Visions, dreams, and prophecies a danger or a blessing?

[MoreCoffee]

Saint Peter wrote:

2Peter 1:19-21 And we have the prophetic spoken word made more sure. You will do well to pay attention to this as to a lamp shining in a dark place, until the day dawns and the morning star rises in your hearts. 20 First of all you must understand this, that no prophecy of scripture is a matter of one's own interpretation, 21 because no prophecy ever came by the impulse of man, but men moved by the Holy Spirit spoke from God.​

His advice is sound. The faithful ought to be careful about what they accept as true. There are many in the world claiming to have a revelation from God. Be careful. The Lord Jesus Christ said:

Matthew 7:15-20 Beware of false prophets, who come to you in sheep's clothing but inwardly are ravenous wolves. 16 You will know them by their fruits. Are grapes gathered from thorns, or figs from thistles? 17 So, every sound tree bears good fruit, but the bad tree bears evil fruit. 18 A sound tree cannot bear evil fruit, nor can a bad tree bear good fruit. 19 Every tree that does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire. 20 Thus you will know them by their fruits.​

Test the prophets and seers and those calling themselves apostles to see if their fruit is godly. Saint John wrote:

1John 4:1 Beloved, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits to see whether they are of God; for many false prophets have gone out into the world.​

So test what a visionary, prophet, apostle, or other teacher says and see if it is holy and just and good. You will know if you are believing what is true if you follow this teaching:

1John 3:21-24 Beloved, if our hearts do not condemn us, we have confidence before God; 22 and we receive from him whatever we ask, because we keep his commandments and do what pleases him. 23 And this is his commandment, that we should believe in the name of his Son Jesus Christ and love one another, just as he has commanded us. 24 All who keep his commandments abide in him, and he in them. And by this we know that he abides in us, by the Spirit which he has given us.​

 

[psalms 91]

Iagree that we should be careful but to many become afraid and reject anything prophetic at all and that is wrong

 

[MoreCoffee]

Iagree that we should be careful but to many become afraid and reject anything prophetic at all and that is wrong

Many claims are made to speak for God today. Which of the claims do you say is the spoken word of God?

 

[psalms 91]

The ones the Holy Spirit say are. Truth will resound with your spirit

 

[Rens]

Many claims are made to speak for God today. Which of the claims do you say is the spoken word of God?

It's quite easy. One prophet said we would have revival and whole Holland saved in 2012. What do you think? Was it wishful thinking of himself?

 

[MoreCoffee]

It's quite easy. One prophet said we would have revival and whole Holland saved in 2012. What do you think? Was it wishful thinking of himself?

Did you have revival in 2012? If not then the scripture has this to say about that prophet's claim.

Deuteronomy 18:22 when a prophet speaks in the name of Jehovah, if the word does not come to pass or come true, that is a word which Jehovah has not spoken; the prophet has spoken it presumptuously, you need not be afraid of him.​

 

[MoreCoffee]

Many claims are made to speak for God today. Which of the claims do you say is the spoken word of God?

The ones the Holy Spirit say are. Truth will resound with your spirit

There's a better test given in the holy scriptures, do you know what it is?

 

[psalms 91]

There's a better test given in the holy scriptures, do you know what it is?

It has to line up with the scripture and I ask you if something you hear is about end times it could line up but is it truth? You had better know

 

[MoreCoffee]

It has to line up with the scripture and I ask you if something you hear is about end times it could line up but is it truth? You had better know

Truth is is what God says.

John 17:17 Sanctify them in the truth; thy spoken word is truth.​

 

[tango]

The ones the Holy Spirit say are. Truth will resound with your spirit

You need a lot more than "it will resound with your spirit" to validate something as true.

In one church I attended for a short while all sorts of things were deemed good because they "resounded with" someone's spirit, or considered safe because someone said they didn't "get any checks in their spirit". At the same time they disturbed me so badly I couldn't stand to be in the building.

One of us was obviously badly wrong. It might have been them, it might have been me. But it goes to show that we need more than "it feels right" to determine whether something is sound or not. That's where we test things against Scripture rather than the vague yardstick of resounding or similar.

 

[tango]

There's a better test given in the holy scriptures, do you know what it is?

