Original Sin

[Lanman87]

What does original sin mean to you?

 

[Messy]

I voted 'We are all born with a sin nature, but aren't guilty of sin until we commit actual sin', but I half believe the first one. I'm not guilty of Adam's sin and the son shall not bear the iniquity of the father, but before Jesus came an innocent child, that wasn't even able to sin, would still not go to heaven and had to wait until Jesus died and rose.

 

[Albion]

What does original sin mean to you?

It's helpful to keep in mind that sin, by definition, isn't an item like a pencil or a cough or murder. Some acts, like the last one mentioned in that statement, would be singular, it's true, but sin also is a condition. Pastors and theologians speak of being "in sin," which hints at the fuller understanding or the term.

Therefore, items 1 and 2 on the list given in the OP are close in meaning, if however separate. But when we speak of a "sin nature" we aren't talking about being liable to sin if we aren't careful; it's saying that we are by nature outcast from God as human beings (thanks to Adam) and need a Savior.

Otherwise, Christ might have needed to die only for the people on His list of those who needed it, excluding the rest of mankind. We should know by now--and from the testimony of Scripture--that that wasn't the case.

 

[Lamb]

I voted for the top one:

Lutheran Theology:

Chapter IV. Sin

In short, original sin means that we are both counted guilty of Adam’s sin and inherently corrupt in our own inherited human nature. The Scripture proof for the first (imputed guilt) is clearly furnished by Rom. 5:18a: “By the offence of one judgment came upon all men to condemnation,” and Rom. 5:19a: “By one man’s disobedience many were made sinners.” If this imputed guilt should seem harsh to us, let us recall that it is the correlative of the precious doctrine which lies at the heart of the way of salvation, the doctrine of the imputed righteousness of Christ. To perceive this connection between the Scriptural doctrine of original sin and our blessed hope of forgiveness, life, and salvation look at Rom. 5:18, 19 in its entirety: “Therefore as by the offense of one judgment came upon all men to condemnation; even so by the righteousness of One the free gift came upon all men unto justification of life. For as by one man’s disobedience many were made sinners, so by the obedience of One shall many be made righteous.” The Scripture proof for the second (inherited corruption) is Psalm 51:5: “Behold, I was shapen in iniquity, and in sin did my mother conceive me,” and John 3:6: “That which is born of the flesh is flesh.” Only this Bible teaching, which every Christian will and must believe on the basis of God’s Word, is a factual and realistic description and explanation of human nature as it actually is. Every system of education and every psychology of human behavior which fails to recognize these basic truths is utterly unrealistic and woefully at variance with the facts of experience as well as with the truth of Scripture.

Original sin is the prolific source of all actual sins. It is the underlying cause of which all sorts of actual sins are simply the natural result.

 

[Forgiven1]

I voted the first one. I agree with what Lamb wrote.

 

[Josiah]

We ARE sin. And THUS are guilty of that reality.


.

 

[Albion]

That sounds like what option 2 was getting at.

I don't know if it's worth any further explanation on your part, but that was my reaction.

 

[Josiah]

Original Sin


Psalm 51:5 "I was sinful at birth"

Genesis 8:21, "Every inclination of man's heart is evil."

Romans 5:12 "Sin entered the world through one man and death through sin, and in this way death came to all people for have sin."

Ephesians 4:22, "Put off the old man which corrupts."

Ephesians 2:3, "We all were by our very nature objects of God's wrath."

Ephesians 2:1 "You were dead in your sins."

Romans 8:7 "The sinful mind is hostile to God, it does not submit to God Law because it cannot do so."

"Original sin" is a spiritual disease. It is universal. Let's say I have the disease of a cold. And thus, I likely (at least at times) have symptoms of that - coughing, sneezing, runny nose, sore throat. Now, does the coughing result in me having a cold? No, it's the cold that (may) result in the cough. "Original sin" (usually spoken of in Scripture by the singular "sin") is the disease, the spiritual defect that humanity got at the Fall. If I shoot my neighbor, the "problem" is not limited to the microsecond when I pulled the trigger.... there is a HISTORY here, chain of things, that goes all the way back to my heart, my nature and how it sought to hurt and hate. "Original sin" is that heart problem, that spiritual disease.

