Discrepancy between Esther 4:16 and 5:1?

[rstrats]

Esther said that she would fast for 3 days, night or day, and that after doing that, that she would go to the king. However, verse 5:1 says that she went to the king on the 3rd day. How can she go to the king on the 3rd day and at the same time go after the 3rd day?

 

[rstrats]

Wowser, over 300 views and not one reply.

 

[Uncle_Sol]

Wowser, over 300 views and not one reply.

See post 246 and 248

 

[Mercury]

Esther said that she would fast for 3 days, night or day, and that after doing that, that she would go to the king. However, verse 5:1 says that she went to the king on the 3rd day. How can she go to the king on the 3rd day and at the same time go after the 3rd day?

There are literally hundreds of such contradictions in the Bible. Why are you surprised to find one of them?

 

[Lamb]

There are literally hundreds of such contradictions in the Bible. Why are you surprised to find one of them?

There are some translations that haven't been translated properly.

 

[Mercury]

There are some translations that haven't been translated properly.

Are you offering that as a catch all excuse for all of the Bible contradictions or just some of them?

Is there a particular Bible version/translation that you would deem to not have contradictions?

 

[JustTheFacts]

Esther said that she would fast for 3 days, night or day, and that after doing that, that she would go to the king. However, verse 5:1 says that she went to the king on the 3rd day. How can she go to the king on the 3rd day and at the same time go after the 3rd day?

If the fast started at 7:00 am, three days later at 7:00 am the fast would be over then Esther would see the King that day. Where is the contradiction?

 

[JustTheFacts]

I've found that the word of God is perfect; that every apparent contradiction can be resolved through a thorough analysis.

 

[Mercury]

I've found that the word of God is perfect; that every apparent contradiction can be resolved through a thorough analysis.

But can that analysis be done without adding to the scripture and inventing narratives?

But regardless, I'm game so let's do a few examples. Let me know your explanation for the following apparent contradictions:

On the issue of seeing God

"... I have seen God face to face ..." -- Genesis 32:30

"No man hath seen God at any time..."-- John 1:18


Regarding Incest

"Cursed be he that lieth with his sister, the daughter of his father, or the daughter of this mother..." -- Deuteronomy 27:22

"And if a man shall take his sister, his father's daughter, or his mother's daughter...it is a wicked thing...." -- Leviticus 20:17

Then we have Abraham making a wife of his own sister, his father's daughter:

Genesis 20:12
"And Abraham said, Because I thought, Surely the fear of God is not in this place; and they will slay me for my wife's sake. 12 And yet indeed she is my sister; she is the daughter of my father, but not the daughter of my mother; and she became my wife."

"And God said unto Abraham, As for Sarai thy wife, thou shalt not call her name Sarai, but Sarah shall her name be. 16
And I will bless her, and give thee a son also of her: yea, I will bless her, and she shall be a mother of nations.." -- Genesis 17:15-16


David Kills Goliath . . . Twice?

David kills Goliath with a sling and stone
1 Sam 17:50 "So David prevailed over the Philistine with a sling and with a stone, and struck the Philistine and killed him. There was no sword in the hand of David."

David kills Goliath with a sword

1 Sam 17:51 : "Then David ran and stood over the Philistine and took his sword and drew it out of its sheath and killed him and cut off his head with it"


This will do for starters. I mean there are literally 100s of these kind of contradictions which would take many pages to list.

I'm interested to see your "analysis"

 

[JustTheFacts]

Actua

But can that analysis be done without adding to the scripture and inventing narratives?

But regardless, I'm game so let's do a few examples. Let me know your explanation for the following apparent contradictions:

On the issue of seeing God

"... I have seen God face to face ..." -- Genesis 32:30

"No man hath seen God at any time..."-- John 1:18

John is clearly talking about Jesus. Moses wrote the summary and wasn't likely present, so we can't be sure what Jacob meant. This doesn't bother me.

Regarding Incest

"Cursed be he that lieth with his sister, the daughter of his father, or the daughter of this mother..." -- Deuteronomy 27:22

"And if a man shall take his sister, his father's daughter, or his mother's daughter...it is a wicked thing...." -- Leviticus 20:17

Then we have Abraham making a wife of his own sister, his father's daughter:

Genesis 20:12
"And Abraham said, Because I thought, Surely the fear of God is not in this place; and they will slay me for my wife's sake. 12 And yet indeed she is my sister; she is the daughter of my father, but not the daughter of my mother; and she became my wife."

"And God said unto Abraham, As for Sarai thy wife, thou shalt not call her name Sarai, but Sarah shall her name be. 16
And I will bless her, and give thee a son also of her: yea, I will bless her, and she shall be a mother of nations.." -- Genesis 17:15-16

Isn't this the story where Abraham made up the story of Sarai being his sister so that he wouldn't be killed?

David Kills Goliath . . . Twice?

David kills Goliath with a sling and stone
1 Sam 7:50 "So David prevailed over the Philistine with a sling and with a stone, and struck the Philistine and killed him. There was no sword in the hand of David."