1Th 5:19-21 NKJV Do not quench the Spirit. (20) Do not despise prophecies. (21) Test all things; hold fast what is good.

I like the balance here between not despising prophecies but testing all things. Too far one way and we accept all sorts of garbage as being of divine origin, too far the other way and we block our ears and refuse to let God speak to us.

Act 17:10-11 NKJV Then the brethren immediately sent Paul and Silas away by night to Berea. When they arrived, they went into the synagogue of the Jews. (11) These were more fair-minded than those in Thessalonica, in that they received the word with all readiness, and searched the Scriptures daily to find out whether these things were so.

This shows a good indication of how we might test. The Bereans searched the Scriptures to verify what they were taught. Of course another way was taught by Jesus:

Mat 7:15-20 NKJV "Beware of false prophets, who come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ravenous wolves. (16) You will know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes from thornbushes or figs from thistles? (17) Even so, every good tree bears good fruit, but a bad tree bears bad fruit. (18) A good tree cannot bear bad fruit, nor can a bad tree bear good fruit. (19) Every tree that does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire. (20) Therefore by their fruits you will know them.

The trouble with this is that it's hard to test someone's fruits unless we can spend some time with them. When I look at the minister of my church I can get a good idea of how he looks after his church, I can see how patient he is with people, how he reacts to the more awkward members of the congregation (every church has at least one), how he treats his family and so on. But when "Prophet" Joe Blow, the chief executive and president of Joe Blow Ministries International, presents a message he claims is from God the chances are I'm never going to meet him in person and certainly not going to spend enough time with him to test his fruits. Therefore all I can do is test his message against what Scripture teaches.

Another thing I've found is that if people don't want their words tested there's usually a good reason for it. If someone seems too keen to stress that their words are sound, that they have "already been tested", or pulling Scripture out of context to suggest there's no need to test, that's usually a good sign that something is amiss. That's one of the reasons I regard The Elijah List as garbage.

 

[psalms 91]

That isnt always accurate either, I will give an example. I was in church one day and a man thta was active was leaving and going to another state, as he spoke my spirit took a nose dive and I knew this was a mistake and after I approached him and said God has=d a word for him, thta the longer he stayed the rougher it would get for him. You need to understand that at the time I was deep in sin and people knew it. That man left and was back in six weeks it got so rough for him and he lost a lot in the move. There were things I did not know at the time and only found out later but it seems he was homosexual and was moving to be with his companion and was also deep in sin. So I know for a fact that God can use you no matter what if He chooses.

 

[MoreCoffee]

The holy scriptures advise:

1John 4:1-4 Beloved, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits to see whether they are of God; for many false prophets have gone out into the world. 2 By this you know the Spirit of God: every spirit which confesses that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh is of God, 3 and every spirit which does not confess Jesus is not of God. This is the spirit of antichrist, of which you heard that it was coming, and now it is in the world already. 4 Little children, you are of God, and have overcome them; for he who is in you is greater than he who is in the world.​

 

[tango]

That isnt always accurate either, I will give an example. I was in church one day and a man thta was active was leaving and going to another state, as he spoke my spirit took a nose dive and I knew this was a mistake and after I approached him and said God has=d a word for him, thta the longer he stayed the rougher it would get for him. You need to understand that at the time I was deep in sin and people knew it. That man left and was back in six weeks it got so rough for him and he lost a lot in the move. There were things I did not know at the time and only found out later but it seems he was homosexual and was moving to be with his companion and was also deep in sin. So I know for a fact that God can use you no matter what if He chooses.

Which part are you saying isn't always accurate?

 

[psalms 91]

What I am saying is that it doesnt always have something to do with fruit, God can and will use who He chooses, I used that example to show what God can and will do. Many times if we know the person we willnot acept the word no matter but a stranger knowing details is a different story. Our fruit does enter in and I believe that God uses those close to Him but what I showed also shows that God can use those who are out of fellowship at the time as well

 

[tango]

What I am saying is that it doesnt always have something to do with fruit, God can and will use who He chooses, I used that example to show what God can and will do. Many times if we know the person we willnot acept the word no matter but a stranger knowing details is a different story. Our fruit does enter in and I believe that God uses those close to Him but what I showed also shows that God can use those who are out of fellowship at the time as well

God can use whoever he chooses but when Jesus told us we would know people by their fruits I think we need to take him seriously.

