PERFECT LOVE

[YourTruthGod]

Judas knew the law that one who sheds innocent blood is to be put to death.

However, the chief priests and elders of the law wanted Jesus put to death, so they are not going to have Judas put to death.

Judas did to himself what the law required.

 

[MennoSota]

Back at ya!

A.

You fib. You do worship at a place where the traditions and myths of men are viewed as greater than God's word. When in conflict, your traditions supercede God. It's really no different than the Pharisees and Sadducees in Jesus day on earth.

 

[Arsenios]

You fib. You do worship at a place where the traditions and myths of men are viewed as greater than God's word. When in conflict, your traditions supercede God. It's really no different than the Pharisees and Sadducees in Jesus day on earth.

Back at ya!

A.

ps - Next post bring popcorn...

 

[Arsenios]

Judas knew the law that one who sheds innocent blood is to be put to death.

However, the chief priests and elders of the law wanted Jesus put to death, so they are not going to have Judas put to death.

Judas did to himself what the law required.

An interesting take...

He hanged himself according to his self-convicted crime in violation of the Law...

The Law would not even convict him, so corrupted was it...

Did you figure that out yourself?

Or did you read it somewhere?

Or did it just come to you?

You see, the contrast of Peter and Judas is the point here...

And the practical implications of each...

What can one DO to follow Peter and not Judas...

Thank-you...


Arsenios

 

[atpollard]

An interesting take...

He hanged himself according to his self-convicted crime in violation of the Law...

The Law would not even convict him, so corrupted was it...

Did you figure that out yourself?

Or did you read it somewhere?

Or did it just come to you?

You see, the contrast of Peter and Judas is the point here...

And the practical implications of each...

What can one DO to follow Peter and not Judas...

Thank-you...


Arsenios

I liked your pointing out what really mattered ... the contrast between Judas and Peter.

 

[YourTruthGod]

An interesting take...

He hanged himself according to his self-convicted crime in violation of the Law...

The Law would not even convict him, so corrupted was it...

Did you figure that out yourself?

Or did you read it somewhere?

Or did it just come to you?

You see, the contrast of Peter and Judas is the point here...

And the practical implications of each...

What can one DO to follow Peter and not Judas...

Thank-you...


Arsenios

The Holy Spirit showed it to me.

Of course there is a difference between Peter and Judas' sin.

I have brought up the differences between sinners earlier in this thread.

Did you really mean to say the old law was corrupt? Or, did you mean to say those who enforced the law were corrupt?

You are wrong when you say the old law wouldn't have had Judas put to death.

 

[Arsenios]

The Holy Spirit showed it to me.

Of course there is a difference between Peter and Judas' sin.

I have brought up the differences between sinners earlier in this thread.

So do you think that it is the sin, and not the repentance, that condemned Judas?

I have always thought it was the failure of Judas' repentance that mattered...

Did you really mean to say the old law was corrupt?

Or, did you mean to say those who enforced the law were corrupt?

The Jews were corrupted - They freed bar-Abbas to condemn Christ...

You are wrong when you say the old law wouldn't have had Judas put to death.

I will make it a point to never ever say that even once...


Arsenios

 

[Arsenios]

I liked your pointing out what really mattered ... the contrast between Judas and Peter.

We tend to not see the praxeological implications of theological doctrines...

The difference between Judas and Peter should be clearly understood from a practical point of view...

To say that both sinned and both repented and one was saved and one was condemned...

Destroys as vanity the idea that what we do matters for our Salvation by God...

We need to know the difference between Judas and Peter...

So that we can emulate Peter, and not Judas...

That God should save us rather than not know us...


Arsenios

 

[YourTruthGod]

So do you think that it is the sin, and not the repentance, that condemned Judas?

It is both.

I have always thought it was the failure of Judas' repentance that mattered...

Judas did repent.

The Jews were corrupted - They freed bar-Abbas to condemn Christ...

Of course they were.

I will make it a point to never ever say that even once...


Arsenios

The law was spiritual.

Romans 7:14 For we know that the law is spiritual: but I am carnal, sold under sin.

 

[YourTruthGod]

We tend to not see the praxeological implications of theological doctrines...

The difference between Judas and Peter should be clearly understood from a practical point of view...

To say that both sinned and both repented and one was saved and one was condemned...

Destroys as vanity the idea that what we do matters for our Salvation by God...

We need to know the difference between Judas and Peter...

So that we can emulate Peter, and not Judas...

That God should save us rather than not know us...


Arsenios

Could you give the scripture where Peter repented?

 

[Pedrito]

==============================================================================================

In Posts #1 and #6 Arsenios quoted a couple of people, apparently as having authority:

St. Maximos the Confessor: ‘you must love everyone equally’.

Another author: ‘"perfect love" has as its goal that you must love everyone equally...perfect love inspires you, it encourages and exhorts you, it guides you to the place where you can love everyone equally’.

Then in Post #103, after it was pointed out that Jesus displayed unequal depths of love for different people, Arsenios offered the following:

Sometimes it is hard to discern the two natures of Christ in Scripture...

