The Love Of Money Is Idol Worshipping

[Josiah]

[Staff edit]

Quite a personal accusation.

Now, where is your proof of this sin on my part?

It does not really matter what I have done it matters

Well, if you don't do what you demand of us - that's called hypocrisy. Or maybe you don't actually hold that we are to give up everything we have.

You said you've given up businesses..... okay. Are the only things you've ever had are businesses? What about food? Clothing? Electricity? Parents? Housing? You said we have to give up everything, isn't food a thing? Housing? Clothing? Computers? Have you given up everything?

 

[Amos Ministries]

So what do you suppose Peter ate?

The scripture states if you seek the kingdom of heaven first God will add these things and to you have you not read this. Due to a lack of faith you are omitting this part of the scripture. Scripture states the Pharisees who were lovers of money were scoffing at Jesus, this is what you were doing.

Did the disciples get reprimanded for falling back into sin when they returned to fishing following Christ's death? Apparently not, because Jesus told them to cast their nets over the other side. Maybe he forgot they should have given up everything - their boats, their nets.

Have you not read that after they eat the fish Jesus said to Peter do you love me more than these meaning the fish. Then did he not say if you love me then tend my sheep feed my lambs meaning stop fishing and seeking after money but rather preach the gospel to my followers.

It does take a bizarre kind of logic to figure I'm supposed to give up my house in faith that God will provide shelter for me - you know, like maybe in a house.

Of course because you love your money and you like faith you can only serve one master.

Why not just use the one I already have? It's equally bizarre to expect people to quit their jobs and give away literally everything they own in the faith that God will pretty much replace the things they need with equivalent things. You might suggest someone give up their multiple holiday homes so that others might have a place to live (although even that is a personal decision rather than something you get to decide for someone else) but another thing entirely to say we should give up the shelter God has provided for us so that God can provide us with shelter, especially since as soon as God provides us with shelter we're apparently supposed to give it up so that God can provide us with shelter. That sounds like a particularly bizarre form of circular reasoning.

Presumably after Peter "gave up everything" he wasn't walking around stark naked. That suggests he didn't give up all of his clothes. Maybe the situation is a little more nuanced than you're claiming.

LOl well once again you’re omitting that part of the scripture that states that God will add all these things to you meaning food and clothing you need to study more and stop omitting manipulating compromising overlooking twisting the Scriptures.

Quite a personal accusation.

Now, where is your proof of this sin on my part?







Well, if you don't do what you demand of us - that's called hypocrisy. Or maybe you don't actually hold that we are to give up everything we have.

You said you've given up businesses..... okay. Are the only things you've ever had are businesses? What about food? Clothing? Electricity? Parents? Housing? You said we have to give up everything, isn't food a thing? Housing? Clothing? Computers? Have you given up everything?

That’s what I’m saying it’s foolishness to talk about that part because there’s no way I could prove it and there’s no way you could actually see it and who really cares what I did it’s still doesn’t change what Jesus said.

 

[Bluezone777]

People have a hard time following people who don't do what they say others should do. They wonder if this person telling us to do this or that doesn't believe it's true so why should we believe it? This is why it's important to avoid hypocrisy as it hinders your ability to share the gospel and makes you incapable of helping others. I would also say looking down upon others and walking around this place with pride is also not a wise thing to do either. No one likes being looked down upon especially when it's clear as day that the person looking down upon them is no better than they are. For a pastor, you have a lot to learn about what it means to be a good steward of the Word of God and provider for His people.

 

[Amos Ministries]

People have a hard time following people who don't do what they say others should do. They wonder if this person telling us to do this or that doesn't believe it's true so why should we believe it? This is why it's important to avoid hypocrisy as it hinders your ability to share the gospel and makes you incapable of helping others.

Matthew 23:3
So you must be careful to do everything they tell you. But do not do what they do, for they do not practice what they preach.

What people do is not your concern it’s whether Jesus said to do it.

