It's abhorrent.

[MoreCoffee]

David Brooks says that the policy of separating children from their parents if the parents either entered the USA without a valid visa or applied for refuge after entering the USA is abhorrent.

 

[Lamb]

If any parent commits a crime in the US, then their children can be removed from their care and placed in a foster home...ANY parent who commits a crime. That includes those who enter the country illegally since that is a crime.

 

[psalms 91]

If any parent commits a crime in the US, then their children can be removed from their care and placed in a foster home...ANY parent who commits a crime. That includes those who enter the country illegally since that is a crime.

Still doesnt make it right and the immigration bill that is being considered in Congress addresses that very issue, thankfully. To me there is a big difference between murder and rape and just simply walking across a border seeking a better life.

 

[Tigger]

Abhorrent is a good starting point. Inhuman, barbaric and evil also come to mind.

 

[MoreCoffee]

Abhorrent is a good starting point. Inhuman, barbaric and evil also come to mind.

It is good to see a Christian response. Thanks Tigger.

I do not know if David Brooks is a Christian, maybe he is, maybe he isn't but he can see an immoral practise as well as any Christian in this case, better than some.

 

[MoreCoffee]

Still doesnt make it right and the immigration bill that is being considered in Congress addresses that very issue, thankfully. To me there is a big difference between murder and rape and just simply walking across a border seeking a better life.

You are right brother psalms 91, it is abhorrent and worse to do that to children.

 

[Lamb]

If the parents didn't commit a crime of illegally entering a country then their children would still be with them. Why is the blame put on the country that has set up boundaries instead of the criminals?

 

[Tigger]

It is good to see a Christian response. Thanks Tigger.

I do not know if David Brooks is a Christians, maybe he is, maybe he isn't but he can see an immoral practise as well as any Christian in this case, better than some.

didn’t memtion his current religious affliation but at least particular topic we would be in agreement on.

 

[psalms 91]

If the parents didn't commit a crime of illegally entering a country then their children would still be with them. Why is the blame put on the country that has set up boundaries instead of the criminals?

Maybe because our ancestors were all once immigrants and I believe that people should be treated with kindness and decency instead of a hellish response of ripping their children away from them just because they crossed a border

 

[Lamb]

Maybe because our ancestors were all once immigrants and I believe that people should be treated with kindness and decency instead of a hellish response of ripping their children away from them just because they crossed a border

My relatives came to the US using LEGAL methods. They weren't criminals trying to get away with doing something illegal.

Who complained when children were put in foster care when Obama was president?
Thousands of Children Stuck in Foster Care after Parents Deported, Report Finds
http://immigrationimpact.com/2011/1...ter-care-after-parents-deported-report-finds/

 

[NewCreation435]

It may act to deter parents if they know they will be separated from their kids if they cross the border for months at a time.

 

[MoreCoffee]

It may act to deter parents if they know they will be separated from their kids if they cross the border for months at a time.

Harsh penalties for serious crimes committed in a safe society under a democratic and open government is what some people think works as a deterrent. But aren't refugee applicants escaping from a society that is not safe and a government that is not democratic and open? Running from persecution and danger appears to be the motive for many (if not all) refugee applicants. So how will harsh penalties deter them? They are running from death, rape, and slavery so having their children taken from them for a time is horrendous but not nearly as horrendous as what they are fleeing. That makes the harsh penalty theory collapse because the penalty is harsh but not as harsh as what they are running from. It makes the harsh penalty cruel.

 

[NewCreation435]

Harsh penalties for serious crimes committed in a safe society under a democratic and open government is what some people think works as a deterrent. But aren't refugee applicants escaping from a society that is not safe and a government that is not democratic and open? Running from persecution and danger appears to be the motive for many (if not all) refugee applicants. So how will harsh penalties deter them? They are running from death, rape, and slavery so having their children taken from them for a time is horrendous but not nearly as horrendous as what they are fleeing. That makes the harsh penalty theory collapse because the penalty is harsh but not as harsh as what they are running from. It makes the harsh penalty cruel.

I'm not buying your argument that all of those crossing the border are running from death, rape and other unsafe conditions. People have been illegally crossing the southern border of the US with Mexico's blessing for decades. They actively promote and encourage their people in Mexico to violate America's southern border. The truth is, that they could just as easily go south as come north to our country and find a safe place to live if that is the goal.

 

[MoreCoffee]

I'm not buying your argument that all of those crossing the border are running from death, rape and other unsafe conditions. People have been illegally crossing the southern border of the US with Mexico's blessing for decades. They actively promote and encourage their people in Mexico to violate America's southern border. The truth is, that they could just as easily go south as come north to our country and find a safe place to live if that is the goal.

North is where the "freedom" is and the money. South is where the dictators and corrupt governments and poverty are. Why head south? It would be stupid.

