WORTHY

[Lamb]

Curious if you're going exclusively by what your "priest" or "pastor" has told you? For when we read the entire verse that you mention, it states "“Who is worthy to open the scroll and to loose its seals?” (Rev 5:2) Indeed there is only One worthy to open the scroll and loose the seals of God's judgment. Reading the entire verse in it's context helps so much in understanding God's Word.

Now, a couple chapter earlier we read of those who "will walk with Me in white, for they are worthy." (Rev 3:4) Amen. Can we receive this? I can. The common explanation in our Religion today is that 'we are worthy because He is worthy', but we find that is not taught anywhere in the canon of Scripture. And from what Jesus taught - "he who does not take his cross and follow after Me is not worthy of Me." (Matt 10:38), and Paul in nearly every letter to the churches - (Eph 4:1, Phil 1:27, Col 1:10, 1Thess 2:12, 2Thess 1:5, 2Thess 1:11, of which I explain in the video), we find that to inherit the promises of God (which is far beyond the kindergarten step of being "saved") we absolutely must be "found worthy."

And THAT is Bible!!

I'm SO glad you brought up the verse about the those who are in white. Do you know that's actually a reference to baptism? We are clothed in Christ's righteousness at our baptism.

Galatians 3:27 for all of you who were baptized into Christ have clothed yourselves with Christ. Again, it's ALL ABOUT JESUS!

 

[popsthebuilder]

I'm SO glad you brought up the verse about the those who are in white. Do you know that's actually a reference to baptism? We are clothed in Christ's righteousness at our baptism.

Galatians 3:27 for all of you who were baptized into Christ have clothed yourselves with Christ. Again, it's ALL ABOUT JESUS!

Baptism of or in Spirit/ by fire, is not synonymous with being dunked in water though. If it were then those "baptised" would be holy having been made such by the Spirit of GOD, and the giving of self to the will of the Spirit.

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[Michael]

I'm SO glad you brought up the verse about the those who are in white. Do you know that's actually a reference to baptism? We are clothed in Christ's righteousness at our baptism.

Galatians 3:27 for all of you who were baptized into Christ have clothed yourselves with Christ. Again, it's ALL ABOUT JESUS!

Actually, these are clothed in their own "righteous acts." !!

At least that is what the Bible says - "Let us be glad and rejoice and give Him glory, for the marriage of the Lamb has come, and His wife has made herself ready.” 8 And to her it was granted to be arrayed in fine linen, clean and bright, for the fine linen is the righteous acts of the saints." - Rev 19:7-8

And being baptized in water, and being baptized "into" Christ are not the same thing. We "clothe ourselves" (notice again it's "we" who must do this) with Christ, when we are "abiding" IN Him.
We looked at this in-depth in our Roman's 8 Bible Study - https://www.christianityhaven.com/showthread.php?7749-Romans-8-Study-part-1-(IN-CHRIST)

God's wisdom and understanding to all,
May we be found "worthy" of Him today.


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[Lamb]

Actually, these are clothed in their own "righteous acts." !!

At least that is what the Bible says - "Let us be glad and rejoice and give Him glory, for the marriage of the Lamb has come, and His wife has made herself ready.” 8 And to her it was granted to be arrayed in fine linen, clean and bright, for the fine linen is the righteous acts of the saints." - Rev 19:7-8

And being baptized in water, and being baptized "into" Christ are not the same thing. We "clothe ourselves" (notice again it's "we" who must do this) with Christ, when we are "abiding" IN Him.
We looked at this in-depth in our Roman's 8 Bible Study - https://www.christianityhaven.com/showthread.php?7749-Romans-8-Study-part-1-(IN-CHRIST)

God's wisdom and understanding to all,
May we be found "worthy" of Him today.


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There is ONE baptism for the remission of sins and it includes water and the Holy Spirit. THAT is what baptism is and it clothes us in Christ. Be baptized is the original wording and it's passive so something happens to us. We can't baptize ourselves or do anything but receive what God gives us in baptism.

At the weddings in biblical times, the Father always made sure that the guests wore wedding garments. Those not dressed were expelled from the wedding party. It's interesting history since it pertains to what the bible says about weddings and wearing white garments.

Only those in faith will have eternal life with God. Your works won't get you eternal life.

 

[zecryphon_nomdiv]

Baptism of or in Spirit/ by fire, is not synonymous with being dunked in water though. If it were then those "baptised" would be holy having been made such by the Spirit of GOD, and the giving of self to the will of the Spirit.

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When one understands what Baptism is, and what God gives to the recipient in Baptism, they understand that God has made them Holy. Where do we see anyone being baptized with fire instead of water in Scripture?