Now, "sin" can also be actualized (classically called "Actual sin"); these are the symptoms of the disease; the "caugh" of the cold. Our sinful nature doesn't always reveal itself by our words and deeds but the disease is still there and we are still "guilty" of that nature (we still have the cold). We might be "guilty" of the reality of our nature AND perhaps because of the symptoms of that, the "sins" (actualization of that reality). And of course, our nature (sin) may prevent us from doing good - and that too is a symptom of the disease (classic theology speaks of sins of commission - doing wrong, and also sins of omission - not doing right; both are symptoms of our sinful nature, "sin,")


- Josiah




.

 

[MoreCoffee]

What does original sin mean to you?

None of the above.

 

[Lanman87]

None of the above.

Care to elaborate?

 

[Odë:hgöd]

.
It's believed by a pretty large percentage of modern Christians that the so called
original sin-- a.k.a. the forbidden fruit incident --is inherited from Adam. Oh? From
whence did Eve get it?

She was already alive and fully constructed with material taken from Adam's body
prior to the incident. Since himself tasted the fruit after his wife was already in
existence; then it was impossible for Adam to pass his sin to her by means of
reproduction.

According to Romans 5:12-21, Adams sin isn't inherited, rather, it's imputed, and
the imputation doesn't take place for each in his own time, rather; it took place for
everyone all at once in real time.

FAQ: Are you suggesting that Jesus' virgin conception didn't isolate him from the original
sin?

REPLY: That's right.

FAQ: Then how can it be truthfully said that he was a lamb without spot or blemish.

REPLY: According to John 8:29, 2Cor 5:21, Heb 4:15, and 1Pet 2:22; Jesus
committed no sins of his own to answer for.

FAQ: But isn't Adam's sin a sin unto Hell?

REPLY: No, The specified retribution for Adam's sin is simply mortality. Which means,
of course, that had Jesus not been crucified, he would've eventually died from some
other cause.
_

 

[MoreCoffee]

Care to elaborate?

Original sin is the sin by which Adam & Eve disobeyed the commandment of God, choosing to follow their own will rather than God's expressed and loving will. As a consequence they lost the grace of Original Holiness and became subject to the law of sin and death; sin too, became universally present in the world. In addition to the personal sin of Adam & Eve, original sin made humanity share the state of fallen human nature which affects every human being born into the fallen world in which we live and from which Christ came to redeem us.

 

[Lanman87]

Original sin is the sin by which Adam & Eve disobeyed the commandment of God, choosing to follow their own will rather than God's expressed and loving will. As a consequence they lost the grace of Original Holiness and became subject to the law of sin and death; sin too, became universally present in the world. In addition to the personal sin of Adam & Eve, original sin made humanity share the state of fallen human nature which affects every human being born into the fallen world in which we live and from which Christ came to redeem us.

Is everyone made guilty by Adams original sin?

 

[MoreCoffee]

Is everyone made guilty by Adams original sin?

I do not know, I'd be guessing what God is thinking if I were to say yes or no. What do you say?

 

[Albion]

Original sin is the sin by which Adam & Eve disobeyed the commandment of God, choosing to follow their own will rather than God's expressed and loving will. As a consequence they lost the grace of Original Holiness and became subject to the law of sin and death; sin too, became universally present in the world. In addition to the personal sin of Adam & Eve, original sin made humanity share the state of fallen human nature which affects every human being born into the fallen world in which we live and from which Christ came to redeem us.

Wouldn't that then be choice #2 on this thread's poll? Or am I reading something into it?

Is everyone made guilty by Adams original sin?

That is the standard view of the matter that's taught by the Catholic Church and other major denominations. I'm surprised that the poll has seemingly left almost everyone scratching their heads over what to answer.

 

[Odë:hgöd]

.

In addition to the personal sin of Adam & Eve

According to Romans 5:12-19 Adam's conduct alone is responsible for the
universality of original sin; and that's very easy to prove without corroboration
from Romans.

When Eve tasted the forbidden fruit, nothing happened. She went right on in the
buff just as shameless as before and didn't experience a change in her perception
of decency until Adam tasted the fruit.

FAQ: Why single out Adam? Weren't he and his wife a sort of tag team?