I would also say looking down upon others and walking around this place with pride is also not a wise thing to do either. No one likes being looked down upon especially when it's clear as day that the person looking down upon them is no better than they are. For a pastor, you have a lot to learn about what it means to be a good steward of the Word of God and provider for His people.

You know nothing about me yet you have judged me stating that I have not practice what I preach why don’t you take your own advice.

 

[Lamb]

Matthew 23:3
So you must be careful to do everything they tell you. But do not do what they do, for they do not practice what they preach.

What people do is not your concern it’s whether Jesus said to do it.



You know nothing about me yet you have judged me stating that I have not practice what I preach why don’t you take your own advice.

In all fairness, I've seen you say to a couple of my members here that they lack faith. Perhaps you should stop doing that? They are believers...meaning they have faith in the Savior.

 

[Amos Ministries]

In all fairness, I've seen you say to a couple of my members here that they lack faith. Perhaps you should stop doing that? They are believers...meaning they have faith in the Savior.

This issue, over money, is where you put your money where your mouth is. This is true faith, to believe God will provide and to put God before your money by giving up all for Jesus.

 

[Lamb]

This issue, over money, is where you put your money where your mouth is. This is true faith, to believe God will provide and to put God before your money by giving up all for Jesus.

The way you have written it sounds like you're buying God off.

You see, giving up all we have is reliance on Jesus, but does not EARN us something heavenly. Faith grasps onto the forgiveness that was won at the cross for eternal life and my members, that you said don't have faith actually have great faith.

 

[Amos Ministries]

The way you have written it sounds like you're buying God off.

You see, giving up all we have is reliance on Jesus, but does not EARN us something heavenly. Faith grasps onto the forgiveness that was won at the cross for eternal life and my members, that you said don't have faith actually have great faith.

Luke 14:33
In the same way, those of you who do not give up everything you have cannot be my disciples.

I understand you are trying to come to the aid of your members but you should be putting the teachings of Jesus above there sensitivities even if his teachings are offensive such as to give up all or you cannot be his disciple.

 

[Lamb]

Luke 14:33
In the same way, those of you who do not give up everything you have cannot be my disciples.

I understand you are trying to come to the aid of your members but you should be putting the teachings of Jesus above there sensitivities even if his teachings are offensive such as to give up all or you cannot be his disciple.

As a ministry then maybe you should understand the distinction between Law and Gospel? You're spouting Law...where is the preaching of the Gospel?

 

[Josiah]

That’s what I’m saying it’s foolishness to talk about that part because there’s no way I could prove it and there’s no way you could actually see it and who really cares what I did it’s still doesn’t change what Jesus said.

You accused me of lacking faith. That's quite a personal and public accusation. You seem to say it's foolish to talk about this, but it's you that made the accusation. Where is your proof?



.

 

[Josiah]

Luke 14:33
In the same way, those of you who do not give up everything you have cannot be my disciples.

You seem to be spinning this that we must "give up" everything. But you've indicated the ONLY thing you've EVER given up is some mysterious "business." Okay, is a business the only thing that is a thing? Giving that up is giving up "everything?" Is food not a thing? Clothing not a thing? Housing not a thing? The internet not a thing? Is your life not a thing?

Or is Jesus saying "giving up everything" not as you so profess (but seem to not do)?




.

 

[tango]

Of course you would because you love money. You go with anyone’s interpretation as long as they tell you you can keep your money. The old testament people murdered people and were still called righteous.

I see. Presumably you go with any interpretation that lets you keep your internet connection? Or are you just reverting to the standard fallback of so many who can't defend their curious interpretations of Scripture so simply start throwing around accusations when people demonstrate how it is flawed?

 

[tango]

You’re acting like an animal attacking because you love your money. It does not really matter what I have done it matters what Jesus said we are disputing what Jesus said whatever I said to you over the Internet I cannot prove so what’s the point of me making decisions that I have given up all my former businesses for the sake of the gospel.

