 2:8-9) There's no room for boasting about your faith when you receive baptism.

The command is to believers. Babies are not believers, nor can they decide to obey God in the command. It has just become a futile exercise in religion...something that Jesus despises, actually.

Sent from my LG-D852 using Tapatalk

 

[Josiah]

I agree that we do nothing it is God but I also read and see that we do have to do something to recieve it, it isnt just everyone is saved no matter what they do or believe which is what you are very close to professing

I don't agree with you (Scripture says that faith is "the gift of God") but that's a whole other topic for a different day and thread...

The issue here is Mr. Thomas Muenzer's invention in the 16th Century of anti-paedobaptism, dogmatically insisting that the Bible states we are forbidden to baptize those under the age of X and thus are to witthold it from those under that age, this overturning the view from 69 AD at the very latest, the universal view of every Christian for some 1,500 years, that we are not forbidden in Scripture from baptizing those who have not yet celebrated "X" number of birthdays since their birth.

Some insist that Scripture states that a person must REPENT before we are permitted to allow baptism - but they can't seem to find any verse that remotely says that.
Some insist that Scripture states that a person must BELIEVE before we are permitted to allow baptism - but they can't seem to find any verse that remotely says that.
Some insist that Scripture states that a person must CONSENT to this before we are permitted to allow baptism - but they can't seem to find any verse that remotely says that.

Then some insist that we aren't to follow the teaching of Scripture but rather the examples that happened to be recorded in Scripture - problem is, they can't show that only those over the age of X were baptized and those under that age were forbidden (and of course, they then go on to document that they don't believe or apply their own rubric - that we can only do what is exampled in Scripture).


This German layman in the 16th Century invented this new tradition, one now followed by a very small percentage of Christians (but common in American "Evangelicalism" today). We're discussing his protest, his denial of the old (from at last 69 AD at the latest) universal practice of NOT withholding it from those under the age of X.


Thank you, Bill


Pax



- Josiah

 

[MoreCoffee]

What do you do with Romans 10:9-10? I don't know any babies who can do this for salvation

I know plenty of infants who confess the Lord Jesus Christ with their mouth and believe it in their heart and they make it obvious and clear. It takes a little patience to recognise it. But Jesus said that "I assure you that whoever does not receive the Kingdom of God like a child will never enter it." (Mark 10:15). Jesus was pretty wise I think. If he saw faith in a little child why don't you?

 

[MoreCoffee]

So sorry you don't want to be wise as they.

Most of them were so "wise" that they remained Jews after saint Paul left. There's no record of any apostolic church in that town. Long afterwards a a church was founded there but no apostolic letter to them was preserved. The Thessalonians on the other hand whose Jewish people were criticised did come to faith and saint Paul wrote two letters to the Thessalonians which are preserved in the holy scriptures. Jesus told a parable that seems to fit the two towns it goes like this: 'What is your opinion? A man had two sons. He went and said to the first, "My boy, go and work in the vineyard today." He answered, "I will not go," but afterwards thought better of it and went. The man then went and said the same thing to the second who answered, "Certainly, sir," but did not go. Which of the two did the father's will?' They said, 'The first.' Jesus said to them, 'In truth I tell you, tax collectors and prostitutes are making their way into the kingdom of God before you. For John came to you, showing the way of uprightness, but you did not believe him, and yet the tax collectors and prostitutes did. Even after seeing that, you refused to think better of it and believe in him." (Matthew 21:28-32)

It is better to be found doing the works of God than merely saying fair words about them but not doing them.

 

[Full O Beans]

I know plenty of infants who confess the Lord Jesus Christ with their mouth and believe it in their heart and they make it obvious and clear. It takes a little patience to recognise it. But Jesus said that "I assure you that whoever does not receive the Kingdom of God like a child will never enter it." (Mark 10:15). Jesus was pretty wise I think. If he saw faith in a little child why don't you?

Babies cannot confess belief in Jesus nor understand they are sinners in need of saving. It is a good thing that little children, toddlers, learn about Jesus and learn to love Him at an early age, but the decision to receive Him as Saviour and to repent comes at a later age. Rarely does a very young child under 5 or 6 have the revelation about their sinful state and so the need for a Saviour. We are commissioned by God to lead the young to Christ so that they will receive salvation and repent of their sins at an early age.

What Jesus said there is in reference to the easy trust that a child has for his caring parents. You can tell a 2-year-old to jump of the counter to your waiting arms and he will do it willingly and with glee. That's the kind of trust or faith that Jesus is talking about.

