What or Who is the Church?

[Lees]

Thats it, only Christs Church/Israel is saved !

When did Israel begin?

When did the Church begin?

Who were the saved before Israel?

Lees

 

[Lees]

Yeah I did, you have rejected it. So the only thing left is either God opens up your understanding, or you will find out at the 2 nd coming.

I reject what you say because you haven't shown anything. You talk a lot, but you show nothing.

Why should I need to wait till the Second Coming? According to you the Church goes through the Tribulation...correct? If I am wrong, then I will know then...correct?

What is the Tribulation? Where does the Tribulation fit in your imagination of last things? Or does it even exist?

Please explain (Eph. 3:3-6).

Lees

 

[brightfame52]

Rom 9:6

6 Not as though the word of God hath taken none effect. For they are not all Israel, which are of Israel:

No, The Church has always been Israel, but not Israel after the flesh, or the physical nation of Israel See within the physical nation of Israel was always a remnant according to the election of Grace, which is also Israel. Now under the Old Covenant Spiritual Israel, the Body of Christ was mostly comprised of saved jewish Christians. They would usually be persecuted by the non christian jews in the nation Matt 5:12


Rejoice, and be exceeding glad: for great is your reward in heaven: for so persecuted they the prophets[Believers in Crist] which were before you.

Lk 13:34


O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, which killest the prophets, and stonest them that are sent unto thee; how often would I have gathered thy children together, as a hen doth gather her brood under her wings, and ye would not!

Now under the New Covenant, Body of Christ Israel the election of Grace has been multiplied by saving and grafting in multitudes into Spiritual Israel, which is still the Body of Christ ! So The Body of Christ, Israel according to the Spirit, the Election of Grace is not a replacement, it always has been, its now clarified who they are.

 

[brightfame52]

When did Israel begin?

When did the Church begin?

Who were the saved before Israel?

Lees

The People Israel began in the purpose of election, in being chosen in Christ before the foundation of the world Eph 1:4, it was then they were foreknown and predestinated to be conformed into the image of True Israel, the Son of God. Thats also when the Church began.

 

[Lees]

Rom 9:6

6 Not as though the word of God hath taken none effect. For they are not all Israel, which are of Israel:

No, The Church has always been Israel, but not Israel after the flesh, or the physical nation of Israel See within the physical nation of Israel was always a remnant according to the election of Grace, which is also Israel. Now under the Old Covenant Spiritual Israel, the Body of Christ was mostly comprised of saved jewish Christians. They would usually be persecuted by the non christian jews in the nation Matt 5:12


Rejoice, and be exceeding glad: for great is your reward in heaven: for so persecuted they the prophets[Believers in Crist] which were before you.

Lk 13:34


O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, which killest the prophets, and stonest them that are sent unto thee; how often would I have gathered thy children together, as a hen doth gather her brood under her wings, and ye would not!

Now under the New Covenant, Body of Christ Israel the election of Grace has been multiplied by saving and grafting in multitudes into Spiritual Israel, which is still the Body of Christ ! So The Body of Christ, Israel according to the Spirit, the Election of Grace is not a replacement, it always has been, its now clarified who they are.

(Rom. 9:6) doesn't prove the Church is Israel. All it proves is that not all who are physically born Israelites make up the true Israel. The true Israel must be both born physically into Israel and spiritually.

Your statement beginning with "Now under the Old Covenant", makes no sense. There was no Body of Christ under the Old Covenant. Again , explain (Eph. 3:3-6)

Lees

 

[Lees]

The People Israel began in the purpose of election, in being chosen in Christ before the foundation of the world Eph 1:4, it was then they were foreknown and predestinated to be conformed into the image of True Israel, the Son of God. Thats also when the Church began.

That God knows and purposed the elect proves nothing concerning Israel and the Church being the same body. All who make up the Church are elect. All who make up the true Israel are elect. Being 'elect' doesn't make them the same body.

So, again, when did Israel begin?

Who were the saved before Israel? See (Rom. 5:14)

Explain (Eph. 3:3-6)

Lees

 

[brightfame52]

(Rom. 9:6) doesn't prove the Church is Israel. All it proves is that not all who are physically born Israelites make up the true Israel. The true Israel must be both born physically into Israel and spiritually.

