Sunday is God's day of Worship

[Lamb]

do you go and do it ?
are you taught to go and do it ?
are you trained to go and do it ..?
not by the organisations you refer to as "church" ..

so what they are teaching you is how to know a book .. not how to do what the book instructs

as i said before it is like teaching an army the theory of warfare and never teaching them how to handle or use a weapon .worthless when war comes .

i have asked you very precisely to state when you or any one else in ANY congregation has been taught instructed and disciples in the basics of the things the lord Jesus has commanded us to do .. and the answer has been a resounding silence .
it says it all .

the organisations you call "church" are not what they claim to be . and we are not called upon to worship on any particular day but to worship as a life of obedience every single day -our lives to be a "living sacrifice " not a singular sacrifice but a living one .. ongoing . just as repentance is a state of life not a one off event (we are to be consistently renewing the mind .. not only 2 hours on one day )

folks here can argue sat or sunday pointlessly . its a life not a day

We are taught God's Word in church. Is that not enough?

 

[psalms 91]

Not unless you do it

 

[visionary]

https://www.thewaydoc.com/the-way-documentary-trailer/

 

[Lamb]

Not unless you do it

God's Word does not return to Him empty Isaiah 55:11.

 

[amadeois]

About but not in Him.

Sent from my SM-N900T using Tapatalk

 

[tango]

whats it got to do with the general worthlessness of what denominational establishments teach their pew warmers .. if their pew warmers are still warming pews ,whether in that congregation or another, 20 years later and are not going and doing what the lord Jesus commanded us to go and do ,mostly because they either don't want to or they have not been taught how to- then what they are being taught is generally worthless .obedience is not a theory . and the gifts you speak of are for what purpose / to equip that body to the service . not to just do over and over inside a meeting . the service of the work of the gospel in every aspect .

Do you have anything to say other than general comments about some churches being useless?

If all you're going to do is take a few examples (you never replied to my question about how/whether you are qualified to judge the worldwide church) and assume that every church is just the same then why stop there with the logical fallacies?

I really don't know what you're trying to do here, it seems all you're doing is building more and more strawmen and knocking them over. Anyone can do that. If you could address the points being made that would be a good start.

The closest you've come in this post to addressing what I actually said was to comment on the use of the gifts. The gifts may be of use both within and without the church (however you care to define "the church"). Maybe God calls us to heal someone who has been a regular at our church for years. Maybe there's a prophetic word to give to someone who isn't a Christian but is considering Christ's call and wondering if there's any truth in it. Maybe God wants us to speak in tongues so that a native speaker of the language we speak is convicted and repents. Why put God in a box and assume we know better than he does how he wants the gifts of his spirit to be used?

 

[Alithis]

We are taught God's Word in church. Is that not enough?

though i reply to your post .. it is not to YOU (singular) i reply .

if you don't do it .. which you will struggle to do if you are not decipled in how .. then not only is it not enough, it is a disobedience by the organisation you call church. it is not fully the fault of the individual although al we need to know how is written in the bible ,much of it is glazed over by the layers of religiosity it is wrapped up with when it is delivered to us by the system many call "church"

Jesus commanded .. teach them to observe (that ,means to go and abide by and do ,not look at ) everything i have commanded you ...

look what they have taught you ..your church says - just read the bible and everything will be automatically done .
Jesus says .. GO and DO it teaching all others also to observe the things i have commanded you .

there us a chasm of difference between learning what is written in the bible and /or reciting it - and going and doing what it tels us to go and do.one is a hearer but not a doer .and we are warned about that.for the gospel is not in words only but i the demonstration of the power of god .. to demonstrate a thing we must go out and DO it .
a wood cutter can explain the basics of chopping down a tress . but until he takes you outside and shows you how to swing the axe .. the theory is "worthless to most people . (same principles)

if God through his word tells us to go and do things and we
a- refuse to ,-we are in rebellion
b- refuse to teach others to , -we are in rebellion
the organisation many call thier "church" is in a state of rebellion and we cant deny it because no one here from a cross section of denominations has been able to categorically tel me when i,in however many years they have attended , they have EVER been taught instructed shown or decided .HOW to do some of the most fundamental things the lord Jesus taught is to do .

i know that steps on so many toes to say so. but it is ,albeit generalized , an evidently true statement

be objective about the topic .. stand back and take a look .in all our years of attendance when has an elder paaster minister preist so called apostle prophet healer whatever .. taken you out of the sunday pew and demonstrated yo you HOW to obey the lord Jesus ..? the answer in a guessed 99% of cases and churches and denominations is .. ZERO /
i never saw it in 30 years across a number of denominations . and neither has any one else here in a greater number of congregations and denominations . there is something fundamentally wrong with the Sunday (or any day ) system we name "church" .. it is a far removed from the book of acts as it can be . and is spiritually killing us by making us unequipped to obey the Lord Jesus .

come out of it -find people why ARE doing the things Jesus says and they will/ can teach you how not because they are better, but simply because they are doing it! you cant be taught it by an institution that is not doing it , you cant teach what you do not practice .
if you truly desire to serve the lord out of love for him.. do not remain in an institution that refuses to teach you HOW .. and expect them to suddenly change , they will to not change , they haven't in 1700 years , they wont now .

in all the things i preach of the gospel salvation grace obedience from love of the lord Jesus .. the MOST opposition i get is never from the world ,it is from the established man made organisation people call "church" .

