MeToo??

Lamb

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Before Kavanaugh became a judge there were people going nuts over the allegation of sexual misconduct but now we're having crickets from those same people in regards to claims against Joe Biden. What's the difference? Why is he getting a free pass? Where is the MeToo? Why aren't women believing the accusations since they said that all women should be believed?
 

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Before Kavanaugh became a judge there were people going nuts over the allegation of sexual misconduct but now we're having crickets from those same people in regards to claims against Joe Biden. What's the difference?

The difference is that Kavanaugh is thought to be a conservative and Biden is a Democrat. It's no more complicated than that.

People look for reasons that would make such politics seem logical or consistent, but "The women always tell the truth about these things and must be believed" was usable for one event and that's all there was to it. Now the narrative will be completely different.
 

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The difference is that Kavanaugh is thought to be a conservative and Biden is a Democrat. It's no more complicated than that.

People look for reasons that would make such politics seem logical or consistent, but "The women always tell the truth about these things and must be believed" was usable for one event and that's all there was to it. Now the narrative will be completely different.

My niece was one of those vocal women who pretty much tore into me on Facebook because I wanted Due Process for Kavanaugh. I still expect Due Process for Biden too. I know women who have lied about all kinds of things so it's not fair to immediately believe someone and prosecute the other without proof. I can respect both sides of things.
 

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Before Kavanaugh became a judge there were people going nuts over the allegation of sexual misconduct but now we're having crickets from those same people in regards to claims against Joe Biden. What's the difference? Why is he getting a free pass? Where is the MeToo? Why aren't women believing the accusations since they said that all women should be believed?

Interesting. A Republican-appointed judge was dragged through the mud while the Democrat presidential candidate facing comparable allegations wasn't. It's almost as if there's a political bias in the media.
 

tango

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My niece was one of those vocal women who pretty much tore into me on Facebook because I wanted Due Process for Kavanaugh. I still expect Due Process for Biden too. I know women who have lied about all kinds of things so it's not fair to immediately believe someone and prosecute the other without proof. I can respect both sides of things.

That was your mistake. Due process works differently depending on who you are.

If you are a Republican due process consists of being found guilty by default and ripped to shreds, along with everyone who even thinks you might be innocent. If you are a Democrat due process consists of charges being ignored because the Republicans are worse (obviously), and heaven help anyone who thinks differently.
 

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Before Kavanaugh became a judge there were people going nuts over the allegation of sexual misconduct but now we're having crickets from those same people in regards to claims against Joe Biden. What's the difference?


Biden is a Democrat. Come on, Lamm, you know this!



.
 

Lamb

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Biden is a Democrat. Come on, Lamm, you know this!



.

I was kind of hoping there is more to it than that. That maybe the lady has a known history of false allegations or something?
 

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I was kind of hoping there is more to it than that. That maybe the lady has a known history of false allegations or something?

Sadly she accused a prominent Democrat, so chances are she soon will have a history of false allegations. Perhaps the #MeToo movement should be renamed #YouToo. You know, justice for me but not for thee, due process for me but not for thee, and so on.
 

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I was kind of hoping there is more to it than that. That maybe the lady has a known history of false allegations or something?
what lady are you referring to? The thing is that anyone can make an allegation, it doesn't mean that it is true.
 

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what lady are you referring to? The thing is that anyone can make an allegation, it doesn't mean that it is true.

In some ideal world, yes. But here we were talking about the reality of the one we live in.
 

tango

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what lady are you referring to? The thing is that anyone can make an allegation, it doesn't mean that it is true.

... which is the point of due process. The same media who were all over Kavanaugh because of allegations relating to his past are remarkably silent when Biden faces comparable allegations.
 

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Before Kavanaugh became a judge there were people going nuts over the allegation of sexual misconduct but now we're having crickets from those same people in regards to claims against Joe Biden. What's the difference? Why is he getting a free pass? Where is the MeToo? Why aren't women believing the accusations since they said that all women should be believed?
I think we all know why. But very few people have the guts or courage to say it.
 

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what lady are you referring to? The thing is that anyone can make an allegation, it doesn't mean that it is true.


