Passive Righteousness

[Lamb]

Indeed GOD makes us believers, but those in danger are those who turn from this and continue in knowing error; placing wants or desires of the flesh over the love of GOD; seeking to do those things as opposed to doing out of belief and faithfulness in love.

Sent from my Moto G (5) Plus using Tapatalk

That deals with our sanctification and that's an entirely different topic from Passive Righteousness.

 

[Lamb]

I repented of what I knew was wrong in my life before I ever knew GOD. however; that is not to say that it wasn't the will of GOD for such to take place beforehand.

Sent from my Moto G (5) Plus using Tapatalk

You didn't turn to God in repentance as an unbeliever. You might have had sorrow for your sins but that's not the entire gist of what repentance is. Repentance is about turning to God in faith.

 

[Lamb]

Not if you neglect the free gift or the payment made for your sin.

As if the slavemaster is paid off in order for the slave to be free, but the slave chooses to be a bond servant instead; such is good and great unless your slave master is sin

Sent from my Moto G (5) Plus using Tapatalk

You're bringing up sanctification and that's an entirely different topic than Passive Righteousness.

 

[Lamb]

Very many seem to preach such, but even St. Paul exclaims that it is past sins that are paid for; those done before one receives knowledge of or faith in GOD.

Sent from my Moto G (5) Plus using Tapatalk

That's because sins were forgiven at the cross. Paul preached it, you're right!! Because it's true.

Not everyone benefits from that forgiveness that Jesus won at the cross. We benefit by grace through faith that God gives to us. Those that reject, when they die, will not receive the forgiveness because they reject it. Those who have faith when they die do receive the forgiveness and will have eternal life.

 

[Imalive]

No. I think you aren't understanding what point I was making.

An unbeliever finds the message of the cross to be foolishness. It's in scripture in more than one spot. He doesn't believe it when He hears it.

Then you pray for em and all of a sudden they can see.

 

[Lamb]

He is repeatedly crucified by those who repeatedly knowingly sin against the law of the Spirit that is written in their hearts and minds as believers in Christ.

Sent from my Moto G (5) Plus using Tapatalk

Where does scripture say Jesus gets on the cross again to forgive your sins?

 

[Lamb]

I think things are getting confused.....


1. In JUSTIFICATION, one is simply GIVEN, BLESSED, ENLIVENED. We don't "ask" for anything. Forgiveness is GIVEN.

2. In SANCTIFICATION, yes - we are told to repent. A dead person can't ask for forgiveness (or anything for that matter cuz he's DEAD).... and God's forgiveness is NOT dependent on our repenting. Note for example Jesus from the Cross praying 'Father, FORGIVE THEM.... " Had His executioners all gotten down on their knees, tears falling from their faces, crying out "Have MERCY on us, forgive us, we ask in the Name of Jesus our Savior! We have totally stopped what we are doing in faith and are committed to NEVER doing this again!" Did they? No, they took GLEE in their horrific act... they had NO faith.... they had NO repentance... they stopped nothing. They were forgiven. Jesus asks for forgiveness to them BECAUSE God's grace is NOT dependent on our works Repentance is for OUR good.... not because it's a coin we put in the slot to which God (like a robot) must respond, not because God's mercy is simply a reward for our actions. Yes, we are called to repentance. No, God's mercy and grace are not dependent upon such so that forgivenss is a result of our work not God's heart.


But I think we've gotten off-topic



- Josiah

Thank you, Josiah. YES there is way too much confusion when people keep bringing up sanctification. Please take note that this thread is NOT about sanctification.

 

[popsthebuilder]

That's because sins were forgiven at the cross. Paul preached it, you're right!! Because it's true.

Not everyone benefits from that forgiveness that Jesus won at the cross. We benefit by grace through faith that God gives to us. Those that reject, when they die, will not receive the forgiveness because they reject it. Those who have faith when they die do receive the forgiveness and will have eternal life.

So you agree that it is past sins and one is to strive to not work iniquity after having received the free gift of faith in Christ?

Sent from my Moto G (5) Plus using Tapatalk

 

[Lamb]

Of course it is, but that's a different point entirely. When Jesus says "follow me" it's an invitation. We are free to follow, or not follow, as we choose. If we follow, we get a free gift of salvation. If we don't follow, we don't get a free gift.

It's like the analogy of sending a check I mentioned. If you can't pay your debts and I send you a check to cover them all, that check does nothing for you unless you take it to the bank and cash it. It's the same with salvation - we can't pay the debt of our sin so Jesus did it for us. Effectively he mailed us a check to cover our debts but unless we accept it we're still on the hook.

To argue that we do literally nothing means either we are utterly predestined, in which case there's no point making much effort to do that "go into the world and preach the gospel" stuff because those who are predestined to be saved will be saved regardless, or that all of us will go to heaven because Jesus paid the debt of our sin whether we like it or not.

You're not talking about the topic. You're trying to bring sanctification into this thread and it doesn't belong.