 

[popsthebuilder]

But one with faith will be witness to the working of the Spirit within their own life and heart, and such a change is indeed reflected in one's word and deed.

It's almost as if people deny these simple truths when they denounce any sort of good works. If one isn't doing according to what they know and have heard, and using what they have freely received; then they disregard the free gift and will have to account for every word and deed they knowingly did contrary to the fruit of the Spirit.



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[popsthebuilder]

When one understands what Baptism is and what is given by God to the recipient, it is synonomous with being holy, because God gives the forgiveness of sins and the gift of the Holy Spirit in Baptism.

Oh...the forgiveness of sins done in ignorance is not the same as pretending one is holy while in knowing sin.

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[zecryphon_nomdiv]

But one with faith will be witness to the working of the Spirit within their own life and heart, and such a change is indeed reflected in one's word and deed.

It's almost as if people deny these simple truths when they denounce any sort of good works. If one isn't doing according to what they know and have heard, and using what they have freely received; then they disregard the free gift and will have to account for every word and deed they knowingly did contrary to the fruit of the Spirit.



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We do good works because we are saved by grace through faith. We do not do good works to receive gifts from God as some on this forum teach.

 

[zecryphon_nomdiv]

Oh...the forgiveness of sins done in ignorance is not the same as pretending one is holy while in knowing sin.

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God forgives sins through Baptism and Holy Communion. So when is God ignorant? No one who has been baptized is pretending to be holy, they are holy, because God has made them so. Clearly, you do not know what Baptism is or does.

 

[popsthebuilder]

We do good works because we are saved by grace through faith. We do not do good works to receive gifts from God as some on this forum teach.

Who preaches to do good works to receive gifts.

Everyone generally claims they got the gift arbitrarily while others get eternal torment arbitrarily.

Quite contrary to scripture and what is just and merciful.



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[popsthebuilder]

God forgives sins through Baptism and Holy Communion. So when is God ignorant? No one who has been baptized is pretending to be holy, they are holy, because God has made them so. Clearly, you do not know what Baptism is or does.

Who said GOD was ignorant of anything?

That's crazy.

That which is holy is actually holy....not part saint and part sinner.

Not two masters

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[zecryphon_nomdiv]

Who said GOD was ignorant of anything?

That's crazy.

That which is holy is actually holy....not part saint and part sinner.

Not two masters

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From the first post in this very thread:

"If we are to overcome and enter into our inheritance, we must be found worthy.

For the Bible tells me so."

Michael openly and unapologetically teaches doing things to be rewarded with God's gifts.
Go read post # 16 if you don't believe me.

 

[zecryphon_nomdiv]

Who said GOD was ignorant of anything?

That's crazy.

That which is holy is actually holy....not part saint and part sinner.

Not two masters

Sent from my moto g(7) supra using Tapatalk

Who are you referring to when you said this:

"Oh...the forgiveness of sins done in ignorance is not the same as pretending one is holy while in knowing sin."

God is the one who forgives sins. So you explain your statement.

 

[Michael]

Dear friends, it appears we will never agree on some things concerning God's Word.

Personally (speaking only of myself here ), I must be faithful to what God has called me to. He requires that I "overcome"and be found "worthy", having "purified myself", if I am to inherit that which He destined me for. And the Lord has confirmed this to me many times through the written Word, so I know that it is Truth beyond the shadow of a doubt. (And again, this is far beyond being "saved" of which I have been for many years now! :ange06

Jesus demands that I use the "talents" He has given me if I am to enter into His joy. And it is I who must use them. Jesus cannot use them for me. that would defeat God's purpose.

I have been commanded to "deny myself, pick up my own cross, purify myself, put to death the deeds of my flesh, stop sinning, and obey His commands" if I am to receive "Eternal salvation" and an "inheritance" in the Kingdom of God.

Perhaps whoever is reading this is not called to that same calling. That is fine. And that is Scriptural. For the gifts and calling are not the same for all. As long as you are faithful in whatever God has commissioned you, and you bear fruit in that, you will hear "well done, good and faithful servant" in that Day. Whether it be a single "talent" or ten, or fifty; it doesn't matter. I KNOW what I've been given, at least in part; and I must strive to that end; or, as the Apostle Paul himself was concerned, I will be "disqualified." It all depends on me, and my response to what He has revealed to me. For Jesus indeed "saved" me apart from anything I had done, but to "neglect so great a salvation" would be to insult the King, and that I refuse to do. I may lose every friend; my family may turn their back on me; the church most likely will shun me (as Jesus foretold), but I have determined to not "shrink back" from this path His Spirit is leading me on. Indeed it is narrow and constricted, but it is the only Way to Life.