 

[Alithis]

Do you have anything to say other than general comments about some churches being useless?

If all you're going to do is take a few examples (you never replied to my question about how/whether you are qualified to judge the worldwide church) and assume that every church is just the same then why stop there with the logical fallacies?

I really don't know what you're trying to do here, it seems all you're doing is building more and more strawmen and knocking them over. Anyone can do that. If you could address the points being made that would be a good start.

The closest you've come in this post to addressing what I actually said was to comment on the use of the gifts. The gifts may be of use both within and without the church (however you care to define "the church"). Maybe God calls us to heal someone who has been a regular at our church for years. Maybe there's a prophetic word to give to someone who isn't a Christian but is considering Christ's call and wondering if there's any truth in it. Maybe God wants us to speak in tongues so that a native speaker of the language we speak is convicted and repents. Why put God in a box and assume we know better than he does how he wants the gifts of his spirit to be used?

you have never replied to my question about stataing when you last experienced your church not just teaching you ABOUT the bible but how to DO that which it instructs..
and when you did you ambiguously changed the topic onto tongues and prophesy .these are gifts for edifying the body within the body .. they are nothing to do with obeying the lord Jesus in what he has commanded us to DO . go out heal the sick preach the gospel drive out demons Baptise people and make more disciples .

i was accused of making a false claim .. yet no one here representing a wide number of denominations and differing congregations over a wide number of years has yet presented me with a testimony with god as our witness ,of being taken out of the Sunday 2 hour seat and being taught shown instructed or decided in HOW to DO these basic things the lord Jesus commanded all believers to do .''
\and the ministry of reconciliation is given to ALL believers . bar none . the system you call church has kept you wrapped up an unequipped . and you cant deny it .

 

[Lamb]

The answer in what I've seen from your response is that God's Word is not enough for the Holy Spirit to work within you. That's false theology in my opinion. I know you feel my theology is false as well.

though i reply to your post .. it is not to YOU (singular) i reply .

if you don't do it .. which you will struggle to do if you are not decipled in how .. then not only is it not enough, it is a disobedience by the organisation you call church. it is not fully the fault of the individual although al we need to know how is written in the bible ,much of it is glazed over by the layers of religiosity it is wrapped up with when it is delivered to us by the system many call "church"

Jesus commanded .. teach them to observe (that ,means to go and abide by and do ,not look at ) everything i have commanded you ...

look what they have taught you ..your church says - just read the bible and everything will be automatically done .
Jesus says .. GO and DO it teaching all others also to observe the things i have commanded you .

there us a chasm of difference between learning what is written in the bible and /or reciting it - and going and doing what it tels us to go and do.one is a hearer but not a doer .and we are warned about that.for the gospel is not in words only but i the demonstration of the power of god .. to demonstrate a thing we must go out and DO it .
a wood cutter can explain the basics of chopping down a tress . but until he takes you outside and shows you how to swing the axe .. the theory is "worthless to most people . (same principles)

if God through his word tells us to go and do things and we
a- refuse to ,-we are in rebellion
b- refuse to teach others to , -we are in rebellion
the organisation many call thier "church" is in a state of rebellion and we cant deny it because no one here from a cross section of denominations has been able to categorically tel me when i,in however many years they have attended , they have EVER been taught instructed shown or decided .HOW to do some of the most fundamental things the lord Jesus taught is to do .

i know that steps on so many toes to say so. but it is ,albeit generalized , an evidently true statement

be objective about the topic .. stand back and take a look .in all our years of attendance when has an elder paaster minister preist so called apostle prophet healer whatever .. taken you out of the sunday pew and demonstrated yo you HOW to obey the lord Jesus ..? the answer in a guessed 99% of cases and churches and denominations is .. ZERO /
i never saw it in 30 years across a number of denominations . and neither has any one else here in a greater number of congregations and denominations . there is something fundamentally wrong with the Sunday (or any day ) system we name "church" .. it is a far removed from the book of acts as it can be . and is spiritually killing us by making us unequipped to obey the Lord Jesus .

come out of it -find people why ARE doing the things Jesus says and they will/ can teach you how not because they are better, but simply because they are doing it! you cant be taught it by an institution that is not doing it , you cant teach what you do not practice .
if you truly desire to serve the lord out of love for him.. do not remain in an institution that refuses to teach you HOW .. and expect them to suddenly change , they will to not change , they haven't in 1700 years , they wont now .

in all the things i preach of the gospel salvation grace obedience from love of the lord Jesus .. the MOST opposition i get is never from the world ,it is from the established man made organisation people call "church" .