There's obviously a big difference between someone humbly presenting a word that they believe to be from God as a one-off thing, and someone proclaiming "Thus saith the Lord" and acting as if they were a modern day Elijah.

 

[psalms 91]

God can use whoever he chooses but when Jesus told us we would know people by their fruits I think we need to take him seriously.

There's obviously a big difference between someone humbly presenting a word that they believe to be from God as a one-off thing, and someone proclaiming "Thus saith the Lord" and acting as if they were a modern day Elijah.

I agree

 

[Rens]

1Th 5:19-21 NKJV Do not quench the Spirit. (20) Do not despise prophecies. (21) Test all things; hold fast what is good.

I like the balance here between not despising prophecies but testing all things. Too far one way and we accept all sorts of garbage as being of divine origin, too far the other way and we block our ears and refuse to let God speak to us.

Act 17:10-11 NKJV Then the brethren immediately sent Paul and Silas away by night to Berea. When they arrived, they went into the synagogue of the Jews. (11) These were more fair-minded than those in Thessalonica, in that they received the word with all readiness, and searched the Scriptures daily to find out whether these things were so.

This shows a good indication of how we might test. The Bereans searched the Scriptures to verify what they were taught. Of course another way was taught by Jesus:

Mat 7:15-20 NKJV "Beware of false prophets, who come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ravenous wolves. (16) You will know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes from thornbushes or figs from thistles? (17) Even so, every good tree bears good fruit, but a bad tree bears bad fruit. (18) A good tree cannot bear bad fruit, nor can a bad tree bear good fruit. (19) Every tree that does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire. (20) Therefore by their fruits you will know them.

The trouble with this is that it's hard to test someone's fruits unless we can spend some time with them. When I look at the minister of my church I can get a good idea of how he looks after his church, I can see how patient he is with people, how he reacts to the more awkward members of the congregation (every church has at least one), how he treats his family and so on. But when "Prophet" Joe Blow, the chief executive and president of Joe Blow Ministries International, presents a message he claims is from God the chances are I'm never going to meet him in person and certainly not going to spend enough time with him to test his fruits. Therefore all I can do is test his message against what Scripture teaches.

Another thing I've found is that if people don't want their words tested there's usually a good reason for it. If someone seems too keen to stress that their words are sound, that they have "already been tested", or pulling Scripture out of context to suggest there's no need to test, that's usually a good sign that something is amiss. That's one of the reasons I regard The Elijah List as garbage.

Even if someone has good fruit they can err. A wrong prophecy doesn't mean it's a false prophet. 2 or 3 people should test it, a lot of times that doesn't happen.

 

[visionary]

That isnt always accurate either, I will give an example. I was in church one day and a man thta was active was leaving and going to another state, as he spoke my spirit took a nose dive and I knew this was a mistake and after I approached him and said God has=d a word for him, thta the longer he stayed the rougher it would get for him. You need to understand that at the time I was deep in sin and people knew it. That man left and was back in six weeks it got so rough for him and he lost a lot in the move. There were things I did not know at the time and only found out later but it seems he was homosexual and was moving to be with his companion and was also deep in sin. So I know for a fact that God can use you no matter what if He chooses.

Yep.. Remember Balaam

 

[tango]

Even if someone has good fruit they can err. A wrong prophecy doesn't mean it's a false prophet. 2 or 3 people should test it, a lot of times that doesn't happen.

Sure, anyone can be wrong. But if some claims to be a prophet and their fruit stinks we can steer clear of them. If someone claims the authority of an OT prophet they need to live up to the standards of an OT prophet, which means one false move and they lose their title (and they should be thankful they don't lose their life, but we don't stone people these days regardless of what they have done).

In the NT approach it's clear that we should test prophecies. As to how many test it or how rigorously they test it, that would depend on the impact that following it would have. If following the word would have minimal cost associated with it then there's probably no need to test it too thoroughly, simply because if it were totally made up the impact would be minimal. If it would have major repercussions then it should be tested and tested and tested again. The God who was capable of sending the message through one channel is quite capable of confirming it through another if that's what is required.