YourTruthGod
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I doubt that you are reading the Bible in Koine Greek and translating it by a Koine Greek dictionary.
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I doubt that you are reading the Bible in Koine Greek and translating it by a Koine Greek dictionary.
RichWh1
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You would be incorrect. I have in my possession a Koine Greek NT
I also possess other English translations.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
YourTruthGod
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So tell me what mistakes are in the KJV today, and the other English translations that would change the meaning of the scripture we are discussing?
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Arsenios
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Let's take a look...
Matthew 27:3
Then Judas, which had betrayed him,
when he saw that he was condemned,
repented himself,
and brought again the thirty pieces of silver
to the chief priests and elders,
That translation says: "Judas repented himself..."
Matthew 27:3 - BYZ –
τοτε ιδων (5631) ιουδας ο παραδιδους (5723) αυτον
Then take heed: Judas who betrayed Him
οτι κατεκριθη (5681) μεταμεληθεις (5679)
Because he was condemned having felt regret
απεστρεψεν (5656) τα τριακοντα αργυρια
returned the thirty silvers
τοις αρχιερευσιν και τοις πρεσβυτεροις
to the arch-priests and to the elders.
He felt regret, through which he should have repented...
Regret is the feeling that leads to repentance - At least it should...
Yet instead of repenting, he killed himself...
The KJV does not make this clear at all - He did not "repent himself", although in a strange kind of way this does tell the truth - Because "repenting himself" is what he did, by killing himself, which is not repentance... So you have a pretty good approach to the meaning, saying he repented, even though he did not by killing himself... Repentance is turning FROM self TO God... Instead, he embraced his very own self-judgement and in this unrepentant state killed himself...
If any is willing...
After Me to come...
Let him first deny himself...
Then take up his cross...
And follow Me...
Christ's very words,
The Call to Repentance of our Lord...
The Greek word for repentance is not μεταμελoς (metamelos) but metanoia...
The mellomai of metamelos means "to be about to do", or be "at the point of action"...
The nous of the noia of metanoia means "mind" in its primal function, which directs thoughts and discerns identities...
But the basic point is that Judas did not repent because he killed himself...
And suicide is not repentance...
Arsenios
Arsenios
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Here is the Chrysostom commentary:
Then Judas, which had betrayed him, when he saw that He was condemned, repented, and brought again the thirty pieces of silver.
This was a charge both against him, and against these men; against him, not because he repented, but because he did so, late, and slowly, and became self-condemned (for that he delivered Him up, he himself confessed); and against them, for that having the power to reverse it, they repented not.
But mark, when it is that he feels remorse. When his sin was completed, and had received an accomplishment. For the devil is like this; he suffers not those that are not watchful to see the evil before this, lest he whom he has taken, should repent. At least, when Jesus was saying so many things, he was not influenced, but when his offense was completed, then repentance came upon him; and not then profitably. For to condemn it, and to throw down the pieces of silver, and not to regard the Jewish people, were all acceptable things; but to hang himself, this again was unpardonable, and a work of an evil spirit. For the devil led him out of his repentance too soon, so that he should reap no fruit from thence; and carries him off, by a most disgraceful death, and one manifest to all, having persuaded him to destroy himself.
But mark, I pray you, the truth shining forth on every side, even by what the adversaries both do and suffer. For indeed even the very end of the traitor stops the mouths of them that had condemned Him, and suffers them not to have so much as any shadow of an excuse, that is surely shameless. For what could they have to say, when the traitor is shown to pass such a sentence on himself.
But let us see also the words, what is said; He brought again the thirty pieces of silver to the chief priests, and says, I have sinned in that I have betrayed innocent blood. And they said, what is that to us? See thou to that. And he cast down the pieces of silver in the temple, and departed, and went and hanged himself.
For neither could he bear his conscience scourging him. But mark, I pray you, the Jews too suffering the same things. For these men also, when they ought to have been amended by what they suffered, do not stop, until they have completed their sin. For his sin had been completed, for it was a betrayal; but theirs not yet. But when they too had accomplished theirs, and had nailed Him to the cross then they also are troubled; at one time saying, Write not, this is the king of the Jews John 19:21 (and yet why are you afraid? Why are you troubled at a dead body that is nailed upon the cross?); at another time they guard over Him, saying, Lest His disciples steal Him away, and say that He is risen again; so the last error shall be worse than the first. And yet if they do it, the thing is refuted, if it be not true. But how should they say so, which did not dare so much as to stand their ground, when He was seized; and the chief of them even thrice denied Him, not bearing a damsel's threat. But, as I said, the chief priests were now troubled; for that they knew the act was a transgression of the law is manifest, from their saying, See thou to that.