 

[psalms 91]

Without the Holy Ghost to guide you you will find right interpretation difficult if not impossible

 

[tango]

look what they have taught you ..your church says - just read the bible and everything will be automatically done .

Which church says this? My church certainly doesn't say that all I have to do is sit in the corner and read the Bible and everything else will fall into place. Reading the Bible is important but in isolation it's worthless. I don't know why you keep banging on about that, I don't see anybody disputing it. You just seem to have got it into your head that churches (universally speaking) are telling people they don't need to do anything more. I can believe that some churches are like that but let's cut the assumption that it's anywhere near universal?

Jesus says .. GO and DO it teaching all others also to observe the things i have commanded you .

there us a chasm of difference between learning what is written in the bible and /or reciting it - and going and doing what it tels us to go and do.one is a hearer but not a doer .and we are warned about that.for the gospel is not in words only but i the demonstration of the power of god .. to demonstrate a thing we must go out and DO it .
a wood cutter can explain the basics of chopping down a tress . but until he takes you outside and shows you how to swing the axe .. the theory is "worthless to most people . (same principles)

We can get busy loving people the way Jesus told us to without being taught how to do it. We can't be taught how to love anyway, if the fundamental problem is that we don't love others no amount of teaching or demonstration will give us that love. We might put up a convincing show but we won't be fooling God.

if God through his word tells us to go and do things and we
a- refuse to ,-we are in rebellion
b- refuse to teach others to , -we are in rebellion
the organisation many call thier "church" is in a state of rebellion and we cant deny it because no one here from a cross section of denominations has been able to categorically tel me when i,in however many years they have attended , they have EVER been taught instructed shown or decided .HOW to do some of the most fundamental things the lord Jesus taught is to do .

Yawn, more comments about "the church" as if it were a universal matter.

i know that steps on so many toes to say so. but it is ,albeit generalized , an evidently true statement

It treads on toes because you appear to be making a sweeping generalisation you appear unqualified to make.

Here's the thing. Your public profile says you're based in New Zealand. I have never been to New Zealand. So if you want to comment on the churches in, say, Christchurch I'd figure you're probably talking about churches you have personally attended. Having never been to any of the churches there I have no basis to specifically agree or disagree with you so all I'd have is a decision whether I find your words plausible or not. And to be honest it makes little difference because what churches the other side of the world are doing is of little consequence to my life anyway. But so many of your comments are so generic it's as if you truly believe that "the church" as a universal entity is doing all these things. You've repeatedly refused to clarify how and indeed whether you are qualified to comment on churches across the world so it's hard to assume anything other than that you have some kind of problem with "the church" and are determined to undermine it as an entity even if it means using all sorts of silly logical fallacies to do so.

be objective about the topic .. stand back and take a look .in all our years of attendance when has an elder paaster minister preist so called apostle prophet healer whatever .. taken you out of the sunday pew and demonstrated yo you HOW to obey the lord Jesus ..? the answer in a guessed 99% of cases and churches and denominations is .. ZERO /
i never saw it in 30 years across a number of denominations . and neither has any one else here in a greater number of congregations and denominations . there is something fundamentally wrong with the Sunday (or any day ) system we name "church" .. it is a far removed from the book of acts as it can be . and is spiritually killing us by making us unequipped to obey the Lord Jesus .

I've asked this before and I'll ask it again. How about listing things you think might help rather than endlessly griping that "the church" isn't doing what you think it should be doing. How do you teach another to love? If we love we can show that love in all sorts of ways. Maybe loving someone involves helping them with a building project. Maybe it involves making them a meal following a bereavement when they need to eat but just can't think straight and it gives them one less thing to worry about. Maybe it involves spending a couple of hours with an elderly person who spends all day every day alone and just craves a bit of human company. Maybe it involves childminding for a single mother so she can have an evening off her parental duties and let her hair down a little. It can take so many forms it's pointless to try and teach people that "this is how you love others". And, as Paul said, if we have no love nothing else matters.

come out of it -find people why ARE doing the things Jesus says and they will/ can teach you how not because they are better, but simply because they are doing it! you cant be taught it by an institution that is not doing it , you cant teach what you do not practice .
if you truly desire to serve the lord out of love for him.. do not remain in an institution that refuses to teach you HOW .. and expect them to suddenly change , they will to not change , they haven't in 1700 years , they wont now .

in all the things i preach of the gospel salvation grace obedience from love of the lord Jesus .. the MOST opposition i get is never from the world ,it is from the established man made organisation people call "church" .

