Disagreements between Catholics and Protestants

[Faith]

ND is Non-Denominational, right?

If that's the case, then you disagree with a ton more than just old earth, young earth arguments. By changing to non-denominational, you also disagree that baptism washes away sins, you disagree that the Lord is present in Holy Communion, you disagree that the Pastor stands in the stead of Christ for absolution.

Yes.

 

[Faith]

Yes.

A priest I was talking to insists that sins aren’t absolved in the LCMS during confession. Which Ithinkis wrong.

 

[Faith]

Thing is: Neither of those are issues in the LCMS. Neither are doctrines, neither are required views. And the LCMS stands on MANY things. I wonder about "leaving" over two non-issues while entirely ignoring SO many that you agree with.






"Non-denoms" tend fall into two groups:

1. Pure emotionalism and relativism. Whatever makes you feel good is good to them. "What is truth?" Doesn't matter. Feelings do.
2. They ARE some denomination they just won't admit it; they want to hide their theological views (which are typically Anabaptist or Pentecostal)



.

Well, the one closest to my house, which is probably where I might go,is very Bible centered. Yes, they do have the loud music and flashing lights but are very Bible centered. They also have a lot of former Catholics who now go there. The downside is my hubby hates it there and while he isn’t a churchgoer with the exceptions of Christmas, Easter and the occasional Sunday (if I beg), he probably wont go with me to the Christmas service this year if I go there.
He went once and was dressed nicely for Christmas and then everybody was in jeans and flannel shirts. He didn’t enjoy it at all. It was too loud and casual for him.

 

[Josiah]

The two issues are the age of the earth and theistic evolution, which I believe in.

AGAIN, neither of those is even mentioned (at all) in the Lutheran Confessions. As a layperson, you are asked to agree with what Luther states in his Small Catechism. THAT'S IT. And there is NOTHING there about the age of our planet or evolution (although it states that God is the Creator but nothing about HOW).

True, MOST (but by no means all) leaders in the LCMS believe in a six-day Creation and a fairly new planet. But then most of them are also Republicans and pro-life but that doesn't mean ERGO you have to be in order to be Lutheran. We have Democrats and pro-choice people in my Lutheran parish - and THAT'S FINE.

I’m considering a ND church.

I hope you hold that church to exactly the same criteria: You must fully agree with that church on EVERYTHING - official views, common views, required views, non-required views....

Frankly, I'd respect you more if you returned to the RCC. But you'll likely find your local RCC parish says a LOT of things that you aren't required to agree with. Why, my former priest was a HUGE Boston Red Socks fan, talked about them all the time, asked prayers for them. I wasn't a fan of the Yankees.



.

 

[Albion]

Hmmm. I would guess that attending a Lutheran service of Holy Communion would leave you feeling approximately the same way as you do at a Catholic Mass, then. If so, a non-denominational church would be a way of solving the "problem," that's right.

But so also would a score of denominational churches, so I hope you are as careful when it comes to finding an alternative to both the Catholics and Lutherans as you have been when trying to decide if one or the other of these was the right one for you. People do sometimes have the idea that if it's "non-denominational" it means the church is impartial when it comes to the issues and practices that have divided the older denominations.

 

[Albion]

A priest I was talking to insists that sins aren’t absolved in the LCMS during confession.

Other than for a technical exception in the case of the Eastern Orthodox, that's what the Catholic Church says about every church that isn't one of its own. If the pastor isn't a Roman Catholic, then he is deemed to be incapable of absolving sins.

If you aren't a Roman Catholic in good standing, I cannot imagine why this claim would matter.

 

[Faith]

AGAIN, neither of those is even mentioned (at all) in the Lutheran Confessions. As a layperson, you are asked to agree with what Luther states in his Small Catechism. THAT'S IT. And there is NOTHING there about the age of our planet or evolution (although it states that God is the Creator but nothing about HOW).

True, MOST (but by no means all) leaders in the LCMS believe in a six-day Creation and a fairly new planet. But then most of them are also Republicans and pro-life but that doesn't mean ERGO you have to be in order to be Lutheran. We have Democrats and pro-choice people in my Lutheran parish - and THAT'S FINE.




I hope you hold that church to exactly the same criteria: You must fully agree with that church on EVERYTHING - official views, common views, required views, non-required views....

Frankly, I'd respect you more if you returned to the RCC. But you'll likely find your local RCC parish says a LOT of things that you aren't required to agree with. Why, my former priest was a HUGE Boston Red Socks fan, talked about them all the time, asked prayers for them. I wasn't a fan of the Yankees.



.

I know you keep telling me that it’s not mentioned in the Lutheran Confessions, but it really bothers me because it is church teaching. And among every person I’ve spoken to about this (laypersons) they all agree in YEC and Biblical Creation.

I mentioned this before but for those who haven’t read it, I was even told that I couldn’t teach anything there (which is fine, I don’t and didn’t want to) due to my beliefs. We wouldn’t want one of those pesky old earthers to teach something against the church,

 

[Faith]

Other than for a technical exception in the case of the Eastern Orthodox, that's what the Catholic Church says about every church that isn't one of its own. If the pastor isn't a Roman Catholic, then he is deemed to be incapable of absolving sins.