David kills Goliath with a sword

1 Sam 7:51 : "Then David ran and stood over the Philistine and took his sword and drew it out of its sheath and killed him and cut off his head with it"


This will do for starters. I mean there are literally 100s of these kind of contradictions which would take many pages to list.

I'm interested to see your "analysis"

1 Sam 7:50 states that there "was no sword in the hand" it doesn't state that David didn't have a sword.
My focus has been on New Testament and not Old Testament.

 

[JustTheFacts]

David Kills Goliath . . . Twice?

David kills Goliath with a sling and stone
1 Sam 7:50 "So David prevailed over the Philistine with a sling and with a stone, and struck the Philistine and killed him. There was no sword in the hand of David."

David kills Goliath with a sword

1 Sam 7:51 : "Then David ran and stood over the Philistine and took his sword and drew it out of its sheath and killed him and cut off his head with it"

I misread. First, there is no 1 Samuel 7:50 and 51. There are some translations for 1 Samuel 17:51 that state "finished him off" or made sure he was dead. There is no motive for anyone to falsify the story to claim that David killed the man twice, and the duplication has no effect on the outcome of the story. Whether Goliath was mortally wounded or killed Goliath by the slingshot doesn't matter, because David was able to stand over Goliath without resistance and cut his head off.

 

[Mercury]

First, there is no 1 Samuel 7:50 and 51.

A mis-type on my part which I have corrected.

You've failed to address the glaring contradiction in the verses though. If you're going to appeal to a specific Bible version then do so by stating which version you believe to be true and which versions you believe to be false. Then either way, demonstrate that the Bible doesn't state that David KILLED Goliath with a sling and stone, and then took out his sword and KILLED Goliath a second time.
I bet you can't do it

 

[JustTheFacts]

A mis-type on my part which I have corrected.

You've failed to address the glaring contradiction in the verses though. If you're going to appeal to a specific Bible version then do so by stating which version you believe to be true and which versions you believe to be false. Then either way, demonstrate that the Bible doesn't state that David KILLED Goliath with a sling and stone, and then took out his sword and KILLED Goliath a second time.
I bet you can't do it

I guess "Humanist" means, regardless or what anyone says about the Bible you won't believe it. 1 Samuel 17:51 DOES NOT STATE THAT DAVID KILLED GOLIATH TWICE-that is your interpretation. I gave you mine which is more reasonable with the various translations and surrounding scripture. I am confident that if David did kill Goliath twice, the Bible would have specifically said that.

 

[Mercury]

I guess "Humanist" means, regardless or what anyone says about the Bible you won't believe it. 1 Samuel 17:51 DOES NOT STATE THAT DAVID KILLED GOLIATH TWICE-that is your interpretation. I gave you mine which is more reasonable with the various translations and surrounding scripture. I am confident that if David did kill Goliath twice, the Bible would have specifically said that.

You're in denial JTF.

I've given you clear quotes from the Bible. Here they are again using different versions:

NIV

50 So David triumphed over the Philistine with a sling and a stone; without a sword in his hand he struck down the Philistine and killed him.
51 David ran and stood over him. He took hold of the Philistine’s sword and drew it from the sheath. After he killed him, he cut off his head with the sword.

KJB

50 So David prevailed over the Philistine with a sling and with a stone, and smote the Philistine, and slew him; but there was no sword in the hand of David.
51 Therefore David ran, and stood upon the Philistine, and took his sword, and drew it out of the sheath thereof, and slew him, and cut off his head therewith. And when the Philistines saw their champion was dead, they fled.

BSB

50 Thus David prevailed over the Philistine with a sling and a stone; without a sword in his hand he struck down the Philistine and killed him.
51 David ran and stood over him. He grabbed the Philistine’s sword and pulled it from its sheath and killed him; and he cut off his head with the sword. When the Philistines saw that their hero was dead, they turned and ran.

ESV

50 So David prevailed over the Philistine with a sling and with a stone, and struck the Philistine and killed him. There was no sword in the hand of David.
51 Then David ran and stood over the Philistine and took his sword and drew it out of its sheath and killed him and cut off his head with it. When the Philistines saw that their champion was dead, they fled

ISV

50 David defeated the Philistine with a sling and a stone; he struck down the Philistine and killed him, and there was no sword in David's hand.
51 David ran and stood over the Philistine. He took the Philistine's sword, pulled it from its sheath, killed him, and then he cut off his head with it. When the Philistines saw that their champion was dead, they fled.

ASV

50 So David prevailed over the Philistine with a sling and with a stone, and smote the Philistine, and slew him; but there was no sword in the hand of David.
51 Then David ran, and stood over the Philistine, and took his sword, and drew it out of the sheath thereof, and slew him, and cut off his head therewith. And when the Philistines saw that their champion was dead, they fled


There's absolutely no special interpretation going on here. Verse 50 VERY CLEARY STATES in every version that David KILLED Goliath with a stone then in the very next verse 51 it VERY CLEARLY STATES he KILLED Goliath with a sword.