Nothing anyone says to me can possibly cause me to unsee things the Lord God has unveiled to me in His Word. I can't go back. Mocking me only further confirms His Word to me.
Again, this is where I am coming from. I only share because I know there are others who feel the same calling upon their lives. Since late last Century God has brought others into my life who know there is so much more than we have known in the churches at large. That calling to become One with Christ, as Jesus Himself prayed makes all our religious theories, or worldly philosophies, pale in comparison.

Peace & Blessings to all.

"May the God of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Father of glory, give to you the spirit of wisdom and revelation in the knowledge of Him, 18 the eyes of your understanding being enlightened; that you may know what is the hope of His calling, what are the riches of the glory of His inheritance in the saints."

Amen.

 

[Lamb]

The lamb of God is worthy...He alone can open the seal...that means that any worth we think we have comes from Him alone by grace through faith. You can't earn your way into eternal life no matter how many videos you make.

 

[Michael]

The lamb of God is worthy...He alone can open the seal...that means that any worth we think we have comes from Him alone by grace through faith. You can't earn your way into eternal life no matter how many videos you make.

Not sure what you mean here, friend. The Scripture doesn't indicate what you are saying.
I know you have animosity toward me for some unknown reason. I believe I was close to the truth in what I said earlier. Often our concern for loved ones can blind us to what the Word declares. I've counselled others in this before. The misunderstanding of most today of "salvation", "inheritance" and God's great plan and purpose for Creation has brought much confusion and strange doctrine into the denominations.
But all this was prophesied by our Lord. It can just be sad to see it unfolding.

And again, in the end no matter how many posts one makes denying the clear Word of the Scripture that we must "walk worthy" to inherit the promises of God in Rev 2 & 3,; or even if these passages were out of the Bible, that Truth will remain.

 

[Lamb]

Not sure what you mean here, friend. The Scripture doesn't indicate what you are saying.
I know you have animosity toward me for some unknown reason. I believe I was close to the truth in what I said earlier. Often our concern for loved ones can blind us to what the Word declares. I've counselled others in this before. The misunderstanding of most today of "salvation", "inheritance" and God's great plan and purpose for Creation has brought much confusion and strange doctrine into the denominations.
But all this was prophesied by our Lord. It can just be sad to see it unfolding.

And again, in the end no matter how many posts one makes denying the clear Word of the Scripture that we must "walk worthy" to inherit the promises of God in Rev 2 & 3,; or even if these passages were out of the Bible, that Truth will remain.

I don't have animosity toward you.

I don't care for your works righteousness theology that rejects the Christ and His forgiveness of sins for you to have eternal life with God. You proudly come here and keep trying to steer the sheep away from Jesus and to look inward which is a danger to their souls.

 

[Michael]

I don't have animosity toward you.

I don't care for your works righteousness theology that rejects the Christ and His forgiveness of sins for you to have eternal life with God. You proudly come here and keep trying to steer the sheep away from Jesus and to look inward which is a danger to their souls.

Oh, friend, if you've noticed, I only post things that are clear in the Scripture and encourage others to search the Word for themselves and see if what I preach is so, according to God's Word. I've never hijacked another's thread and tried to push anyone to believe anything. On the contrary, nearly every post of mine has been immediately attacked by those who are entirely clueless as to what I even state.

The so-called "works righteousness" theology was preached by the Apostles John and Paul. It is not my theology, it's God's. My carnal nature would lo e to believe that a simple prayer or confession of faith in Jesus would guarantee me a blissful eternity, but that is just not Bible. Again, this is far beyond "being saved." Jesus Himself taught that our eternal destiny is determined by what we DO in this life. No other verse can cancel out John 5:28-29, 1John 3:7, Matt 16:27, 2Cor 5:9-11, or the plethora of other portions of the Scripture that I reference often. Remember, these are things Jesus, the Apostles and Prophets said, not me. And the handful of verses used in attempt to discredit me actually confirm and support what I teach.

The few who actually have watched any of the videos, or read along with the Bible Studies I've shared, at least realize that what I've presented is solid Bible, even if they don't understand it or as yet agree with it. The great multitude of Scripture that supports what the Lord God has given me to teach simply cannot be refuted by anyone who reads the Bible.

God's wisdom & understanding to all.