With respect, given the way you've been talking of "the church" I can't say I'm surprised.

 

[tango]

you have never replied to my question about stataing when you last experienced your church not just teaching you ABOUT the bible but how to DO that which it instructs..
and when you did you ambiguously changed the topic onto tongues and prophesy .these are gifts for edifying the body within the body .. they are nothing to do with obeying the lord Jesus in what he has commanded us to DO . go out heal the sick preach the gospel drive out demons Baptise people and make more disciples .

i was accused of making a false claim .. yet no one here representing a wide number of denominations and differing congregations over a wide number of years has yet presented me with a testimony with god as our witness ,of being taken out of the Sunday 2 hour seat and being taught shown instructed or decided in HOW to DO these basic things the lord Jesus commanded all believers to do .''
\and the ministry of reconciliation is given to ALL believers . bar none . the system you call church has kept you wrapped up an unequipped . and you cant deny it .

I already wrote one post that touched on this (only a few seconds ago, so don't take that as a dig!).

The church cannot teach me to love others, and if I truly love others then I don't need to be taught how to express that love.

You still didn't say how you think the church should teach us how to do the things you keep listing. Acts 3 is a pretty good example. I don't need to follow a man's interpretation of Acts 3 when I can read the original for myself.

I don't honestly see any point in expecting people to line up to confirm that their faith involves more than sitting on a pew for a couple of hours on a Sunday. I don't doubt for a minute that there are people like that (I was one myself for a time during my teenage years, going through the motions and putting on a show because I quite liked one of the girls in the choir)

And your endless comments that "church" is keeping me wrapped up and unequipped is not only comical but frankly increasingly tedious in its endless repetition without evidence.

 

[Alithis]

The answer in what I've seen from your response is that God's Word is not enough for the Holy Spirit to work within you. That's false theology in my opinion. I know you feel my theology is false as well.

Lol .your implying that what man teaches "about"the scripture is greater the. What god says. Tut tut.
Your right..its just your defensive opinion.
nothing more.
Gods word is more then sufficient and the more you know it..the more he will ask you..why did you not obey me and go and do it then.

 

[Alithis]

Which church says this? My church certainly doesn't say that all I have to do is sit in the corner and read the Bible and everything else will fall into place. Reading the Bible is important but in isolation it's worthless. I don't know why you keep banging on about that, I don't see anybody disputing it. You just seem to have got it into your head that churches (universally speaking) are telling people they don't need to do anything more. I can believe that some churches are ....
<Snip>

It treads on toes because you appear to be making a sweeping generalisation you appear unqualified to make.

I've asked this before and I'll ask it again. How about listing things you think might help rather than endlessly griping ..........<snipped because its too long to include in reply ......>

How about not griping about me and adressing the topic.

Iv never said it wasnt a generalisation.
But here there are represented a number of denoms across a number of countries and most has attended a number of congragations.. And none.including yourself have presented ..with god as witness. When you were trained ,instructed ,taught ,decipled in how to do the basic things jesus comanned us to do.

Your taught. Denominational theories and preferences.
Stop making apssumptions about why im presenting these points... Practice what you preach man.

And remember this branched off the topic because i was specifically asked by a mod if i think the church is worthless and ihavee spoken that in reflavtion to What it teaches..what it teaches is worthless because it leaves people sitting in pews still doing next to nothing 20 years later.

And you know its a fact.

 

[ThreeAngels]

I agree and I go to church on Sunday but my day of worship is Saturday as I still think God wants us to honnor it but any day that someone wants to set aside to worship and meditate on Gods word is fine

The Sabbath is a day of assembly, 'Six days shall work be done: but the seventh day is the sabbath of rest, an holy convocation; ye shall do no work therein: it is the sabbath of the Lord in all your dwellings.' Lev 23:3. Paul and the early church set aside the Sabbath as a day of worship 'And on the Sabbath we went out of the city by a river side, where prayer was wont to be made,' Acts 16:13. By attending church on Sunday we pay respect to an institution created by man and encourage those who teach error that is a deadly poison to the soul and teach for doctrines the commandments of men. 'Cease, my son, to hear the instruction that causeth to err from the words of knowledge,' Prov 19:27

 

[visionary]

While the flaws of religious organizations can clearly be seen from the outside, the endeavors of believers from these groups have gone around the world in spreading the gospel, their organizations reaches, and brought countless people to hearing the Word of God. The Word of God has been translated into almost all the languages of the world because of religious organization, and the Word of God has been smuggled to countries that have closed the door.

We need to see the believers in all capacities from politics to military personnel. We need to be seen as believers first and denominations, not so much. We are entering into the last generation, where the outpouring of love for our fellow believer should be making every effort to save those trapped in hostile situations. Believers do not need to be the next genocide. Because of the multitude of denominations, and the inner conflicts of doctrines, we have turned a blind eye to the slaughter.