"Speaking in Tongues"

[Alithis]

Some sincere questions.....


1. According to the words in the New Testament, what exactly IS this? Do we have an exact definition, description so that we can determine what is and is not "speaking in tongues?" How specifically are we told to recognize what it is and is not? Is there ONE speaking in tongues or endless varieties of this? Is "speaking in tongues" today thought to be the same or different from that mentioned in the Bible?


2. People (sincerely, I believe) claim to "speak in tongues." I've met several. How do we know that what they are doing IS exactly what people where doing 2000 years ago which they called "speaking in tongues?" I'm NOT asking if they are DOING something (they are, IMO).... I'm NOT asking if it's a spiritually moving thing for them (I'm sure it is)..... I'm NOT asking if they are sincere (I'm sure they are), I'm asking how do we KNOW - from the verbatim words found in the NT - that what they are doing IS specifically "speaking in tongues" as the NT speaks of it?


3. When I was a teen, a good friend of mine had a mother who was a self-proclaimed and self-ordained Apostle, Prophet, Bishop, Faith Healer and Pastor. She also claimed she had numerous gifts - including speaking in tongues and interpretation thereof. (BTW, I was still on her email list as of a year or so ago.... I got regular updates on revelations she got directly from God; always quite interesting: another matter for another thread). I asked her daughter these two questions and she had no reply, but when she asked me if I speak in tongues, I told her I'm not sure I have any way to know. She told me to say a sentence. "Praise precious Jesus Prince of Peace." Say it with my heart and my mouth. Fast. Faster. Faster still! And if I did - with all my heart..... with great speed.... the Holy Spirit would fall upon me and would give me the Gift of Tongues and I'd just KNOW that I have it. I tried it. It was very hard to do without stumbling - and eventually, that's what I did. Was I speaking in tongues? How do I know? How do you know?


4. What is it's purpose in the church? According to the Bible and/or proponents?



Thanks!!!!



- Josiah

re question number 2

2. People (sincerely, I believe) claim to "speak in tongues." I've met several.
How do we know that what they are doing IS exactly what people where doing 2000 years ago which they called "speaking in tongues?
I'm asking how do we KNOW - from the verbatim words found in the NT - that what they are doing IS specifically "speaking in tongues" as the NT speaks of it? "

that is a difficult question .. it is a bit like asking - how do we know the unwritten language of some ,say, amazonian tribe ( for the sake of example )is the same as the language that tribe spoke 2000 years ago.. it poses an unanswerable question . so i would have to refer it back to the word of God from where the promise originates .. and trust his word to be true in that he states" I am the lord I change Not "Malachi 3:6

 

[Alithis]

Some sincere questions.....


1. According to the words in the New Testament, what exactly IS this? Do we have an exact definition, description so that we can determine what is and is not "speaking in tongues?" How specifically are we told to recognize what it is and is not? Is there ONE speaking in tongues or endless varieties of this? Is "speaking in tongues" today thought to be the same or different from that mentioned in the Bible?


2. People (sincerely, I believe) claim to "speak in tongues." I've met several. How do we know that what they are doing IS exactly what people where doing 2000 years ago which they called "speaking in tongues?" I'm NOT asking if they are DOING something (they are, IMO).... I'm NOT asking if it's a spiritually moving thing for them (I'm sure it is)..... I'm NOT asking if they are sincere (I'm sure they are), I'm asking how do we KNOW - from the verbatim words found in the NT - that what they are doing IS specifically "speaking in tongues" as the NT speaks of it?


3. When I was a teen, a good friend of mine had a mother who was a self-proclaimed and self-ordained Apostle, Prophet, Bishop, Faith Healer and Pastor. She also claimed she had numerous gifts - including speaking in tongues and interpretation thereof. (BTW, I was still on her email list as of a year or so ago.... I got regular updates on revelations she got directly from God; always quite interesting: another matter for another thread). I asked her daughter these two questions and she had no reply, but when she asked me if I speak in tongues, I told her I'm not sure I have any way to know. She told me to say a sentence. "Praise precious Jesus Prince of Peace." Say it with my heart and my mouth. Fast. Faster. Faster still! And if I did - with all my heart..... with great speed.... the Holy Spirit would fall upon me and would give me the Gift of Tongues and I'd just KNOW that I have it. I tried it. It was very hard to do without stumbling - and eventually, that's what I did. Was I speaking in tongues? How do I know? How do you know?


4. What is it's purpose in the church? According to the Bible and/or proponents?



Thanks!!!!



- Josiah

re Question number 3

3. When I was a teen, a good friend of mine had a mother who was a self-proclaimed and self-ordained Apostle, Prophet, Bishop, Faith Healer and Pastor. She also claimed she had numerous gifts - including speaking in tongues and interpretation thereof. (BTW, I was still on her email list as of a year or so ago.... I got regular updates on revelations she got directly from God; always quite interesting: another matter for another thread). I asked her daughter these two questions and she had no reply, but when she asked me if I speak in tongues, I told her I'm not sure I have any way to know. She told me to say a sentence. "Praise precious Jesus Prince of Peace." Say it with my heart and my mouth. Fast. Faster. Faster still! And if I did - with all my heart..... with great speed.... the Holy Spirit would fall upon me and would give me the Gift of Tongues and I'd just KNOW that I have it. I tried it. It was very hard to do without stumbling - and eventually, that's what I did.

