The Triune God.

[Imalive]

Genesis 1:26
Then God said, "Let us make man in our image, after our likeness.

Genesis 11:7
*Come, let us go down and there confuse their language, so that they may not understand one another's speech."

One being, three persons.

Throughout the Hebrew Bible we see the plurality of God the Father, God the Son and God the Spirit. These are not modes of one God. These are three persons of one being. Each a person yet one being we recognize as God.

I will leave you to your modalism. It is the teaching of many cults such as the Church of God (Garner Ted Armstrong) and Hebrew Roots.

I wonder if Abraham believed God was 3 Persons. The Lord appeared to him as a Man w the Sodom stuff and His Spirit filled the holy of holies and the prophets.

 

[MoreCoffee]

I wonder if Abraham believed God was 3 Persons. The Lord appeared to him as a Man w the Sodom stuff and His Spirit filled the holy of holies and the prophets.

The Prophets and Holy of holies were after Abraham's time.

 

[MennoSota]

I wonder if Abraham believed God was 3 Persons. The Lord appeared to him as a Man w the Sodom stuff and His Spirit filled the holy of holies and the prophets.

God has always been shown as three in one.
In Genesis 1 we see God the Father and God the Spirit. We then see God the Son walking in the Garden.
As [MENTION=13]Josiah[/MENTION] has mentioned, it is a mystery for us finite beings to comprehend the infinite God as One being, yet three persons. However, the Bible presents this mystery from front cover to back cover and everywhere inbetween.
God is never portrayed as having different modes by which he manifests himself. If you followed that logic, God could manifest as anything, which would lead to pantheism or idolatry along the same lines as Aaron and the golden calf.

 

[NewCreation435]

I don't know if anyone on here has read J.I Packer's book "Knowing God" but it does a great job of focusing on God attributes and I would highly recommend it.
I think one of the reasons we have trouble understanding the Trinity is because God is infinite and we are finite. We are in a sense trying to use words to explain God who goes beyond reason, words or understanding. He's simply too awesome for our little minds to fully grasp

 

[Andrew]

No creed is going to get in my way of calling unto God in Jesus name. To say I am not a Christian for not accepting a 3rd century creed is what it is, and is what it has always been, a stumbling block and a form of blackmail, thank God that in our time I can just stay out of a section in a Christian forum rather than being burnt at the stake lol
Trinitarians and their creed say its a mystery, I feel the same because its confusion hence literally Mystery Babylon.
The Bible says that godliness is a mystery sweet and simple.
1 Timothy 3:16
And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh, justified in the Spirit, seen of angels, preached unto the Gentiles, believed on in the world, received up into glory.

I love you guys cheers


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[Andrew]

Stating for the record I am merely defending my faith from ridicule of the God we likely serve. To be clear I thank God for his mystery and we shall see him in due time. I don't wish to make war with any of his people over a creed, I ask that you also not make war (spiritual war) with me over a creed. To say that you or I are denying his omnipresence can push serious spiritual doubt on his believers.

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[MoreCoffee]

Stating for the record I am merely defending my faith from ridicule of the God we likely serve. To be clear I thank God for his mystery and we shall see him in due time. I don't wish to make war with any of his people over a creed, I ask that you also not make war (spiritual war) with me over a creed. To say that you or I are denying his omnipresence can push serious spiritual doubt on his believers.

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Muslims, Jews, and heretics serve an absolute monad as their god. Christians worship the Triune God revealed in the holy scriptures.

 

[Andrew]

Muslims, Jews, and heretics serve an absolute monad as their god. Christians worship the Triune God revealed in the holy scriptures.

No doubt MC, my only concern is that you or anyone label me in the likeness of muslims and jews. I just pray different, not every Christian prays "In the name of.. Father Son and Holy Spirit", they are the main three titles of the Godhead, but I cannot help to pray in Jesus name. God is omnipresent and pure love above and below, for Christ had even gone to hell as part of the process and full completion of works as God and man.

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[MoreCoffee]

No doubt MC, my only concern is that you or anyone label me in the likeness of muslims and jews. I just pray different, not every Christian prays "In the name of.. Father Son and Holy Spirit", they are the main three titles of the Godhead, but I cannot help to pray in Jesus name. God is omnipresent and pure love above and below, for Christ had even gone to hell as part of the process and full completion of works as God and man.

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Not label, you're obviously not a Jew or a Muslim - a heretic perhaps - what I did is compare your theology with Jewish and Muslim and Heretical theologies that teach an absolute monad god.