If the allegation is made of a Republican, it is TRUE unless proven to all that it is not (which has yet to ever happen)
If the allegation is made of a Democrat, it is FALSE and hateful. Period.


Just how things roll.



.
 

tango

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If the allegation is made of a Republican, it is TRUE unless proven to all that it is not (which has yet to ever happen)
If the allegation is made of a Democrat, it is FALSE and hateful. Period.


Just how things roll.



.

Yep, one side is assumed innocent until proven beyond even the slightest shadow of a doubt to be guilty, in which case the allegations are shuffled off the front page until they are forgotten. The other side is assumed guilty until proven to be guilty.
 

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I was kind of hoping there is more to it than that.
There isn't.

People have to come to the understanding sooner or later that the political world changed in 2016. This is a game in which the object is not to capture the flag or score the most points but to get the winner of the previous election out of office.

For heaven's sake, "they" were even incautious enough as to announce to the country that this was going to be their goal and, in addition, that it would be done "by any means possible."
 

tango

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There isn't.

People have to come to the understanding sooner or later that the political world changed in 2016. This is a game in which the object is not to capture the flag or score the most points but to get the winner of the previous election out of office.

For heaven's sake, "they" were even incautious enough as to announce to the country that this was going to be their goal and, in addition, that it would be done "by any means possible."

Sometimes I wonder whether we shouldn't plan to have the presidential inauguration held immediately before the impeachment and just prepare for elections to take place every three months or so.
 

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This goes very deep - all the way to epistemology. By far the most helpful article I've ever read on this is actually by the atheist Peter Boghossian: Welcome to Culture War 2.0.

A lot of comments on this thread are pointing out the inconsistency between Kavanaugh's treatment and Biden's treatment. Yep. Highly inconsistent. However, the far left doesn't care about consistency the same way Christians do. It's not in the least about logic.

Here's the Christian definition of truth. Truth is the set of all archetypes in the mind of God. So God defines truth; it is his character, since God is simple (meaning, without parts). A statement or proposition is true if it is one of those archetypes, and false if it is not. Because God is utterly consistent and logical in every way, true statements will always reflect the reality that he created; the correspondence theory of truth, that true statements are those which correspond to reality, is consistent with the definition above, but I prefer a revelation-based definition of truth. Correspondence then becomes a consequence. Also, I find the archetype definition less circular.

But the far left has abandoned even the correspondence theory of truth. For the far left, truth is dependent on how many oppressed groups to which you belong. I, of course, as a heterosexual white Christian male, partake of precisely 0 oppressed groups - all oppressor groups - and so, from the perspective of the far left, I am not allowed to know any truth. This is why shutting down people like me is not only considered just fine, it's even considered virtuous. Why not, if I can't have anything to say?

But you can see one problem here: the oppressor/oppressed definition of truth shuts down the conversation from the get-go. It allows the far left to insulate themselves from ideas with which they disagree, whereas the archetype definition strongly encourages seeking out the truth, and exposing oneself to ideas with which you disagree. It's very difficult, if not a complete waste of time, to talk with anyone from the far left on anything less fundamental than epistemology. You have to destroy this dangerous epistemology of theirs before you can get anywhere on something less fundamental (but obviously still important) like abortion, COVID, Kavanaugh vs Biden, Trump, etc. One thing you can say: the far left approach is going to produce a see-saw effect: the oppressor/oppressed groups will merely oscillate over time - surely an argument from the Christian perspective as to why this epistemology is flat-out wrong: God doesn't change, so truth doesn't change. You can already see that Christians are going to be oppressed under these ideas; at what point does being a Christian get to be an oppressed group?

And here's another problem relating to this thread: the oppressor/oppressed definition of truth doesn't care 3 straws for consistency, as in logical consistency. In a twisted sort of way, the Biden vs Kavanaugh treatments are consistent according to the far left: Kavanaugh is considered to be of the oppressor groups since he does not hold to the far left ideals, so he must be wrong. Biden, even though he technically partakes of many oppressor groups, he identifies much more in the minds of the far left with oppressed groups; and so he must be believed. You see how it works?