Did I step into an alternative reality here? The person presenting a bizarre interpretation of Scripture now calling those who are logically and rationally questioning it "like an animal attacking" when he's the one throwing around wild accusations without a shred of evidence?

Now you are omitting Out of a lack of faith the portion of the scripture that states that if you put the kingdom of heaven as your first priority God will provide for all your food and clothing this is from Luke 12 he does not state you will starve does he so why are you asking if Peter staved obviously Peter was provided for my God read the Scriptures. All you of little faith.

As you’ve twisted other scriptures you were twisting the parable regarding Stewarts. We are meant to be good stewards of the truths that God gives us to the Holy Spirit a bad steward twists manipulates and compromises these truths much like what you were doing with the concept of give up all due to a lack of faith.

Perhaps we're also called to be good stewards of the material things God has provided? Just a thought. You know, perhaps the times God provides for someone else without miraculously showering them with manna from above he might use a human to do the providing. That human might be someone like, oh, maybe you, or Josiah, or me, or indeed anyone else.

Do you walk around naked everywhere you go? If not, presumably you didn't give up your clothes. So either you live in a nudist colony somewhere, or you haven't "given up everything". So why not cut the silly rhetoric and apply some rational thinking. I think Scripture refers to "rightly dividing the word". You'd almost be forgiven for thinking God wanted us to actually use that spongy gray thing he put between our ears, no?

 

[tango]

You accused me of lacking faith. That's quite a personal and public accusation. You seem to say it's foolish to talk about this, but it's you that made the accusation. Where is your proof?



.

Silly Josiah, the proof is that you're still here using the internet connection you didn't give up while your accuser gave up theirs.

Oh, wait.....

 

[Amos Ministries]

As a ministry then maybe you should understand the distinction between Law and Gospel? You're spouting Law...where is the preaching of the Gospel?

The gospel is the fulfilment of the law. Jesus said I came to fulfil not abolish the law. Jesus interpretation of the word of God is grace. All who understand his interpretation now have no iniquity and if and when they fall short of his interpretation they ask for forgiveness and Are sure to receive it because they’ve admitted there sin as it states in first John1:9 if we confess our sins, He is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. This is the grace of the gospel to know the truth so that we know exactly how we fall short so that we can ask for forgiveness and be confident that we have received it. Not to keep her head in the sand and cover up our sin trying to appear innocent While spouting a gospel that essentially states Jesus abolished the law which is not true.

 

[Amos Ministries]

You accused me of lacking faith. That's quite a personal and public accusation. You seem to say it's foolish to talk about this, but it's you that made the accusation. Where is your proof?



.

It does not matter what I have done it matters what Jesus has said. If I jump off a cliff will you, if I prove to you that I have given up all will you promise and make a oath to me that you will too. Then what difference does it make.

Also for the last time stop omitting scripture . It clearly says if you put the kingdom of heaven first God will add all your needs to you.

 

[Amos Ministries]

You seem to be spinning this that we must "give up" everything. But you've indicated the ONLY thing you've EVER given up is some mysterious "business." Okay, is a business the only thing that is a thing? Giving that up is giving up "everything?" Is food not a thing? Clothing not a thing? Housing not a thing? The internet not a thing? Is your life not a thing?

Or is Jesus saying "giving up everything" not as you so profess (but seem to not do)?




.

It does not matter what I do it matters what Jesus said don’t try to use an excuse so that you don’t have to give up all or that somehow it does not say this that is being a coward by twisting the scripture don’t do that.

Luke 16:14 the Pharisees, who were lovers of money, heard all of this and were scoffing at Jesus.

2 Timothy 3:2
For men will be lovers of themselves, lovers of money, boastful, arrogant, abusive, disobedient to their parents, ungrateful, unholy,

Arguing with me what you perceive i may or may have not done does not in anyway change what Jesus said. Don’t use this as an excuse to try to weasel your way out of following the Scriptures.