 

[Andrew]

Not label, you're obviously not a Jew or a Muslim - a heretic perhaps - what I did is compare your theology with Jewish and Muslim and Heretical theologies that teach an absolute monad god.

Nor am I a heretic or gnostic. Fascist accuse people of fascism, Heretics accuse others of heresy. Which is which then? I do know that Christianity was a cult because they didnt serve the Roman state religion, when Constantine gave Rome the deeds to Christianity by "allowing" Christians in, they officially made it the state religion. This allowed heresy charges and Constantine a "Christian" persecuted any Christian who did not recognize the Pontif Max under the law of Rome. The cult remained outside and we call them "bible believers" and new creeds justified the continuous persecution of Christians, all the teachings that contradict the bible were no accidents, it only identified the bible believers. The bible itself was condemned by Roman Law, they never kept the book safe, they tried to burn all the copies.
MC this was also the PAST, we are passed heretic naming and charges, the Catholic church will continue to pile up junk (in my opinion) but I believe in the true monotheistic God in Jesus name, just as you do.
---------------
Jesus Christ the same yesterday, and to day, and for ever. Be not carried about with divers and strange doctrines. For it is a good thing that the heart be established with grace; not with meats, which have not profited them that have been occupied therein.
Hebrews 13:8-9
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[MoreCoffee]

Nor am I a heretic or gnostic. Fascist accuse people of fascism, Heretics accuse others of heresy. Which is which then? I do know that Christianity was a cult because they didnt serve the Roman state religion, when Constantine gave Rome the deeds to Christianity by "allowing" Christians in, they officially made it the state religion. This allowed heresy charges and Constantine a "Christian" persecuted any Christian who did not recognize the Pontif Max under the law of Rome. The cult remained outside and we call them "bible believers" and new creeds justified the continuous persecution of Christians, all the teachings that contradict the bible were no accidents, it only identified the bible believers. The bible itself was condemned by Roman Law, they never kept the book safe, they tried to burn all the copies.
MC this was also the PAST, we are passed heretic naming and charges, the Catholic church will continue to pile up junk (in my opinion) but I believe in the true monotheistic God in Jesus name, just as you do.
---------------
Jesus Christ the same yesterday, and to day, and for ever. Be not carried about with divers and strange doctrines. For it is a good thing that the heart be established with grace; not with meats, which have not profited them that have been occupied therein.
Hebrews 13:8-9
--------------


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You say you're not a heretic and who am I to contradict you? Yet you keep pushing heresy. Modalism is heresy and it's what you keep pushing as if it were important for others to accept it as truth. It is not true.

You seem a nice young chap and I have sympathy for your desire to learn what is true. Keep searching and maybe you'll find it. Right now you're on the wrong path but who knows, God willing you may find the right path in time. That's my prayer for you and it is why I reply to your posts. Don't walk away from what I wrote thinking I dislike you or disrespect your desire for truth because that is not the case. All I am concerned to do it point to the truth and away from the errors.

Keep searching. It may do you a power of good.

 

[Andrew]

You say you're not a heretic and who am I to contradict you? Yet you keep pushing heresy. Modalism is heresy and it's what you keep pushing as if it were important for others to accept it as truth. It is not true.

You seem a nice young chap and I have sympathy for your desire to learn what is true. Keep searching and maybe you'll find it. Right now you're on the wrong path but who knows, God willing you may find the right path in time. That's my prayer for you and it is why I reply to your posts. Don't walk away from what I wrote thinking I dislike you or disrespect your desire for truth because that is not the case. All I am concerned to do it point to the truth and away from the errors.

Keep searching. It may do you a power of good.

MC thank you brother and let my clarify what I mean by "which is which". We can accuse the brethren all day of heresy, me you and you me, and who is right? We definitely do not deny the Father if we accept Jesus as Lord and Savior, we should pray for eachother I agree. I grew up Catholic and I dont feel that I had walked away from truth but into truth, God works in you differently but our path is strict narrow and straight. I am trying not to accuse anyone of heresy, we can all now identify false churches and especially Gnostics which is what I believe the apostles were truly against at the time, Nag Hammadi teachings teach that the OT God was evil and that Jesus was pure light and shape shifted on the cross, (that he did not come in flesh)...
Hereby know ye the Spirit of God: Every spirit that confesseth that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is of God: And every spirit that confesseth not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is not of God: and this is that spirit of antichrist, whereof ye have heard that it should come; and even now already is it in the world. 1 John 4:2-3
...that he spake perfect language as a baby, that the serpent in the Garden was pistas sophia or wisdom and was good.
But we serve the true God of the Bible, whether we claim to know the mystery of the Godhead or not we know that God does not change neither for you nor me.
I have no problem being invited to a Catholic church and bowing and signing the cross and kneeling and... all that stuff and neither will I have a problem praying in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit before supping with Catholics. Praying that way has nothing to do with trinity it is scriptural, accepting the trinity is for those who accept the creed, and thats fine, I serve him too