Finally, you might ask yourself: where did all this come from? Well, for a long time, I thought Marx was the origin, as in: Marx -> Communism -> Postmodernism -> Critical Theory -> Intersectionality. However, Oz Guinness, at the latest L'Abri conference here in Rochester, put me onto a development further back that we should not count out: the French Revolution. Really, it is the Jacobins that started this line of thinking, along with Rousseau. As Oz Guinness said, there are five revolutions that have largely defined the modern world: the British (Cromwell), French, American, Russian (1917), and Chinese (1948 - 1952). Of those, the British and American were much more biblical in outlook, while the French, Russian, and Chinese were utterly godless and evil. There are the origins of these ideas: I strongly recommend that you study these ideas in order to understand better where they originated!
 

tango

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Yeah man, truth is all about da feelz.

This argument brought to you by the political wing that complains about "alternative facts".
 

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This goes very deep - all the way to epistemology. By far the most helpful article I've ever read on this is actually by the atheist Peter Boghossian: Welcome to Culture War 2.0.

A lot of comments on this thread are pointing out the inconsistency between Kavanaugh's treatment and Biden's treatment. Yep. Highly inconsistent. However, the far left doesn't care about consistency the same way Christians do. It's not in the least about logic.

Here's the Christian definition of truth. Truth is the set of all archetypes in the mind of God. So God defines truth; it is his character, since God is simple (meaning, without parts). A statement or proposition is true if it is one of those archetypes, and false if it is not. Because God is utterly consistent and logical in every way, true statements will always reflect the reality that he created; the correspondence theory of truth, that true statements are those which correspond to reality, is consistent with the definition above, but I prefer a revelation-based definition of truth. Correspondence then becomes a consequence. Also, I find the archetype definition less circular.

But the far left has abandoned even the correspondence theory of truth. For the far left, truth is dependent on how many oppressed groups to which you belong. I, of course, as a heterosexual white Christian male, partake of precisely 0 oppressed groups - all oppressor groups - and so, from the perspective of the far left, I am not allowed to know any truth. This is why shutting down people like me is not only considered just fine, it's even considered virtuous. Why not, if I can't have anything to say?

But you can see one problem here: the oppressor/oppressed definition of truth shuts down the conversation from the get-go. It allows the far left to insulate themselves from ideas with which they disagree, whereas the archetype definition strongly encourages seeking out the truth, and exposing oneself to ideas with which you disagree. It's very difficult, if not a complete waste of time, to talk with anyone from the far left on anything less fundamental than epistemology. You have to destroy this dangerous epistemology of theirs before you can get anywhere on something less fundamental (but obviously still important) like abortion, COVID, Kavanaugh vs Biden, Trump, etc. One thing you can say: the far left approach is going to produce a see-saw effect: the oppressor/oppressed groups will merely oscillate over time - surely an argument from the Christian perspective as to why this epistemology is flat-out wrong: God doesn't change, so truth doesn't change. You can already see that Christians are going to be oppressed under these ideas; at what point does being a Christian get to be an oppressed group?

And here's another problem relating to this thread: the oppressor/oppressed definition of truth doesn't care 3 straws for consistency, as in logical consistency. In a twisted sort of way, the Biden vs Kavanaugh treatments are consistent according to the far left: Kavanaugh is considered to be of the oppressor groups since he does not hold to the far left ideals, so he must be wrong. Biden, even though he technically partakes of many oppressor groups, he identifies much more in the minds of the far left with oppressed groups; and so he must be believed. You see how it works?

Finally, you might ask yourself: where did all this come from? Well, for a long time, I thought Marx was the origin, as in: Marx -> Communism -> Postmodernism -> Critical Theory -> Intersectionality. However, Oz Guinness, at the latest L'Abri conference here in Rochester, put me onto a development further back that we should not count out: the French Revolution. Really, it is the Jacobins that started this line of thinking, along with Rousseau. As Oz Guinness said, there are five revolutions that have largely defined the modern world: the British (Cromwell), French, American, Russian (1917), and Chinese (1948 - 1952). Of those, the British and American were much more biblical in outlook, while the French, Russian, and Chinese were utterly godless and evil. There are the origins of these ideas: I strongly recommend that you study these ideas in order to understand better where they originated!

It would make sense for the French to be partly to blame for that line of thinking.

How do we address the way they perceive things since they have strayed from biblical truth?
 
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