 

[Amos Ministries]

I see. Presumably you go with any interpretation that lets you keep your internet connection? Or are you just reverting to the standard fallback of so many who can't defend their curious interpretations of Scripture so simply start throwing around accusations when people demonstrate how it is flawed?

It’s not flawed how do you know I’m not using somebody else’s Internet connection lol or the libraries. You know nothing you’re just trying to weasel your way out of following a scripture because you lack faith. I would at least respect you if you were able to state it’s true what Jesus said but I have not done it.

 

[Amos Ministries]

Silly Josiah, the proof is that you're still here using the internet connection you didn't give up while your accuser gave up theirs.

Oh, wait.....

Silly Josiah, the proof is that you're still here using the internet connection you didn't give up while your accuser gave up theirs.

Oh, wait.....

Luke 16:14
The Pharisees, who were lovers of money, heard all of this and were scoffing at Jesus.

You’re scoffing at what Jesus has said
Luke 14:33 In the same way, those of you who do not give up everything you have cannot be my disciples.

 

[Amos Ministries]

Did I step into an alternative reality here? The person presenting a bizarre interpretation of Scripture now calling those who are logically and rationally questioning it "like an animal attacking" when he's the one throwing around wild accusations without a shred of evidence?

Luke 14:33

In the same way, those of you who do not give up everything you have cannot be my disciples.

Luke 14:33 33 In the same way, those of you who do not give up everything you have cannot be my disciples.

This is the evidence what more do you want do you want the burning bush lol.

How is this an alternate reality You’ve just compromise the Scriptures that’s all.

Perhaps we're also called to be good stewards of the material things God has provided? Just a thought. You know, perhaps the times God provides for someone else without miraculously showering them with manna from above he might use a human to do the providing. That human might be someone like, oh, maybe you, or Josiah, or me, or indeed anyone else.

Jesus and the disciples were provided for for from God whilst they preach the gospel. Mark 16 we are meant to preach the gospel around the world we’re not meant to just seek after money through a job And fool ourselves to believe we are doing Gods work. You lack faith in God’s provision that is where you speak this way.

Do you walk around naked everywhere you go? If not, presumably you didn't give up your clothes. So either you live in a nudist colony somewhere, or you haven't "given up everything".

In Luke 12 Jesus specifically says God will provide for your needs of food and clothing you obviously do not read the Scriptures study more.

So why not cut the silly rhetoric and apply some rational thinking. I think Scripture refers to "rightly dividing the word". You'd almost be forgiven for thinking God wanted us to actually use that spongy gray thing he put between our ears, no?

The silly rhetoric is being spouted from you. You lack faith and due to this you mock and scoff what Jesus said. Jesus did not have A job but God provided and neither did the disciples. Why do you think he says look at the birds of the air the flowers they neither spin nor toil they don’t labour or weave They don’t have store houses yet God provides for them this was Jesus outlook.
You have overlooked this due to your lack of faith.

neither did the people in the first century church if you read in the book of acts you find the members of the first century church were giving up all.

Acts 3:6 Then Peter said, "Silver or gold I do not have, but what I do have I give you. In the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth, walk

Matthew 9:9
And as Jesus passed forth from thence, he saw a man, named Matthew, sitting at the receipt of custom: and he saith unto him, Follow me. And he arose, and followed him.

Matthew 4:20-22
And they straightway left their nets, and followed him…

Acts 2:45
English Standard Version
And they were selling their possessions and belongings and distributing the proceeds to all, as any had need.

Luke 12:33
Sell your possessions and give to the poor. Provide yourselves with purses that will not wear out, an inexhaustible treasure in heaven, where no thief approaches and no moth destroys.

Luke 16:9
I tell you, use worldly wealth to make friends for yourselves, so that when it is gone, they will welcome you into eternal dwellings.

Luke 18:22
On hearing this, Jesus told him, "You still lack one thing: Sell everything you own and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven. Then come, follow Me."

Acts 4:34
There were no needy ones among them, because those who owned lands or houses would sell their property, bring the proceeds from the sales,