#.a. Was I speaking in tongues? going on all of the scriptural accounts in the book of Acts .. there is not much of a correlation between the two -i would be inclined to say "No" that is not tongues .but can only base that on what you have told us . so you said the sentance really fast until your words slurred into an unintelligible sound ? or you began to speak a defined language ? sorry - to ask questions inside of answers but i think to answer i would require more definition .

3.b. How do I know? -if you knew ..you would not be asking i guess .

3.c. How do you know ? - making this judgement has to be based solely on the word of God .. there is no precedent in the word of God for gaining the gift of tongues by this means
just as there is no precedent for a woman to "self proclaim " to be an apostle, prophet, bishop, faith healer (what ever that is ) and pastor . sounds more like a new age usurper and jezebal.. but thats a loose opinion .

as i said i would answer at times by experiential opinion .. (ie opinion based upon what i have experienced) and make it clear im doing so.. im now doing so ..
in my opinion the gift of tongues is not "achieved" by any outward act on our part ..
it is an outer evidence that a person has been baptised in the holy Ghost .. we dont speak in tongues becaseu we choose to we speak in tongues because we have received the holy ghost and HIS presence wells up within us like a river . this is based upon what the lord jesus promised when he said ..out of your inner most being rivers of living water shall flow .. he was speaking of the baptism of the Holy Spirit and when he flows out from us ..out of our mouths it comes forth as tongues .
so based on my experience coupled with these scriptures - it is my opinion that the action you preformed was not the tongues spoken of in the book of acts .

i could again say so much more but want to keep it simple .
i have addressed the Op honestly and i hope simply .

the question number 4 i have omitted .. but only due to the incredible length and amount of content involved in answering here - just honest bro.. its a whole topic in itself

 

[MoreCoffee]

Hearsay is when person X says that person Y said such and such about event E. Person X is not a witness or participant in event E. Person X merely says that Person Y said such and such about E. That is quite different from the case mentioned in my post. In the case related in my post it is Person Y who says that event E failed and person Y is a participant in event E. Specifically members of the Azusa Street Mission reported their own failure to communicate in the foreign languages used in the foreign lands to which they were sent.

off topic distracting sidelines aren't going to be helpful.
i intend to answer alll the op's questions as honestly as i can from the direct word of God.
and where i cannot do so i will offer opinion from life experience.and state that it is merely my opinion.

It is more a case of correcting an incorrect view of hearsay than a case of being off topic. The topic is still what speaking in tongues means both in the bible and in modern usage among Charismatic and Pentecostal christians.

What do you think "speaking in tongues" means in the holy scriptures? Do you think that the Azusa Street Mission folk spoke in exactly the same sort of way as the Christians mentioned in First Corinthians?

 

[Alithis]

what "i think" is not important .what the word states ..is .your asking to argue .the op's just asking .

 

[Josiah]

re question number 2

2. People (sincerely, I believe) claim to "speak in tongues." I've met several.
How do we know that what they are doing IS exactly what people where doing 2000 years ago which they called "speaking in tongues?
I'm asking how do we KNOW - from the verbatim words found in the NT - that what they are doing IS specifically "speaking in tongues" as the NT speaks of it? "

that is a difficult question .. it is a bit like asking - how do we know the unwritten language of some ,say, amazonian tribe ( for the sake of example )is the same as the language that tribe spoke 2000 years ago.. it poses an unanswerable question . so i would have to refer it back to the word of God from where the promise originates .. and trust his word to be true in that he states" I am the lord I change Not "Malachi 3:6

So, we know God does not change.

But if we have nothing that indicates what people are "doing" now is what the Bible is speaking about in the NT, then there's no reason to look to the NT vis-a-vis what is happening now.

There is a Spanish book that speaks of a mythical golden land which the author called "California." And of course, there is a state in the USA with the name of "California" (it was named after that mythical land in that fictional book). But does that mean that ERGO what that book says about California ERGO applies to the western US State? Obviously not. Before we can apply the verses that speak of "speaking in tongues" in the NT to what suddenly started happening roughly a century ago, we'd need to first substantiate that these two things are the same. Otherwise, there may be no relationship between them AT ALL - other than the moniker chosen for this current phenomenon.


But again, we're probably still at question 1: What WAS it?




Thanks for your contribution! It's appreciated!


- Josiah

 

[tango]

Where specific examples are concerned, if you post a video or an audio recording and ask "is this person speaking in tongues or faking it?" you'll get a few opinions that will differ. Ultimately in many ways it doesn't matter - often when faced with a "test all things" approach people will post an example of a claimed miracle and expect an answer how you think it happened.

There might be something specific that leads us to believe one way or another but it's perfectly acceptable to conclude "I don't know" and, to be blunt, in many cases you can easily add "and I don't care". It doesn't make any difference at all to my walk with God whether someone in a video is speaking in tongues by the power of the Holy Spirit, speaking in tongues by demonic power, or just making up a load of gibberish.