Your statement beginning with "Now under the Old Covenant", makes no sense. There was no Body of Christ under the Old Covenant. Again , explain (Eph. 3:3-6)

Lees

Yes I am proving that the Church of Christ and Israel are the same, you just cant receive the proof, only God can open the eyes of your understanding friend. Currently you are under deception, a strong delusion.

 

[brightfame52]

That God knows and purposed the elect proves nothing concerning Israel and the Church being the same body. All who make up the Church are elect. All who make up the true Israel are elect. Being 'elect' doesn't make them the same body.

So, again, when did Israel begin?

Who were the saved before Israel? See (Rom. 5:14)

Explain (Eph. 3:3-6)

Lees

The People Israel began in Genesis in time, I believe with Adam and Eve, but I know for sure Abel belonged to Israel and the Church because he was given faith and declared righteous. Heb 11:4

4 By faith Abel offered unto God a more excellent sacrifice than Cain, by which he obtained witness that he was righteous, God testifying of his gifts: and by it he being dead yet speaket

Just to be clear, all people of faith belong to #1 The church # 2 Israel of God from the beginning of the world, to the consummation.bAnd I dont explain anything unless I i want to, You already disagree with the things I have explained.

 

[Lees]

Yes I am proving that the Church of Christ and Israel are the same, you just cant receive the proof, only God can open the eyes of your understanding friend. Currently you are under deception, a strong delusion.

(Rom. 9:6) only proves that there is a true Israel made up of believing Israelites. Not the Church.

Explain (Eph. 3:3-6) "How that by revelation he made known unto me the mystery: (as I wrote afore in few words, Whereby, when ye read, ye may understand my knowledge in the mystery of Christ) Which in other ages was not made known unto the sons of men as it is now revealed unto his holy apostles and prophets by the Spirit; That the Gentiles should be fellowheirs, and of the same body, and partakers of his promise in Christ by the Gospel:

Lees

 

[Lees]

The People Israel began in Genesis in time, I believe with Adam and Eve, but I know for sure Abel belonged to Israel and the Church because he was given faith and declared righteous. Heb 11:4

4 By faith Abel offered unto God a more excellent sacrifice than Cain, by which he obtained witness that he was righteous, God testifying of his gifts: and by it he being dead yet speaket

Just to be clear, all people of faith belong to #1 The church # 2 Israel of God from the beginning of the world, to the consummation.bAnd I dont explain anything unless I i want to, You already disagree with the things I have explained.

No, Israel began as a nation in Egypt. Israel did not begin with Adam and Eve. That is silly. Just because Abel had faith didn't make him part of the Church or Israel. He was a believer. He was one of many between Adam and Moses who were not part of either the Church or Israel.

Just to be clear, you ignore that which goes against your 'shake and bake' theolgy.

Lees

 

[Lees]

@brightflame52

As you consider 'and of the same body' in (Eph. 3:3-6), consider these verses also.

(Eph. 2:14-16) "For he is our peace, who hath made both one, and hath broken down the middle wall of paartition between us; Having abolished in his flesh the enmity, even the law of commandments contained in ordinances; for to make in himself of twain one new man, so making peace; And that he might reconcile both unto God in one body by the cross, having slain the enmity thereby:"

As you see, the Church could not begin until after the death, burial, and resurrection of Christ. That one body began at Pentecost.

Lees

 

[brightfame52]

(Rom. 9:6) only proves that there is a true Israel made up of believing Israelites. Not the Church.

Explain (Eph. 3:3-6) "How that by revelation he made known unto me the mystery: (as I wrote afore in few words, Whereby, when ye read, ye may understand my knowledge in the mystery of Christ) Which in other ages was not made known unto the sons of men as it is now revealed unto his holy apostles and prophets by the Spirit; That the Gentiles should be fellowheirs, and of the same body, and partakers of his promise in Christ by the Gospel:

Lees

Rom 9:6 and other scriptures prove that Israel that is saved, it the Church, always has been. God never made such a promise to the ethnic nation of israel.

