What does it mean?

[MoreCoffee]

Be holy

1 Peter 1:13 So, then, let your spirit be ready. Be alert, with confident trust, in the grace you will receive, when Jesus Christ appears. 14 Like obedient children, do not return to your former life, given over to ignorance and passions. 15 Imitate the one who called you. As he is holy, so you, too, be holy, in all your conduct, 16 since Scripture says: Be holy for I am holy.

17 You call upon a Father who makes no distinction between persons, but judges, according to each one’s deeds; take seriously, then, these years which you spend in a strange land. 18 Remember, that you were freed from the useless way of life of your ancestors, not with gold and silver, 19 but with the precious blood of the Lamb without spot or blemish. 20 God, who has known Christ before the world began, revealed him to you in the last days. 21 Through him, you have faith in God, who raised him from the dead, and glorified him, in order that you might put all your faith and hope in God.

22 In obeying the truth, you have gained interior purification, from which comes sincere mutual love. Love one another, then, with all your heart, 23 since you are born again, not from mortal beings, but with enduring life, through the word of God, who lives and remains forever. 24 It is written: All flesh is grass and its glory like the flowers of the field. The grass withers and the flower falls, 25 but the word of the Lord endures forever. This word, is the gospel, which has been brought to you.​

What does it mean when it says that God will judge according to each one’s deeds?

 

[Pedrito]

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Post #1 (MoreCoffee), with reference to 1 Peter 1:13-25:

...17 You call upon a Father who makes no distinction between persons, but judges, according to each one’s deeds; take seriously, then, these years which you spend in a strange land....

...What does it mean when it says that God will judge according to each one’s deeds?

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1 Corinthians 10:12: Wherefore let him that thinketh he standeth take heed lest he fall.
Romans 11:21: For if God spared not the natural branches, take heed lest he also spare not thee.
Philippians 3:11: If by any means I might attain unto the resurrection of the dead.
Matthew 10:22: And ye shall be hated of all men for my name's sake: but he that endureth to the end shall be saved.
Matthew 24:13: But he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved.
Mark 13:13: And ye shall be hated of all men for my name's sake: but he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved.
1 Peter 1:14-15:
14 As obedient children, not fashioning yourselves according to the former lusts in your ignorance:
15 But as he which hath called you is holy, so be ye holy in all manner of conversation;

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[MoreCoffee]

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Post #1 (MoreCoffee), with reference to 1 Peter 1:13-25:


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1 Corinthians 10:12: Wherefore let him that thinketh he standeth take heed lest he fall.
Romans 11:21: For if God spared not the natural branches, take heed lest he also spare not thee.
Philippians 3:11: If by any means I might attain unto the resurrection of the dead.
Matthew 10:22: And ye shall be hated of all men for my name's sake: but he that endureth to the end shall be saved.
Matthew 24:13: But he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved.
Mark 13:13: And ye shall be hated of all men for my name's sake: but he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved.
1 Peter 1:14-15:
14 As obedient children, not fashioning yourselves according to the former lusts in your ignorance:
15 But as he which hath called you is holy, so be ye holy in all manner of conversation;

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Lovely verses, do you think that they mean that a man or a woman is judged according to what they do? That is, according to their deeds, good or bad, and not on their faith alone?

 

[Arsenios]

Lovely verses, do you think that they mean that a man or a woman is judged according to what they do? That is, according to their deeds, good or bad, and not on their faith alone?

I do not look any longer for those whose treasury is the authority of the Bible to have anything resembling a comprehensive understanding of Scripture... Some Scriptures simply have to be ignored, or at the very least made not to mean what they plainly say, and this denial on the basis that other Scriptures preclude the plain meaning...

Which is why I prefer the Patristic Commentaries, because when a particular verse gives trouble, there will always be possible interepretations offered when one particular one is not mandated, and yet in some, there is but one, based on the praxis of the Faith of the Fathers...

This particular verse's meaning is plain and apparent, but I doubt seriously that you will find much response to your question... What we do is all important, and this God judges without respect of persons... And the Judgement of God determines our Salvation or condemnation...

I am beginning to think that questions like this are but the shooting of blanks in the dark...

The idea that we proceed from plain to obscure meanings across time in Scripture seems lost...


Arsenios

 

[MoreCoffee]

I do not look any longer for those whose treasury is the authority of the Bible to have anything resembling a comprehensive understanding of Scripture... Some Scriptures simply have to be ignored, or at the very least made not to mean what they plainly say, and this denial on the basis that other Scriptures preclude the plain meaning...