==============================================================================================

The point was then made that whether as a human or as God (whatever nature was in play), Jesus, according to Arsenios’ “authorities”, should have shown equal love to everyone. Responding to that, Arsenios offered in Post #285 (blank lines removed):

As a created human being, Christ grew in stature across His lifetime, that we should follow Him...
As God He is pre-eternal without change...
Discerning which of these Natures is operating in a particular Biblical account is not always easy...
Just because the Person is the same in each does not unite the two natures as one Nature...

Do we see here an attempt to once again draw attention away from the fact that the statements made by Arsenios’ “authorities” – “authorities” he seems duty-bound to defend – are contrary to God’s Holy Bible?

I think so. The “authorities” state that Jesus should have loved everyone equally – He should not nave shown special love for John.

==============================================================================================

Priorities regarding loyalty to churches, and loyalty to belief systems, versus loyalty to God’s Holy Revelation to us, are easy to identify. Aren’t they?

==============================================================================================

 

[RichWh1]

The difference between Peter and Judas is that Peter had true sorrow whereas Judas has remorse.


And Peter remembered the word which Jesus had said, “Before a rooster crows, you will deny Me three times.” And he went out and wept bitterly.. Matthew 26:75 -

Then when Judas, who had betrayed Him, saw that He had been condemned, he felt remorse and returned the thirty pieces of silver to the chief priests and elders, saying, “I have sinned by betraying innocent blood.” But they said, “What is that to us? See to that yourself!” And he threw the pieces of silver into the temple sanctuary and departed; and he went away and hanged himself.
Matthew 27:3-5

Notice the end result of each.
One wept bitterly the other hanged himself.



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Arsenios]

Could you give the scripture where Peter repented?

Yes.

Luk 22:62
And Peter went out,
and wept bitterly.


Arsenios

 

[YourTruthGod]

Yes.

Luk 22:62
And Peter went out,
and wept bitterly.


Arsenios

He was sorry for what he did. As was Judas.

 

[Arsenios]

Judas did repent.

OK - Starting from the fact that he did repent...
and then that his repentance ended in suicide...
And that Peter wept bitterly...
And ended in Life Eternal...

How do you account for the two outcomes...
In terms of what we ourselves should do or not do...?

Do you agree that it is a good issue?


Arsenios

 

[Arsenios]

The issue here is as old as the Fall...
Adam ate of the Tree of Knowledge...
Not just some random knowledge...
But the knowledge of both good and evil...

Cain killed Abel...
Evil kills Good...

God incarnates...
Disciples the 12...
Two betray Him...
One is saved...
One is lost...

Why?

What are we to learn from this account?


Arsenios

 

[YourTruthGod]

OK - Starting from the fact that he did repent...
and then that his repentance ended in suicide...
And that Peter wept bitterly...
And ended in Life Eternal...

How do you account for the two outcomes...
In terms of what we ourselves should do or not do...?

Do you agree that it is a good issue?


Arsenios

I have already stated what you ask, but it seems you didn't read all my posts, at least not carefully enough.

Peter made mistakes based on fear and ignorance.

Judas lived with God in the flesh for a few years and stayed a bad person.

Jesus says some sins are worse than others.

 

[YourTruthGod]

The issue here is as old as the Fall...
Adam ate of the Tree of Knowledge...
Not just some random knowledge...
But the knowledge of both good and evil...

Cain killed Abel...
Evil kills Good...

God incarnates...
Disciples the 12...
Two betray Him...
One is saved...
One is lost...

Why?

What are we to learn from this account?


Arsenios

Why do you keep saying Peter betrayed Jesus?
You can't see the difference between someone who sinned out of ignorance and fear and opposed to another who remained evil and then had Jesus turned over to be killed?

 

[Arsenios]

Why do you keep saying Peter betrayed Jesus?

Mat 10:33
But whosoever shall deny me before men,
him will I also deny before my Father which is in heaven.

You can't see the difference between someone who sinned out of ignorance and fear and
opposed to another who remained evil and then had Jesus turned over to be killed?

The difference between Peter and Judas is the difference between Life and death...

I just think it is really really important to understand this difference...

I do not think it was the greatness of the sin of betrayal of Christ that condemned Judas...

I do not think that Peter's sin was anything other than disastrous...

I think Peter's Apostleship was lost in his sin, as was His Salvation...

I think it was restored, both his Salvation and his Apostleship...

I think the two are types for restoration of lost Salvation in Christ...

One for its restoration, the other for its condemnation...


Arsenios

 

[YourTruthGod]

Mat 10:33
But whosoever shall deny me before men,
him will I also deny before my Father which is in heaven.

Deny and betray are not the same.

The difference between Peter and Judas is the difference between Life and death...

I just think it is really really important to understand this difference...

I do not think it was the greatness of the sin of betrayal of Christ that condemned Judas...

Of course it is.

I do not think that Peter's sin was anything other than disastrous...

I think Peter's Apostleship was lost in his sin, as was His Salvation...

I think it was restored, both his Salvation and his Apostleship...

I think the two are types for restoration of lost Salvation in Christ...

One for its restoration, the other for its condemnation...

Arsenios

Peter acted out ignorance and fear.

Judas lived with Jesus for three years and remained a thief, then betrayed Jesus and had him handed over to be put to death.