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[Albion]

...and neither will I have a problem praying in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit before supping with Catholics. Praying that way has nothing to do with trinity it is scriptural, accepting the trinity is for those who accept the creed, and thats fine, I serve him too

Whaaaat? Isn't "accepting the Trinity" something for all who believe that it is attested to by the Bible?

 

[Imalive]

Whaaaat? Isn't "accepting the Trinity" something for all who believe that it is attested to by the Bible?

No. Enough saved Jews who believe God is one Person who makes Himself known by Jesus. Nowhere it's in the Bible that it's a must to accept the creed to be saved. If you believe God raised Jesus from the dead and that Jesus is Lord you will be saved. Now if they believe Jesus is the angel Michael they don't believe in the right Jesus, so then they're not saved. Jesus said that He would raise this temple and another text says the Father raised Him from the dead. So if they believe 3 Persons or 3 manifestations of the same God doesn't matter.

 

[Andrew]

Whaaaat? Isn't "accepting the Trinity" something for all who believe that it is attested to by the Bible?

I suppose so, but for the years I have read the bible I have never noticed anything standing out that screams "Trinity".
These stand out for me personally.
For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus; 1 Timothy 2:5
And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh, justified in the Spirit, seen of angels, preached unto the Gentiles, believed on in the world, received up into glory. 1 Timothy 3:16

With all due respect I see simplicity in calling out to God in Jesus name and I feel nothing wrong with that. Trinity was not taught by the Apostles and came in long after they died. I do not see in the bible where it is necessary to believe in trinity for salvation, if I accept Jesus I accept the Father. The beliefs of trinity by others were never an issue with me until I was being attacked and found myself defending myself in the tongues thread, im sorry but im not sorry.
I myself had prayed in the Name of the Father Son and Holy Spirit and will again but the bible never says that God is Trinity, these are (for me) simply the three capitalised titles of God.

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[MoreCoffee]

No. Enough saved Jews who believe God is one Person ...

Those Jews who reject the holy Trinity are not saved. They are inventing a god to fit their prejudices. It's an idol. They will never believe as long as they are worshippers of an idol. One cannot serve both God and an idol. What has Christ to do with idols? Nothing. Not a thing.

 

[MoreCoffee]

I suppose so, but for the years I have read the bible I have never noticed anything standing out that screams "Trinity". ...

Keep searching with a heart for God and you'll find what you seek but if you seek to affirm the idol of modalism then you'll find nothing good. Nothing from God.

 

[Andrew]

Keep searching with a heart for God and you'll find what you seek but if you seek to affirm the idol of modalism then you'll find nothing good. Nothing from God.

Could you explain modalism?
Everytime I look up these words you all use to describe me, they are terribly off.

Flipityflopism: belief that Jesus created the universe, is God manifest in the flesh with the Holy Spirit in him/God in him thus Jesus name represents himself the Son himself the Father and himself the Holy Spirit above and below, he alone is the omnipresent living God of Abraham and the prophets and that he God never changes, one God with three titles of Father, Son and Holy Spirit. One spirit who is not only one alone but everywhere living and for anyone with the Holy Spirit in them are called to be with him and in his oneness (like minded unity/heaven) forever and ever as Sons of God in one wholly Spirit. One God
I made it sound ridicules but for the most part I could agree with flippityflopism.
But not im not modalism, im just pre-catholic-apostolic taught through apostles.
When I praise God I would just sound crazy to lift up my hands in worship and say "we thank you lord my Trinity we praise you all as the Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit! Oh and Jesus too"....
No we praise to God in Jesus name and the Spirit moves in the house, so there you have God Jesus and Spirit

 

[MoreCoffee]

Could you explain modalism?
...

It means that god is one person who makes himself known as Father, and as Son, and as the Holy Spirit. Is that more or less what you've been taught is true?

 

[Andrew]

It means that god is one person who makes himself known as Father, and as Son, and as the Holy Spirit. Is that more or less what you've been taught is true?

Yea but more like this...
And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh, justified in the Spirit, seen of angels, preached unto the Gentiles, believed on in the world, received up into glory. 1 Timothy 3:16