You're right. Without something to give coherence to the many verses (the Holy Spirit is the one who does it but he does it through the whole body and not through one man, one denomination, or one generation) some verses have to be discounted to magnify other verses; thus, for example John 6 is read by some as proof texts for God's choosing in a Calvinist matrix of interpretation despite the passage being centred on Christ's giving of himself as food and drink for life.

Which is why I prefer the Patristic Commentaries, because when a particular verse gives trouble, there will always be possible interpretations offered when one particular one is not mandated, and yet in some, there is but one, based on the praxis of the Faith of the Fathers...

Amen.

This particular verse's meaning is plain and apparent, but I doubt seriously that you will find much response to your question... What we do is all important, and this God judges without respect of persons... And the Judgement of God determines our Salvation or condemnation...

I am beginning to think that questions like this are but the shooting of blanks in the dark...

The idea that we proceed from plain to obscure meanings across time in Scripture seems lost...

Yes, I agree. There's little point in replying to many responses in CH now. I have stopped replying to all but an occasional post, such as yours or other posts that raise an interesting question. I pray that the readers who post little may gain something of value from the threads. God willing some will.

Arsenios

 

[Josiah]

17 You call upon a Father who makes no distinction between persons, but judges, according to each one’s deeds; take seriously, then, these years which you spend in a strange land. 18 Remember, that you were freed from the useless way of life of your ancestors, not with gold and silver, 19 but with the precious blood of the Lamb without spot or blemish. 20 God, who has known Christ before the world began, revealed him to you in the last days. 21 Through him, you have faith in God, who raised him from the dead, and glorified him, in order that you might put all your faith and hope in God.

In terms of narrow (or initial) justification, we will be judged. Some will stand before God on their own, pointing God to self (the will and works of self) and God will use that as the criteria. Others will point to Christ (the will and works of Jesus) and God will use that as the criteria. Do you trust in the Law or the Gospel? Do you look to the one in the mirror or the One on the Cross? Is your faith in you or the Savior? It is smart to realize that self falls short (the definition of "sin"). In this context, the Law is intended to crush, to kill - to cause us to realize the futility (the stupidity!) of relying on self.

While verse 21 seems to suggest the issue is justification (narrow), Peter is addressing this to Christians (thus already justified in this sense) so this may not be referring to narrow (initial) justification at all.... there is a judgement in Sanctification as well. A judgement NOT for heaven or hell, for eternal life or dead, but one that rewards lives of obedience and service. THAT is according to our own deeds. Some of you will be at the head table in the Banquet to come.... some of us will be way in the back, by the food table. Some of you will get nice, framable certificates.... some of us will just be applauding you while eating our cheesecake.

 

[MoreCoffee]

.... some of us will just be applauding you while eating our cheesecake.

One wonders if verses ever mean what they say or if every verse has to be put though a sieve of narrow this and that?

Verse 17 just says You [the faithful to whom saint Peter wrote] call upon a Father who makes no distinction between persons, but judges, according to each one’s deeds; take seriously, then, these years which you spend in a strange land.

 

[Arsenios]

One wonders if verses ever mean what they say or if every verse has to be put though a sieve of narrow this and that?

Well, it does give "narrow mindedness" a moderately new dimension, I should say!

Verse 17 just says You [the faithful to whom saint Peter wrote] call upon a Father who makes no distinction between persons, but judges, according to each one’s deeds; take seriously, then, these years which you spend in a strange land.

Yes, if one has a theological sophistication that requires plain meanings to be strained through sieves in order for the sophistry to be true, the sophistry then is itself called into serious question... I mean, there are indeed some obscure and difficult texts, but they are approached through the ones not obscure and difficult... To say that a plain meaning CANNOT mean what it means because another text contradicts it, simply confesses that the one saying so understands NEITHER (text)...


Arsenios

 

[MoreCoffee]

Well, it does give "narrow mindedness" a moderately new dimension, I should say!



Yes, if one has a theological sophistication that requires plain meanings to be strained through sieves in order for the sophistry to be true, the sophistry then is itself called into serious question... I mean, there are indeed some obscure and difficult texts, but they are approached through the ones not obscure and difficult... To say that a plain meaning CANNOT mean what it means because another text contradicts it, simply confesses that the one saying so understands NEITHER (text)...


Arsenios

It's inserting theology between one's self and God. It's worse than inserting priests or rituals between yourself and God because theology is unresponsive as well as purely intellectual. It make holy scripture into the image of the limited ideas of the men who created the theology. It narrows both the mind and the soul.