It's cleary an error. There are only 3 options:

1. Goliath was killed with a sling and stone
2. Goliath was killed with a sword
3. Goliath was somehow able to be killed twice

Option 3 is a nonsense within the boundaries of normal Nature

So that leaves us with 2 opposing verses.

 

[JustTheFacts]

NIV

50 So David triumphed over the Philistine with a sling and a stone; without a sword in his hand he struck down the Philistine and killed him.
51 David ran and stood over him. He took hold of the Philistine’s sword and drew it from the sheath. After he killed him, he cut off his head with the sword.

Hmmm...."after he killed him {with the stone} he cut off his head with the sword."

Your options are all your words and not what is written. Not one of those translation stated that he killed him twice or killed him again. If even one of them stated "he killed him twice" or "he killed him again" you would have a point and I would need to reconsider. Like I said, it's your interpretation that supports your disbelief of the Bible as the truth.

I note that you didn't attack my interpretation on the other two you once believed were contradictions. Fire away and start presenting at least one of your thousands of contradictions you find in the New Testament.

 

[Uncle_Sol]

... opposing verses.

I'm in a stirring mood this morning!

Amplified 50 slew, 51 killed

"slay" means action of a fatal sort, without particular emphasis on any very short term outcome

RSV has kill both times. From which I always understood what I understand, and so did the people around me. What D. did once he had the sword was finish G. off.

The thing you're up against when you come across me, is that I go way back, a very long time ago, when they taught us critical thinking.

 

[Uncle_Sol]

But can that analysis be done without adding to the scripture and inventing narratives?

But regardless, I'm game so let's do a few examples. Let me know your explanation for the following apparent contradictions:

On the issue of seeing God

"... I have seen God face to face ..." -- Genesis 32:30

"No man hath seen God at any time..."-- John 1:18


Regarding Incest

"Cursed be he that lieth with his sister, the daughter of his father, or the daughter of this mother..." -- Deuteronomy 27:22

"And if a man shall take his sister, his father's daughter, or his mother's daughter...it is a wicked thing...." -- Leviticus 20:17

Then we have Abraham making a wife of his own sister, his father's daughter:

Genesis 20:12
"And Abraham said, Because I thought, Surely the fear of God is not in this place; and they will slay me for my wife's sake. 12 And yet indeed she is my sister; she is the daughter of my father, but not the daughter of my mother; and she became my wife."

"And God said unto Abraham, As for Sarai thy wife, thou shalt not call her name Sarai, but Sarah shall her name be. 16
And I will bless her, and give thee a son also of her: yea, I will bless her, and she shall be a mother of nations.." -- Genesis 17:15-16

In one case we have a paradox (very commonplace occurrences throughout nature and culture) and in the other two we have a contrast. Since a very long time ago, I understood these things - as a quite slow infant. So did secular agnostics around me. Your own elders and betters prevailed on you to obey them in abandoning critical thinking!

 

[JustTheFacts]

I'm in a stirring mood this morning!

Amplified 50 slew, 51 killed

"slay" means action of a fatal sort, without particular emphasis on any very short term outcome

RSV has kill both times. From which I always understood what I understand, and so did the people around me. What D. did once he had the sword was finish G. off.

The thing you're up against when you come across me, is that I go way back, a very long time ago, when they taught us critical thinking.

lol. But they didn't teach you how to read, because it DOES NOT STATE HE WAS KILLED TWICE. You can read what ever you want into the details of document that is thousands of years old and translated many times over. I gave you an alternative interpretation and you don't like it. The words may indicate that Goliath was killed twice, but nowhere in the Bible is that explicitly stated. The only one who affirms it is YOU. You may think you learned critical thinking, but I wonder what those around you think.

 

[JustTheFacts]

In one case we have a paradox (very commonplace occurrences throughout nature and culture) and in the other two we have a contrast. Since a very long time ago, I understood these things - as a quite slow infant. So did secular agnostics around me. Your own elders and betters prevailed on you to obey them in abandoning critical thinking!

Why are you repeating these when I already addressed them earlier?

Back to David allegedly killing Goliath twice as you believe, I have the following evidence to deal with:

1. The verses you cite do not stated that David killed Goliath twice. It may be suggested, but it is not stated.
2. There is no apparent reason for God to have David kill Goliath twice.
3. Had David killed Goliath twice, this miraculous event would surely be repeated again in the word of God, but it is never mentioned.
4. There is a feasible interpretation of it as an alternative.

You may claim to be a critical thinker, but I follow the evidence. Based on the evidence here, I can safely conclude that it is a simple interpretation/scribe anomaly that you want to believe is a serious contradiction. Like I said, all apparent contradictions in the word of God can be resolved through the word of God. In addition, if you want to focus on apparent contradictions, please provide New Testament examples because that has been my focus--except for Daniel prophecy because without Daniel, Revelation cannot be solved and explained.

 

[Frankj]

FWIW,

When I find a 'discrepancy' in the Bible I don't look to find the fault lying within the Bible and what it is saying but in myself in that I don't understand it and need to work on my own understanding of what is being said instead.

Better to look for how it is true than ignoring it as a mistake.