 

[Alithis]

Babies cannot confess belief in Jesus nor understand they are sinners in need of saving. It is a good thing that little children, toddlers, learn about Jesus and learn to love Him at an early age, but the decision to receive Him as Saviour and to repent comes at a later age. Rarely does a very young child under 5 or 6 have the revelation about their sinful state and so the need for a Saviour. We are commissioned by God to lead the young to Christ so that they will receive salvation and repent of their sins at an early age.

What Jesus said there is in reference to the easy trust that a child has for his caring parents. You can tell a 2-year-old to jump of the counter to your waiting arms and he will do it willingly and with glee. That's the kind of trust or faith that Jesus is talking about.

yes the twister does this- he twisted it away from "babies" and up to the age of children old enough to confess thier faith .

no one has any problem baptising (sprinkling is not baptism ) a child who can profess thier own faith .
but a "baby" cannot do so .

 

[psalms 91]

I know plenty of infants who confess the Lord Jesus Christ with their mouth and believe it in their heart and they make it obvious and clear. It takes a little patience to recognise it. But Jesus said that "I assure you that whoever does not receive the Kingdom of God like a child will never enter it." (Mark 10:15). Jesus was pretty wise I think. If he saw faith in a little child why don't you?

So now babies can talk I think you keep moving the goalposts

 

[MoreCoffee]

So now babies can talk I think you keep moving the goal posts

Jesus said that "I assure you that whoever does not receive the Kingdom of God like a child will never enter it." (Mark 10:15). Evidently the Lord has confidence in infants and their ability to enter the kingdom of God as well as serve as a model for the faithful.

 

[psalms 91]

Jesus said that "I assure you that whoever does not receive the Kingdom of God like a child will never enter it." (Mark 10:15). Evidently the Lord has confidence in infants and their ability to enter the kingdom of God as well as serve as a model for the faithful.

Unless He meant the children that sat on His lap perhaps. Dont see babies in that passage anywhere

 

[Full O Beans]

Jesus said that "I assure you that whoever does not receive the Kingdom of God like a child will never enter it." (Mark 10:15). Evidently the Lord has confidence in infants and their ability to enter the kingdom of God as well as serve as a model for the faithful.

You assign meaning there that is not there. "Like a child" is in reference to the simple trust a child has for his parents. That is the simple trust God wants to see in people who put their faith in Jesus. Babies are exempt because they cannot appreciate that they are sinners who need saving. If parents are doing their job in teaching the word of God to them from the cradle, it is highly likely that the child will come to receive Jesus as Saviour at the point in which they finally have the understanding that they are sinners and need Him.

 

[Alithis]

yup he moved the goal posts ..typical

josiah will be most upset

 

[Josiah]

yup he moved the goal posts ..typical

josiah will be most upset

Who moved what goal post? Are you speaking of Mr. Thomas Muenzer, who in the 16th Century inventing the new practice of withholding baptism from those under the age of X?



The sole issue here (and the only one I've thus discussed) is Mr. Thomas Muenzer's invention in the 16th Century of anti-paedobaptism, dogmatically insisting that the Bible states we are forbidden to baptize those under the age of X and thus are to withhold it from those under that age, this overturning the view from 69 AD at the very latest, the universal view of every Christian for some 1,500 years, that we are not forbidden in Scripture from baptizing those who have not yet celebrated "X" number of birthdays since their birth.

Some insist that Scripture states that a person must REPENT before we are permitted to allow baptism - but they can't seem to find any verse that remotely says that.
Some insist that Scripture states that a person must BELIEVE before we are permitted to allow baptism - but they can't seem to find any verse that remotely says that.
Some insist that Scripture states that a person must CONSENT to this before we are permitted to allow baptism - but they can't seem to find any verse that remotely says that.

Then some insist that we aren't to follow the teaching of Scripture but rather the examples that happened to be recorded in Scripture - problem is, they can't show that only those over the age of X were baptized and those under that age were forbidden (and of course, they then go on to document that they don't believe or apply their own rubric - that we can only do what is exampled in Scripture).


This German layman in the 16th Century invented this new tradition, one now followed by a very small percentage of Christians (but common in American "Evangelicalism" today). We're discussing his protest, his denial of the old (from at last 69 AD at the latest) universal practice of NOT withholding it from those under the age of X.



Thank you.


Pax



- Josiah



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