 

[MennoSota]

It's inserting theology between one's self and God. It's worse than inserting priests or rituals between yourself and God because theology is unresponsive as well as purely intellectual. It make holy scripture into the image of the limited ideas of the men who created the theology. It narrows both the mind and the soul.

Many men create theology from their own philosophy. Godward theology is built upon God's revealed word as humans observe what God says.
Discernment is required to recognize when Godward theology is neglecting the fullness of God's word to prooftext an opinion that is not supported by the entire weight of scripture. Flagrant prooftexting accounts for much of the faulty theology in Christian based denominations, churches and individuals.

 

[Pedrito]

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Post #1 (MoreCoffee), with reference to 1 Peter 1:13-25:

...17 You call upon a Father who makes no distinction between persons, but judges, according to each one’s deeds; take seriously, then, these years which you spend in a strange land....

...What does it mean when it says that God will judge according to each one’s deeds?

==============================================================================================

Me, in Post #2:

1 Corinthians 10:12: Wherefore let him that thinketh he standeth take heed lest he fall.
Romans 11:21: For if God spared not the natural branches, take heed lest he also spare not thee.
Philippians 3:11: If by any means I might attain unto the resurrection of the dead.
Matthew 10:22: And ye shall be hated of all men for my name's sake: but he that endureth to the end shall be saved.
Matthew 24:13: But he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved.
Mark 13:13: And ye shall be hated of all men for my name's sake: but he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved.
1 Peter 1:14-15:
14 As obedient children, not fashioning yourselves according to the former lusts in your ignorance:
15 But as he which hath called you is holy, so be ye holy in all manner of conversation;

==============================================================================================

MoreCoffee in Post #3:

Lovely verses, do you think that they mean that a man or a woman is judged according to what they do? That is, according to their deeds, good or bad, and not on their faith alone?

==============================================================================================

Expressed in terms that apply generally to the doctrines of Christendom as they currently stand, there are three identifiable levels of meaning that operate simultaneously:

1. Pagans/heathens/unbelievers are judged according to their unransomed works (thoughts, actions, attitudes). John 3:18 is often invoked in that context. The destiny of people in that category is said to be eternal torture.

2. Believers who don’t take their (I’ve heard it called) “Christian walk” seriously, miss out on some future blessings. 1 Corinthians 3:10-15 is instructive in that context. (Despite statements one might see or hear stating that there are no degrees or levels of blessing in Heaven. If there are no future implications, then why does the Apostle even raise the subject?)

3.Believers who turn their back on the faith they once had, are headed for a sticky end. 1 John 5:16-17 is one of a number of references (I didn’t say “a raft of”, notice) that indicate that. I’ve seen the term “apostates” used to describe those people, and not just by JWs. (Despite representations from the “once saved, always saved” perspective.)

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Those are some thoughts, for what they are worth (if anything).

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[MoreCoffee]

Many men create theology from their own philosophy. Godward theology is built upon God's revealed word as humans observe what God says.
Discernment is required to recognize when Godward theology is neglecting the fullness of God's word to prooftext an opinion that is not supported by the entire weight of scripture. Flagrant prooftexting accounts for much of the faulty theology in Christian based denominations, churches and individuals.

Doest thou believe according to what thou hast written?

 

[MennoSota]

Doest thou believe according to what thou hast written?

Why would I state otherwise. Dost thou desire to end your poor prooftexting?

 

[MoreCoffee]

Why would I state otherwise.

Many reasons come to mind.

 

[MennoSota]

Many reasons come to mind.

Your cryptic vagueness aside...I have been consistent in calling upon the whole of scripture to interpret the individual statement. Unfortunately you have exhibited a propensity for ignoring the whole while twisting the individual statement to your own liking. Perhaps you're simply ignorant of your tendency.

 

[MoreCoffee]

I have been consistent in calling upon the whole of scripture to interpret the individual statement.

That isn't true.

 

[MennoSota]

That isn't true.

I disagree. You are free to think as you wish.

 

[MoreCoffee]

I disagree. You are free to think as you wish.

No permission is required from any on CH for any other on CH to think as they wish.

 

[MennoSota]

No permission is required from any on CH for any other on CH to think as they wish.

As I said, you are free to think as you wish. You can continue to present prooftexted opinions that are not supported by the whole of scripture and I can continue to show you why your opinion is all wet.

 

[MoreCoffee]

As I said, you are free to think as you wish. You can continue to present prooftexted opinions that are not supported by the whole of scripture and I can continue to show you why your opinion is all wet.

The truth is neither an opinion nor in need of permission to be expressed in CH. The truth is that God judges, according to each one’s deeds.