 

[brightfame52]

No, Israel began as a nation in Egypt. Israel did not begin with Adam and Eve. That is silly. Just because Abel had faith didn't make him part of the Church or Israel. He was a believer. He was one of many between Adam and Moses who were not part of either the Church or Israel.

Just to be clear, you ignore that which goes against your 'shake and bake' theolgy.

Lees

Im not talking about the physical ethnic nation israel.

 

[Lees]

Rom 9:6 and other scriptures prove that Israel that is saved, it the Church, always has been. God never made such a promise to the ethnic nation of israel.

Again, you ignore (Eph. 3:3-6) because it disproves your position.

And, (Rom. 9:6) only proves what you're saying in your own mind. It doesn't identify the Church as Israel.

You say 'God never made such a promise to ethnic Israel'. Do you hear yourself?

Was Jesus a Jew? Did Jesus need to be a Jew? Did Jesus need to be of the tribe of Judah? Did Jesus need to be of the family of David?

Lees

 

[Lees]

Im not talking about the physical ethnic nation israel.

Yes, I know. You're not talking about the Israel of the Bible. You're talking about your imaginary 'spiritual Israel' that you can label as all the elect, as all the church. Contrary to Scripture.

Shake and bake.

Please respond to (Eph. 3:3-6). And respond to my post #(111).

Lees

 

[brightfame52]

Again, you ignore (Eph. 3:3-6) because it disproves your position.

And, (Rom. 9:6) only proves what you're saying in your own mind. It doesn't identify the Church as Israel.

You say 'God never made such a promise to ethnic Israel'. Do you hear yourself?

Was Jesus a Jew? Did Jesus need to be a Jew? Did Jesus need to be of the tribe of Judah? Did Jesus need to be of the family of David?

Lees

I havent ignored it, I just dont let people dictate to me what I should explain, especially a person like yourself who has rejected all my explanations thus far.

 

[brightfame52]

Yes, I know. You're not talking about the Israel of the Bible. You're talking about your imaginary 'spiritual Israel' that you can label as all the elect, as all the church. Contrary to Scripture.

Shake and bake.

Please respond to (Eph. 3:3-6). And respond to my post #(111).

Lees

Okay, when I say Israel Im not talking about the physical ethnic israel. Thats not the only Israel in scripture, Pul intimated that in Rom 9:6

6 Not as though the word of God hath taken none effect. For they are not all Israel, which are of Israel:

Not all of national israel belong to Israel elect which is the Church , the Body of Christ.

 

[Lees]

I havent ignored it, I just dont let people dictate to me what I should explain, especially a person like yourself who has rejected all my explanations thus far.

Then if you don't want to explain something brought up in the conversation, then you should keep your mouth shut and not enter into a post not directed to you.

So, answer my questions that were a response to your statement. Like that is going to happen.

I reject your explanations because they are no explanations. Your explanation proves nothing.

Lees

 

[Lees]

Okay, when I say Israel Im not talking about the physical ethnic israel. Thats not the only Israel in scripture, Pul intimated that in Rom 9:6

6 Not as though the word of God hath taken none effect. For they are not all Israel, which are of Israel:

Not all of national israel belong to Israel elect which is the Church , the Body of Christ.

Yes I know. You already said that. But I already showed you that physical Israel is necessary to be the Israel of God. I asked you questions. Was Jesus a Jew? Did Jesus need to be a Jew? Was Jesus of the tribe of Judah? Did He need to be of the tribe of Judah? Was Jesus of the family of David? Did Jesus need to be of the family of David? And of course you ignore.

Paul said nothing of the sort in (Rom. 9:6). Paul was simply identifying the true Israelite. He had to be 'of Israel'. He had to be a believer.

Please respond to (Eph. 3:3-6) and my post #(111).

Lees

 

[brightfame52]

Then if you don't want to explain something brought up in the conversation, then you should keep your mouth shut and not enter into a post not directed to you.

So, answer my questions that were a response to your statement. Like that is going to happen.

I reject your explanations because they are no explanations. Your explanation proves nothing.

Lees

Lol, this is a public forum, nothing says I need to do what you tell me to do. Im providing explanations on my terms not yours friend. And since my explanations prove nothing, please quit asking me to explain passages of scripture.