 

[user1234]

Love is to be without hypochrisy.
Be kindly affectioned one to another with brotherly love.
[size=+2]HELLO[/size]
I guess with God, He can give us the gift of the ability to hear and respond to Him and His gift, but He doesn't force us to accept Him and reply in love.

And with ppl, we can't force each other to hear and/or respond to each other either, even if God commands it.

 

[Lamb]

What about that very first time we confess our sins? We surely cannot accept a Savior without first recognising that we need a Savior. And the only reason we need a Savior is because we can't save ourselves.

So that very first time we call on God, "forgive me", we are forgiven. How, then, are we saved if not by making the decision to accept the offer of forgiveness? You keep coming back to the idea that God does all the work but nobody is disputing that - the associated issue is whether we at least step up and accept it, or whether we do literally nothing. Hence my analogy of mailing a check - you did nothing to deserve it, the person mailing the check makes all your debts go away, but unless you accept the check (i.e. take it to the bank and cash it) it does you no good at all.

You cannot confess your sins to the one true God unless you were first given faith to believe in Him. That's God's work in you and you didn't do anything but receive it.

No one can ask for a sin to be forgiven by God unless they trust in Him. That trust is faith. We are saved by grace through faith and this not of yourselves. If you have faith then you have been given it (passively received) by God. You weren't active in receiving faith. He placed it in you to believe. It is His work.

And the cashing of a check...direct deposit! You have it in your account. You received it as your inheritance. Anything you do after doesn't make the check in your account any more real. It's there. To use it is sanctification and still doesn't make that check more real. Sanctification is not what this thread is about.

 

[popsthebuilder]

Where does scripture say Jesus gets on the cross again to forgive your sins?

Exactly; it says the opposite.

Sent from my Moto G (5) Plus using Tapatalk

 

[Imalive]

Where does scripture say Jesus gets on the cross again to forgive your sins?

Hey another 666
john 666 hebrews 666

For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted the heavenly gift, and have become partakers of the Holy Spirit, 5 and have tasted the good word of God and the powers of the age to come, 6 if they fall away, to renew them again to repentance, since they crucify again for themselves the Son of God, and put Him to an open shame.

 

[popsthebuilder]

Love is to be without hypochrisy.
Be kindly affectioned one to another with brotherly love.
[size=+2]HELLO[/size]
I guess with God, He can give us the gift of the ability to hear and respond to Him and His gift, but He doesn't force us to accept Him and reply in love.

And with ppl, we can't force each other to hear and/or respond to each other either, even if God commands it.

Such wouldn't be love

Sent from my Moto G (5) Plus using Tapatalk

 

[Imalive]

Love is to be without hypochrisy.
Be kindly affectioned one to another with brotherly love.
[size=+2]HELLO[/size]
I guess with God, He can give us the gift of the ability to hear and respond to Him and His gift, but He doesn't force us to accept Him and reply in love.

And with ppl, we can't force each other to hear and/or respond to each other either, even if God commands it.

chrissy?
yous made a typo
HELLO Snerf

 

[Lamb]

It is a free gift and rewards you can get too. The ones who didnt follow anymore in John 6 rejected the free gift. Accept His is follow Him. Accept the devils gift is follow him. We may choose.

They rejected but they didn't choose to be there. He chose them and they were with Him instantly. No one can believe unless the Lord enables him.

 

[Lamb]

Is it easier to tell a man to stand and walk, or that he is freed from sin?

They are the same; they are made whole and new and their works, or rather the working of GOD within them as faithful believers, will be a testament to the nature of their character.

Sent from my Moto G (5) Plus using Tapatalk

Being freed from sin is not what we do for ourselves. That's the topic of this thread.

Our works after is sanctification and NOT what this thread is about.

 

[Lamb]

Yes yes God does it and He does it by telling someone to make a choice, which they then can cause He enables em. But hardening your heart is a choice and then you cant be enabled if one goes too far w that like the pharisees. Passive righteousness. Hmm. I'm starting to agree w the term.

God enables. That's passively receiving what God gives.

 

[Lamb]

So you agree that it is past sins and one is to strive to not work iniquity after having received the free gift of faith in Christ?

Sent from my Moto G (5) Plus using Tapatalk

All my sins were forgiven at the cross. Don't you believe that yours are too? Even your future ones? Jesus died before I was born. All my sins were there at the cross. I have faith in that forgiveness of sins.

 

[Lamb]

Love is to be without hypochrisy.
Be kindly affectioned one to another with brotherly love.
[size=+2]HELLO[/size]
I guess with God, He can give us the gift of the ability to hear and respond to Him and His gift, but He doesn't force us to accept Him and reply in love.

And with ppl, we can't force each other to hear and/or respond to each other either, even if God commands it.

No we can't force anyone to hear. Only if God opens them up to hearing and sometimes it just is not the right time.

I certainly wish that sanctification would stop from being brought into this thread.