Hear, you covetous, consider what befell him; how he at the same time lost the money, and committed the sin, and destroyed his own soul. Such is the tyranny of covetousness. He enjoyed not the money, neither the present life, nor that to come, but lost all at once, and having got a bad character even with those very men, so hanged himself.
Arsenios
Then Judas, which had betrayed him, when he saw that He was condemned, repented, and brought again the thirty pieces of silver.
This was a charge both against him, and against these men; against him, not because he repented, but because he did so, late, and slowly, and became self-condemned (for that he delivered Him up, he himself confessed); and against them, for that having the power to reverse it, they repented not.
But mark, when it is that he feels remorse. When his sin was completed, and had received an accomplishment. For the devil is like this; he suffers not those that are not watchful to see the evil before this, lest he whom he has taken, should repent. At least, when Jesus was saying so many things, he was not influenced, but when his offense was completed, then repentance came upon him; and not then profitably. For to condemn it, and to throw down the pieces of silver, and not to regard the Jewish people, were all acceptable things; but to hang himself, this again was unpardonable, and a work of an evil spirit. For the devil led him out of his repentance too soon, so that he should reap no fruit from thence; and carries him off, by a most disgraceful death, and one manifest to all, having persuaded him to destroy himself.
But mark, I pray you, the truth shining forth on every side, even by what the adversaries both do and suffer. For indeed even the very end of the traitor stops the mouths of them that had condemned Him, and suffers them not to have so much as any shadow of an excuse, that is surely shameless. For what could they have to say, when the traitor is shown to pass such a sentence on himself.
But let us see also the words, what is said; He brought again the thirty pieces of silver to the chief priests, and says, I have sinned in that I have betrayed innocent blood. And they said, what is that to us? See thou to that. And he cast down the pieces of silver in the temple, and departed, and went and hanged himself.
For neither could he bear his conscience scourging him. But mark, I pray you, the Jews too suffering the same things. For these men also, when they ought to have been amended by what they suffered, do not stop, until they have completed their sin. For his sin had been completed, for it was a betrayal; but theirs not yet. But when they too had accomplished theirs, and had nailed Him to the cross then they also are troubled; at one time saying, Write not, this is the king of the Jews John 19:21 (and yet why are you afraid? Why are you troubled at a dead body that is nailed upon the cross?); at another time they guard over Him, saying, Lest His disciples steal Him away, and say that He is risen again; so the last error shall be worse than the first. And yet if they do it, the thing is refuted, if it be not true. But how should they say so, which did not dare so much as to stand their ground, when He was seized; and the chief of them even thrice denied Him, not bearing a damsel's threat. But, as I said, the chief priests were now troubled; for that they knew the act was a transgression of the law is manifest, from their saying, See thou to that.
Hear, you covetous, consider what befell him; how he at the same time lost the money, and committed the sin, and destroyed his own soul. Such is the tyranny of covetousness. He enjoyed not the money, neither the present life, nor that to come, but lost all at once, and having got a bad character even with those very men, so hanged himself.
Arsenios
YourTruthGod
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He repented means the same things as he repented himself.
Arsenios
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The Chrysostom commentary indicates it was a shallow repentance that entered into demonic deception and suicide...
Which is why the proper word for repentance, metanoia, was not used...
Arsenios
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YourTruthGod
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No such thing as a demonic repentance.
Arsenios
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The term used was SHALLOW repentance...
Which ends up in demonic deception...
DEEP repentance is what is needed...
It is sought with tears in wretchedness...
"Blessed are the poor in spirit..."
Arsenios
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No such thing as demonic repentance.
Arsenios
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Good thing neither of us said it then!!
Are you in a bad mood perchance??
Or was that not a door I heard slam?
Arsenios
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Arsenios, why do you have to think the worst? I can't tell you how good I feel talking about the things of God with you.