REPLY: According to Rom 5:12-19 it was God's intent that sin and death come into
the world via one man working alone just as righteous and life would later come
into the world via one man working alone. When people attempt to shoehorn Eve
into the game, they feminize the model and taint its message. i.e. while true that
a woman's conduct played a role in original sin, it was a man's conduct alone that
triggered its spread.
_

 

[Messy]

.


According to Romans 5:12-19 Adam's conduct alone is responsible for the
universality of original sin; and that's very easy to prove without corroboration
from Romans.

When Eve tasted the forbidden fruit, nothing happened. She went right on in the
buff just as shameless as before and didn't experience a change in her perception
of decency until Adam tasted the fruit.

FAQ: Why single out Adam? Weren't he and his wife a sort of tag team?

REPLY: According to Rom 5:12-19 it was God's intent that sin and death come into
the world via one man working alone just as righteous and life would later come
into the world via one man working alone. When people attempt to shoehorn Eve
into the game, they feminize the model and taint its message. i.e. while true that
a woman's conduct played a role in original sin, it was a man's conduct alone that
triggered its spread.
_

He stood right next to her. Maybe he ate a second later. Maybe at the same time. Everything changed immediately. They were not 1 with God anymore. They both saw that they were naked and hid. Some preacher said because the glory was gone. There's a Dutch song about it, that the cat immediately caught a bird. Adam blamed God for giving him that woman. He didn't even blame satan. God held Adam accountable, although she tempted him. Too bad. Maybe because he was a man. If he could have stayed single he'd still be chilling here alone with the animals.

 

[Albion]

According to Romans 5:12-19 Adam's conduct alone is responsible for the
universality of original sin; and that's very easy to prove without corroboration
from Romans.

The verse in Romans says that sin came into the world through Adam, which none of us denies. That doesn't mean that Eve wasn't stained by that sin also in view of her role in getting Adam to defy God. And if she had not been guilty, she would not have suffered the same fate at the hands of God as Adam.

FAQ: Why single out Adam? Weren't he and his wife a sort of tag team?

REPLY: According to Rom 5:12-19 it was God's intent that sin and death come into
the world via one man

That's right--came into the world. But that's not what you are contesting. You've said that the Original Sin didn't involve Eve.

This is the standard Christian belief, anyway.

 

[Odë:hgöd]

.

He stood right next to her.

● Gen 3:6 . . she took of its fruit and ate. She also gave some to her husband who
was with her, and he ate it.

The phrase "who was with her" has led some folks to suggest that Adam was
standing right there the whole time observing the entire incident; not saying a
word. In my experience; that's a popular opinion among certain women who seem
to have a predilection for blaming men for their own mistakes.

But the phrase could simply mean they were a cohabiting couple at the time, viz:
weren't split up living apart. For example: I've been with my wife 43 years without
interruption though we often go our separate ways on errands and appointments:
vacations too, My wife likes to rendezvous with her sister in the community of
Santa Barbara California once a year for a week, viz: she's been with me all this
time, though not always at my side.

The Serpent is portrayed as a highly intelligent creature (Gen 3:1). Well; for sure
he was intuitively aware of the tried and true tactic "Divide and Conquer" Catching
the woman by herself away from her husband's oversight was a sensible tactic.

The thing is: the Serpent was somehow aware the fruit posed no danger to the
woman; so if he could get her to try it, and she'd see for herself it was safe to eat,
then the Serpent would have the ally he needed to persuade the man to do
something contrary to his better judgment.

But I think Adam was at least cautious at first, and kept a wary eye on his wife for
some time waiting to see if she would get sick; and when she didn't, he surely had
to wonder if maybe he misunderstood God.

I think most husbands would sympathize with Adam. I mean: he was told by a
supposedly competent source that the forbidden fruit was unfit for human
consumption. But here's his wife happily munching away and she's still healthy,
lucid, and exhibiting no ill side effects. How is a reasonable man supposed to argue
with empirical evidence as good as that?

NOTE: 1Tim 2:14 is oftentimes used to allege that Adam wasn't tricked into eating
the fruit. But the trickery in that particular passage is related to the Serpent. In
other words: Adam wasn't fooled by the Devil, instead, he was made a fool by his
wife.
_

 

[Prepared]

What does original sin mean to you?

Origin of the first sin committed - origin of the first rebellion against God - and according to a statement Jesus made origin of the first thought of rebellion against God.