If you aren't a Roman Catholic in good standing, I cannot imagine why this claim would matter.

I’m not a RC in good standing. Last time I was there I went to confession and confessed that I went to the Lutheran church and took Communion and the priest wouldn’t absolve me until I sincerely said I’d return th the RCC. So I didn’t even stay for Mass. after confession was over, I left.

 

[Albion]

I’m not a RC in good standing. Last time I was there I went to confession and confessed that I went to the Lutheran church and took Communion and the priest wouldn’t absolve me until I sincerely said I’d return th the RCC. So I didn’t even stay for Mass. after confession was over, I left.

Well, that wasn't the point I was addressing. Whether you currently are a Catholic in good standing OR if you are not in good standing...

if you were to decide on the Catholic Church after considering the Lutheran church, you would have to become a Catholic in good standing.

And if you did that, you would automatically be affirming all the doctrines that the church demands of its members as essential. In the case of those Marian doctrines (the Immaculate Conception and the Assumption), to reject them or to have any reservation of mind about them would be considered a mortal sin according to the church.

 

[Faith]

AGAIN, neither of those is even mentioned (at all) in the Lutheran Confessions. As a layperson, you are asked to agree with what Luther states in his Small Catechism. THAT'S IT. And there is NOTHING there about the age of our planet or evolution (although it states that God is the Creator but nothing about HOW).

True, MOST (but by no means all) leaders in the LCMS believe in a six-day Creation and a fairly new planet. But then most of them are also Republicans and pro-life but that doesn't mean ERGO you have to be in order to be Lutheran. We have Democrats and pro-choice people in my Lutheran parish - and THAT'S FINE.




I hope you hold that church to exactly the same criteria: You must fully agree with that church on EVERYTHING - official views, common views, required views, non-required views....

Frankly, I'd respect you more if you returned to the RCC. But you'll likely find your local RCC parish says a LOT of things that you aren't required to agree with. Why, my former priest was a HUGE Boston Red Socks fan, talked about them all the time, asked prayers for them. I wasn't a fan of the Yankees.



.

I just know that I don’t want to return to Catholicism.

 

[Faith]

Well, that wasn't the point I was addressing. Whether you currently are a Catholic in good standing OR if you are not in good standing...

if you were to decide on the Catholic Church after considering the Lutheran church, you would have to become a Catholic in good standing.

And if you did that, you would automatically be affirming all the doctrines that the church demands of its members as essential. In the case of those Marian doctrines (the Immaculate Conception and the Assumption), to reject them or to have any reservation of mind about them would be considered a mortal sin according to the church.

I have reservations about the Assumption of Mary and her being ever- virgin.

 

[1689Dave]

Have you ever considered that denominations revolve around the errors that divide them from the body of Christ? Paul warned the body about divisions early on. He said:

“And I, brethren, could not speak unto you as unto spiritual, but as unto carnal, even as unto babes in Christ. I have fed you with milk, and not with meat: for hitherto ye were not able to bear it, neither yet now are ye able. For ye are yet carnal: for whereas there is among you envying, and strife, and divisions, are ye not carnal, and walk as men? For while one saith, I am of Paul; and another, I am of Apollos; are ye not carnal?” 1 Corinthians 3:1–4 (KJV 1900)

 

[Albion]

Unless it's a cult (and I won't name the obvious examples) ALL the different denominations, whether Catholic, Orthodox, or Protestant, are part of the Body of Christ. With people who refuse to join any community or assembly of Christians, however, it's not so clear. At best, they amount to people who have created their own little denomination, so there's no improvement in that over the differences existing between the recognized denominations.

 

[1689Dave]

Unless it's a cult (and I won't name the obvious examples) ALL the different denominations, whether Catholic, Orthodox, or Protestant, are part of the Body of Christ. With people who refuse to join any community or assembly of Christians, however, it's not so clear. At best, they amount to people who have created their own little denomination, so there's no improvement in that over the differences existing between the recognized denominations.

It seems all are man-made having nothing to do with the scripture model. Cults are quilty of the same.

 

[Albion]

I just know that I don’t want to return to Catholicism.

Ah. I didn't realize that you'd made this decision final. But because you have, you're making progress and we're happy for you.

 

[Albion]

It seems all are man-made having nothing to do with the scripture model.

Obviously, the people who opt for the "lone wolf Christian" approach think that way, but they couldn't be more wrong and unscriptural when doing so, even if they have good intentions.

 

[1689Dave]

Obviously, the people who opt for the "lone wolf Christian" approach think that way, but they couldn't be more wrong and unscriptural when doing so, even if they have good intentions.

Haven't you admitted to dividing yourself off from the body of Christ in saying this?

 

[Albion]

Haven't you admitted to dividing yourself off from the body of Christ in saying this?

No.

 

[Faith]

Ah. I didn't realize that you'd made this decision final. But because you have, you're making progress and we're happy for you.

Thanks.

 

[1689Dave]

No.

I take what Paul said as God's word on the matter.