Once saved always saved?

popsthebuilder · Sep 21, 2015

MoreCoffee said:
Nope, what is says is this I am the true vine, and my Father is the husbandman. Every branch in me that beareth not fruit he taketh away:

Same thing.

Faith in selfless Unity for Good.

Lamb · Sep 22, 2015

Hammster said:
Let me be a bit more clear, as I wasn't before. Where does it say that anyone thrown into the lake of fire was ever a believer?

The book of Life...does that mean something to you other than what scripture says it means?

I've shown you two verses that apply to the conversation and answered your questions, yet you are trying to reason something out in your head instead of letting scripture be scripture. Law and Gospel. Look again at that chart I posted either here or in that other thread. There you see where Law and Gospel are each applied and I think that is what is getting you confused. You're thinking that I'm discounting the Gospel. But I'm not. I see both Law and Gospel because scripture teaches us both.

Alithis · Sep 22, 2015

Let me be a bit more clear, as I wasn't before. Where does it say that anyone thrown into the lake of fire was ever a believer?

the devils believe .. and tremble .. it appears that belief that is not coupled with obedience.. gets one in a whole lot of hot water .. er ,fire

Hammster · Sep 22, 2015

Lämmchen said:
The book of Life...does that mean something to you other than what scripture says it means?

I've shown you two verses that apply to the conversation and answered your questions, yet you are trying to reason something out in your head instead of letting scripture be scripture. Law and Gospel. Look again at that chart I posted either here or in that other thread. There you see where Law and Gospel are each applied and I think that is what is getting you confused. You're thinking that I'm discounting the Gospel. But I'm not. I see both Law and Gospel because scripture teaches us both.

You are deflecting. My question is specific. And you are not answering it.

Hammster · Sep 22, 2015

Alithis said:
the devils believe .. and tremble .. it appears that belief that is not coupled with obedience.. gets one in a whole lot of hot water .. er ,fire

You and I both know what I meant by believers.

Brighten04 · Sep 22, 2015

MoreCoffee said:
The passage has nothing to do with 'works of the law' being pruned. It is branches that are cut off and thrown into the fire. Your post #243 (the first quote above) doesn't even begin to deal with what the passage in John 15 says.

That is exactly what it is talking about. But the Holy Spirit has to reveal that truth to you.

MoreCoffee · Sep 22, 2015

Brighten04 said:
That is exactly what it is talking about. But the Holy Spirit has to reveal that truth to you.

Naturally enough, you cannot explain your stated position using English and sound exegesis so you toss in a claim to Holy Spirit enlightenment and so seek to exclude me by implying that I - ignoramus and non-spiritual being that I must be - do not have. I however look at this attempt to sideline me as nothing but smoke and mirrors to hide an inadequate hermeneutic that needs smoke and mirrors to fool the folk who are taken in by it.

Brighten04 · Sep 22, 2015

MoreCoffee said:
Naturally enough, you cannot explain your stated position using English and sound exegesis so you toss in a claim to Holy Spirit enlightenment and so seek to exclude me by implying that I - ignoramus and non-spiritual being that I must be - do not have. I however look at this attempt to sideline me as nothing but smoke and mirrors to hide an inadequate hermeneutic that needs smoke and mirrors to fool the folk who are taken in by it.

Look, if you have the Holy Spirit, talk to Him. He can explain it better than I can. It seems you don't understand a thing I write.

psalms 91 · Sep 22, 2015

Brighten04 said:
Look, if you have the Holy Spirit, talk to Him. He can explain it better than I can. It seems you don't understand a thing I write.

Thus the need for a Word of Faith only thread

Brighten04 · Sep 22, 2015

bill1231 said:
Thus the need for a Word of Faith only thread

What do you mean?

psalms 91 · Sep 22, 2015

I eman it would be nice to put forth beliefs without all the attacks. I fully understand why CF had to break into denominartional sections

MoreCoffee · Sep 22, 2015

Brighten04 said:
Look, if you have the Holy Spirit, talk to Him. He can explain it better than I can. It seems you don't understand a thing I write.

I have and he has taught me to reject the "once saved always saved" slogan and many of the teachings behind it.

Brighten04 · Sep 22, 2015

bill1231 said:
I eman it would be nice to put forth beliefs without all the attacks. I fully understand why CF had to break into denominartional sections

OIC, and you may be right.

MoreCoffee · Sep 22, 2015

bill1231 said:
I eman it would be nice to put forth beliefs without all the attacks. I fully understand why CF had to break into denominational sections

A little cut & thrust :swordfight: and a bit of disputation is okay and need not make anybody feel upset.

Brighten04 · Sep 22, 2015

MoreCoffee said:
I have and he has taught me to reject the "once saved always saved" slogan and many of the teachings behind it.

Well it is ok with me if you want to believe that the blood of Jesus is not enough to save you and keep you saved.

Brighten04 · Sep 22, 2015

MoreCoffee said:
A little cut & thrust :swordfight: and a bit of disputation is okay and need not make anybody feel upset.

Finally something we agree on. LOL.:kiss:

MoreCoffee · Sep 22, 2015

Brighten04 said:
Well it is ok with me if you want to believe that the blood of Jesus is not enough to save you and keep you saved.

The blood of the Lord is sufficient to save for all time all those who come to him in faith and receive him as Lord and Saviour; that is not the issue under discussion.

Brighten04 · Sep 22, 2015

MoreCoffee said:
The blood of the Lord is sufficient to save for all time all those who come to him in faith and receive him as Lord and Saviour; that is not the issue under discussion.

Once again we agree! And this IS the issue. Forget about the slogan.It is just a slogan. Your quote above is all we have been saying.

MoreCoffee · Sep 22, 2015

Brighten04 said:
Once again we agree! And this IS the issue. Forget about the slogan.It is just a slogan. Your quote above is all we have been saying.

The thread's theme is the slogan "once saved always saved". It is not intended to be a discussion about being saved or who can be saved or who will be saved ...

A New Dawn · Sep 22, 2015

popsthebuilder said:
Uhm... What is double predestination?

I don't know if this was answered (correctly), the one given on page 1 is incorrect, and I didn't read past page 2.

Regular predestination is that God chooses who will be saved and makes it so. Double predestination is that God not only chooses who will be saved, but chooses who will be damned.

One might think that God choosing who will be saved automatically implies that that He chooses who will be damned, but that is a leap that is not made in the Bible. It all depends on your beliefs about God.

Once saved always saved?

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