"Do not think that I came to bring peace on earth. I did not come to bring peace but a sword. 35 For I have come to ‘set a man against his father, a daughter against her mother, and a daughter-in-law against her mother-in-law’; 36 and ‘a man’s enemies will be those of his own household.’ 37 He who loves father or mother more than Me is not worthy of Me. And he who loves son or daughter more than Me is not worthy of Me. 38 And he who does not take his cross and follow after Me is not worthy of Me. 39 He who finds his life will lose it, and he who loses his life for My sake will find it." - Jesus (Matt 10:34-39)



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[Lamb]

Do you know that I and others here have shared what the bible says as well? It's just that you reject what scriptures say and you do it boldly as well, saying that God cannot do what He says He does. That isn't attacking YOU or whatever it is you enjoy saying...it's saying your theology isn't Christ driven and doesn't share the fullness of the Gospel message, that Good News that brings us joy and peace. No, you bring about more burdens with your preaching because you reject the good news that those who believe in God will have eternal life and that's because of the Christ, not because of any of your efforts. That's in the bible.

 

[Michael]

Do you know that I and others here have shared what the bible says as well? It's just that you reject what scriptures say and you do it boldly as well, saying that God cannot do what He says He does. That isn't attacking YOU or whatever it is you enjoy saying...it's saying your theology isn't Christ driven and doesn't share the fullness of the Gospel message, that Good News that brings us joy and peace. No, you bring about more burdens with your preaching because you reject the good news that those who believe in God will have eternal life and that's because of the Christ, not because of any of your efforts. That's in the bible.

Oh yes you do indeed share what the Bible says, and I embrace it 100% !

Not sure how many times I need to say it... I AM SAVED BECAUSE OF WHAT JESUS HAS DONE!! I understand this thoroughly There is no question in my mind. I have done nothing, nor need to do a single thing, nor am I trying to do anything to earn "salvation." JESUS DID EVERYTHING needed for mine and your salvation. I agree with every verse you and the others post concerning being "saved" by the mercy and grace of God and what Jesus accomplished on the Cross. 100%

But... moving past that, now that we've been set free by what Christ alone did, and have begun our Journey... as Jesus, Paul, Peter, John, James, Jude and the writer of Hebrews taught extensively - what will do with that salvation? Will we be among the few who, as Joshua & Caleb, actually receive an inheritance (for us the promises of Rev 2 & 3), or will we fall short and find we've forfeited our inheritance because we failed to "walk worthy" and "overcome"? This is what the great bulk of the New Testament is speaking about. So many are stuck back at being "saved", while God is calling us far beyond that to maturity.

"For though by this time you ought to be teachers, you need someone to teach you again the first principles of the oracles of God; and you have come to need milk and not solid food. 13 For everyone who partakes only of milk is unskilled in the word of righteousness, for he is a babe. 14 But solid food belongs to those who are mature, that is, those who by reason of use have their senses exercised to discern both good and evil.
1 Therefore, leaving the discussion of the elementary principles of Christ, let us go on to perfection, not laying again the foundation of repentance from dead works and of faith toward God, 2 of the doctrine of baptisms, of laying on of hands, of resurrection of the dead, and of eternal judgment. 3 And this we will do if God permits." - Heb 5:12-6:1

As Paul wrote of his goal, he knew that being "saved" was only the beginning, not the end of his (our) faith. He had to do much to assure he would receive the fullness of God's desire for him.

"Not that I have already attained, or am already perfected; but I press on, that I may lay hold of that for which Christ Jesus has also laid hold of me. 13 Brethren, I do not count myself to have apprehended; but one thing I do, forgetting those things which are behind and reaching forward to those things which are ahead, 14 I press toward the goal for the prize of the upward call of God in Christ Jesus.
15 Therefore let us, as many as are mature, have this mind; and if in anything you think otherwise, God will reveal even this to you." - Phil 3:12-15

If the Apostle Paul knew he hadn't yet attained, and could even be disqualified if he didn't repent, discipline himself and prove himself worthy (1Cor 9:27), I personally cannot accept that any of us reading this have already attained and are assured of their eternal reward. It's NOT Bible.

"He who endures til the end shall be saved." - Jesus (Mark 13:13)
"God will render to each one according to his deeds." - Paul (Rom 2:6)
"Behold, I am coming quickly, and My reward is with Me, to give to each one according to what he has done." - Jesus (Rev 22:12)

I easily accept every verse that has been used in attempt to counter me; again, as they fit perfectly into what I teach.
Can those who oppose me on this site accept the verses I have shared here and extensively throughout what the Lord gave me to share?

Either we accept ALL that Jesus taught, or we have not solid doctrine. Either every Word is True, or all is suspect.

"The entirety of Your word is Truth,
And every one of Your righteous judgments endures forever."
- Psalm 119:160

Amen.


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