Why did Jesus say it?

[MoreCoffee]

Peter turned around and saw behind him that other disciple, whom Jesus loved—the one who had leaned close to Jesus at the meal and had asked, "Lord, who is going to betray you?" When Peter saw him, he asked Jesus, "Lord, what about this man?" Jesus answered him, "If I want him to live until I come, what is that to you? Follow me!"
(Joh 21:20-22 GNB)

 

[Bluezone777]

I think He is just saying stop focusing on other people and what they do or don't have and instead focus on Me(Jesus). When you put the focus on others, the only thing it leads to is bitterness/resentment or the inverse of that would be pride and arrogance which are both bad. When you focus on Jesus instead, it leads to contentment and humility which is where you want to be.

 

[MoreCoffee]

I think He is just saying stop focusing on other people and what they do or don't have and instead focus on Me(Jesus). When you put the focus on others, the only thing it leads to is bitterness/resentment or the inverse of that would be pride and arrogance which are both bad. When you focus on Jesus instead, it leads to contentment and humility which is where you want to be.

What you wrote offers a meaning for Jesus words but I am still wondering why he said it. Sure Peter was encouraged not to focus on John but why did Jesu say "If I want him to live until I come, what is that to you? Follow me!"

 

[Fritz Kobus]

but why did Jesu say "If I want him to live until I come, what is that to you? Follow me!"

Perhaps because He meant it.

 

[MoreCoffee]

Perhaps because He meant it.

That is very likely true but it isn't really a "why?" answer is it?

 

[Lees]

@MoreCoffee

You were just told by Bluezone777 and Fritz Kobus 'why' he said it.

What is the problem? You think your question is so deep that others don't have the answer? How foolish.

Quit foolin yourself that the 'why' hasn't been answered.

Next time try and find something deeper if you want to play that game.

My, my. How deep some think they are being yet what they present can be waded across without getting the ankes wet.

Lees

 

[MoreCoffee]

your question is so deep that others don't have the answer?

One hopes for good answers.

 

[Lees]

@MoreCoffee

Good answers were given.

Lees

 

[Lees]

@MoreCoffee

Concerning these verse, it certainly shows how unreliable 'tradition', even 'apostolic tradition' is.

Tradition couldn't keep the story straight.

(John 21:23) "Then went this saying abroad among the brethren, that that disciple should not die: yet Jesus said not unto him, He shall not die; but, if I will that he tarry till I come, what is that to thee?

Lees

 

[MoreCoffee]

it certainly shows how unreliable 'tradition', even 'apostolic tradition' is.

The passage doesn't mention tradition.

 

[Lees]

@MoreCoffee

(John 21:23) certainly shows how unreliable 'tradition' is. The story can't be kept straight by men. Yet the Roman Church relies on 'Tradition' as the basis for it's faith.

Lees

 

[MoreCoffee]

Yet the Roman Church relies on 'Tradition' as the basis for it's faith.

I once may have discussed this matter with you but not anymore. Anti-Catholicism is of little interest now.

 

[Lees]

@MoreCoffee

In other words, the passage, (John 21:23) reveals the unreliability of 'traditon'. Thus it is of little use to you, a Roman Catholic, because Roman Catholic's base their faith on 'tradition'.

Lees

 

[MoreCoffee]

because Roman Catholic's base their faith on 'tradition'.

You write the oddest things.

 

[Lees]

@MoreCoffee

What is odd is you have been told why Jesus asked the question in (John 21:22). Yet you reject them.

So, if you reject the answers, what is your answer?

Lees

 

[Fritz Kobus]

@MoreCoffee

In other words, the passage, (John 21:23) reveals the unreliability of 'traditon'. Thus it is of little use to you, a Roman Catholic, because Roman Catholic's base their faith on 'tradition'.

Lees

I always understood it that Catholics base their faith on the Word of God (Bible), the sayings of the church fathers, and the ex cathedra sayings of the Pope. So a mix with some tradition.

 

[Albion]

Two (RC) sources: Holy Scripture and Holy Tradition.

We know what the first is all about, but there is often confusion about the second. It is not the case that something said by a Church Father or several of them, perhaps separated by a few centuries, establishes anything the church would classify as Holy Tradition.

The concept, whether any of us agree with it or not, holds that there has to be a continuous and universal belief not otherwise verified by Scripture before it can be considered divine revelation and, therefore, considered to be authoritative for defining doctrine. One problem is that the claim can and has been made that this or that belief was indeed continuous and universal when there is no evidence of that being the case.

And as for ex cathedra decrees, the claim is made that the Pope's proclamation does not break new ground but that the belief already met the standards of Holy Tradition.

 

[Lees]

I always understood it that Catholics base their faith on the Word of God (Bible), the sayings of the church fathers, and the ex cathedra sayings of the Pope. So a mix with some tradition.

You have understood that because that is what they will always tell you. Once you start debating the issue, you will find otherwise.

Lees

 

[MoreCoffee]

You have understood that because that is what they will always tell you. Once you start debating the issue, you will find otherwise.

Lees

Really?

The Catechism of the Catholic Church says

II. The Relationship Between Tradition and Sacred Scripture

One common source. . .

80 "Sacred Tradition and Sacred Scripture, then, are bound closely together and communicate one with the other. For both of them, flowing out from the same divine well-spring, come together in some fashion to form one thing, and move towards the same goal."40 Each of them makes present and fruitful in the Church the mystery of Christ, who promised to remain with his own "always, to the close of the age".41

. . . two distinct modes of transmission

81 "Sacred Scripture is the speech of God as it is put down in writing under the breath of the Holy Spirit."42

"and [Holy] Tradition transmits in its entirety the Word of God which has been entrusted to the apostles by Christ the Lord and the Holy Spirit. It transmits it to the successors of the apostles so that, enlightened by the Spirit of truth, they may faithfully preserve, expound and spread it abroad by their preaching."43​

82 As a result the Church, to whom the transmission and interpretation of Revelation is entrusted, "does not derive her certainty about all revealed truths from the holy Scriptures alone. Both Scripture and Tradition must be accepted and honoured with equal sentiments of devotion and reverence."44

Apostolic Tradition and ecclesial traditions

83 The Tradition here in question comes from the apostles and hands on what they received from Jesus' teaching and example and what they learned from the Holy Spirit. the first generation of Christians did not yet have a written New Testament, and the New Testament itself demonstrates the process of living Tradition.

Tradition is to be distinguished from the various theological, disciplinary, liturgical or devotional traditions, born in the local churches over time. These are the particular forms, adapted to different places and times, in which the great Tradition is expressed. In the light of Tradition, these traditions can be retained, modified or even abandoned under the guidance of the Church's Magisterium.​

---

40 DV 9.
41 Mt 28:20
42 DV 9.
43 DV 9.
44 DV 9.

 

[Lees]

@MoreCoffee

And your point is....?

Lees