PS: In my part of the world it is the opposite. South is where the "freedom" is and the money and north is where the poverty and dictatorships and corrupt governments are. Why head north, it would be stupid. All the refugees in my part of the world head south to Australia.

 

[Tigger]

Ezekiel 47:22
“You shall allot it as an inheritance for yourself and for the sojourners who reside among you. They shall be to you as native-born children od Isreal. With you they shall be allotted an inheritance among the tribes of Israel.”

 

[NewCreation435]

North is where the "freedom" is and the money. South is where the dictators and corrupt governments and poverty are. Why head south? It would be stupid.

PS: In my part of the world it is the opposite. South is where the "freedom" is and the money and north is where the poverty and dictatorships and corrupt governments are. Why head north, it would be stupid. All the refugees in my part of the world head south to Australia.

Part of what I am saying is that those who come into this country still have choices that they make. They could go to another country, but chose this one. As always, we are responsible for the choices we make and their consequences

 

[psalms 91]

My relatives came to the US using LEGAL methods. They weren't criminals trying to get away with doing something illegal.

Who complained when children were put in foster care when Obama was president?
Thousands of Children Stuck in Foster Care after Parents Deported, Report Finds
http://immigrationimpact.com/2011/1...ter-care-after-parents-deported-report-finds/

Hmmm, a lot of the founding fathers were deemed criminals or undesireables which is why they came here, in order to escape persecution and at that time there were no immigration laws. Bottom line is that this is a very unchristian response, at the least they should be kept together.

 

[psalms 91]

It may act to deter parents if they know they will be separated from their kids if they cross the border for months at a time.

Not if they are escaping violence and persecution and repressive government

 

[MoreCoffee]

Ezekiel 47:22
“You shall allot it as an inheritance for yourself and for the sojourners who reside among you. They shall be to you as native-born children od Isreal. With you they shall be allotted an inheritance among the tribes of Israel.”

Good verse brother Tigger.

The Law testifies against bad laws and bad rulers saying

Exodus 23:1 Do not make false statements. And do not join hands with the wicked by being a malicious witness. 2 Do not follow the majority when they do evil, or when they pervert justice in a lawsuit. 3 Do not be partial, not even to the poor.

4 If you see your enemy’s ox or donkey going astray, take it back to him. 5 When you see the donkey of a man who hates you falling under its load, do not pass by but help him.

6 Do not deny justice to any of your poor in a lawsuit. 7 Keep away from lies. Do not slay the innocent or the just, for I will not forgive the wicked. 8 And do not take a bribe, for a bribe blinds the eyes of the clear-sighted and perverts the sentence of the just. 9 Do not oppress a stranger; you know what it is to be a stranger, for that is what you were in the land of Egypt. 10 For six years you will sow your fields and reap their produce, 11 but in the seventh you will let the land rest and lie fallow. The poor may eat what it produces and what they leave the wild animals will eat. It will be the same for your vineyard and your olive grove. 12 For six days you shall work but on the seventh you shall rest, so that your ox and your donkey may also rest and the son of your slave girl and the stranger as well may have a breathing space.

13 Pay attention to all that I tell you and do not call upon other gods; don’t let their names be heard on your lips. 14 Three times each year you shall celebrate a feast in my honour. 15 You shall keep the feast of Unleavened Bread, as I commanded you, and eat unleavened bread for seven days at the appointed time in the month of Abib, for it was then that you left Egypt. And do not come to me empty-handed. 16 You shall keep the feast of the Harvest with the feast of the first harvest of what you sowed in your fields. Then the feast of In-gathering at the end of the year when you gather in the fruit of your labour in the fields. 17 Three times during the year all your men shall present themselves before Yahweh. 18 Do not offer the blood of my sacrifice with leavened bread or let the fat of my feast remain until morning. 19 The first of the first fruits of your soil you will bring to the house of Yahweh, your God. Do not boil a kid in its mother’s milk.​

Joseph, Mary, and Jesus were refugees in Egypt. Remember that the Lord is a stranger in a strange land. Remember to show kindness to the poor, widows, orphans, and the stranger within your land.

 

[MoreCoffee]

I'm not buying your argument that all of those crossing the border are running from death, rape and other unsafe conditions. People have been illegally crossing the southern border of the US with Mexico's blessing for decades. They actively promote and encourage their people in Mexico to violate America's southern border. The truth is, that they could just as easily go south as come north to our country and find a safe place to live if that is the goal.

You wrote I'm not buying your argument that all of those crossing the border are running from death, rape and other unsafe conditions. Good. I do not buy that either. It isn't what I wrote. I wrote Running from persecution and danger appears to be the motive for many (if not all) refugee applicants. Buy what is true. And do not play with false representations.