Born again

[Albion]

To prefer is not to insist. To express an opinion is not to insist.

Very well, "insist" might not have been the best word for it, but you did more in your posts than merely offer an opinion. I responded to an error of fact that was used to prop up that opinion, and I explained why it was in error.

 

[MoreCoffee]

The phrase "γεννηθῇ ἄνωθεν" (gennēthē ánōthen) appears in the New Testament in John 3:3 and 3:7, and is traditionally translated as "born again" or "born from above." Both translations have merit, and which one is considered more accurate depends on the context in which the phrase is being used.

The translation "born again" emphasizes the idea of a spiritual rebirth, where a person is transformed and made new by the power of the Holy Spirit. This translation is often used in Christian contexts where the focus is on personal salvation and the individual's relationship with God.

The translation "born from above" emphasizes the idea of being born into a new realm or sphere of existence, where one is no longer bound by the limitations of the natural world. This translation is often used in contexts where the focus is on the cosmic significance of Jesus' message and the way in which it transforms the world.

Both translations capture the meaning of the Greek phrase, which can be understood as spiritual rebirth or being born into a new realm of existence. Ultimately, the choice between "born again" and "born from above" will depend on the context in which the phrase is being used and the intended audience.

 

[brightfame52]

donadams

How do we become born again?

By the resurrection of Jesus Christ 1 Pet 1:3

3 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, which according to his abundant mercy hath begotten us again unto a lively hope by the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead,

 

[Albion]

By the resurrection of Jesus Christ 1 Pet 1:3

3 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, which according to his abundant mercy hath begotten us again unto a lively hope by the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead,

Are you saying that, in the process by which a person becomes a child of God, there is no role for what is often called "a conversion experience" by which he affirms and trusts Christ as Lord and Savior?? In other words, it just happens to the individual without any input, activity, commitment, or affirmation on his part??

 

[brightfame52]

Are you saying that, in the process by which a person becomes a child of God, there is no role for what is often called "a conversion experience" by which he affirms and trusts Christ as Lord and Savior?? In other words, it just happens to the individual without any input, activity, commitment, or affirmation on his part??

Im saying what the verse is saying, that people were born again by the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead. This is stated to be unto a lively hope. being born again brings with is a conversion unto Jesus Christ.

In fact, it brings about a new life unto God. The words "begotten again" are the greek word anagennaō:

1. to produce again, be born again, born anew
2. metaph. to have one's mind changed so that he lives a new life and one conformed to the will of God

So everyone Christ died for, Justified them, and His resurrection communicates to them the New Birth which brings about a new life devoted to God in Christ.

So if a person is never born again, Christ never died and rose again for them.

 

[Albion]

Im saying what the verse is saying, that people were born again by the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead. This is stated to be unto a lively hope. being born again brings with is a conversion unto Jesus Christ.

In fact, it brings about a new life unto God. The words "begotten again" are the greek word anagennaō:

1. to produce again, be born again, born anew
2. metaph. to have one's mind changed so that he lives a new life and one conformed to the will of God

So everyone Christ died for, Justified them, and His resurrection communicates to them the New Birth which brings about a new life devoted to God in Christ.

That's interesting. The problem is that it's contrary to what Jesus himself explained that it means.

So if a person is never born again, Christ never died and rose again for them.

That's poetic, I suppose, but it's not sound theology.

 

[brightfame52]

That's interesting. The problem is that it's contrary to what Jesus himself explained that it means.

That's poetic, I suppose, but it's not sound theology.

Im sure Peter knew what Jesus means more than you.

 

[Albion]

Im sure Peter knew what Jesus means more than you.

Could be, but it's YOUR misunderstanding that we're dealing with here.

Christ himself used the words that are under discussion, and he went so far as to define or illustrate his point after Nicodemus failed to understand it, so there's not much room for an "out of left field" alternate interpretation from a lone reader 2000 years later.

 

[brightfame52]

Could be, but it's YOUR misunderstanding that we're dealing with here.

Christ himself used the words that are under discussion, and he went so far as to define or illustrate his point after Nicodemus failed to understand it, so there's not much room for an "out of left field" alternate interpretation from a lone reader 2000 years later.

So according to Peter how were they born again in 1 Pet 1:3

3 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, which according to his abundant mercy hath begotten us again unto a lively hope by the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead,


Blessed [gratefully praised and adored] be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who according to His abundant and boundless mercy has caused us to be born again [that is, to be reborn from above—spiritually transformed, renewed, and set apart for His purpose] to an ever-living hope and confident assurance through the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead,

 

[Albion]

So according to Peter how were they born again in 1 Pet 1:3

3 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, which according to his abundant mercy hath begotten us again unto a lively hope by the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead,


Blessed [gratefully praised and adored] be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who according to His abundant and boundless mercy has caused us to be born again [that is, to be reborn from above—spiritually transformed, renewed, and set apart for His purpose] to an ever-living hope and confident assurance through the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead,

Those verses don't refer to the same thing I was pointing out, and yet there is no conflict between what Christ had said about being "born again" and the more general concept of what accompanies that step, i.e. us having been given a new start, etc.

 

[brightfame52]

Those verses don't refer to the same thing I was pointing out, and yet there is no conflict between what Christ had said about being "born again" and the more general concept of what accompanies that step, i.e. us having been given a new start, etc.

Are you going to answer the question

 

[Albion]

I did.

And I had addressed the same point in an earlier post. However, I didn't have much hope, either time, that the matter would even then be understood. It looks like I was right about that.

Maybe if you would actually identify what it is that you don't understand.... (?)

 

[Joelightening]

Hearing what Christ says and doing what he says is faith. So yes we live by faith.

 

[Odë:hgöd]

.
I rather suspect that the Christian ritual of water baptism for obtaining the Spirit
birth Jesus spoke of in John 3:3-8 is popular with folks because it's impersonal,
i.e. it doesn't require them taking the initiative to start a rapport with Heaven.

Well; I didn't take any chances. Very soon after discovering that Christ had me in
mind when he went to the cross, I visited a local church and went down front with
the some elders to pray this very naive prayer.

"God, I know I'm a sinner. I would like to take advantage of your son's death"

Seeing as how Jesus gave his life for the whole world, then God couldn't very well
refuse my request; now could He.

• Rom 5:6-8 . . Christ died for the impious. Very rarely will anyone die for a
righteous man, though for a good man someone might possibly dare to die. But
God demonstrates His own love for us in this: While we were still sinners, Christ
died for us.

• Matt 10:32 . .Whoever acknowledges me before men, I will also acknowledge him
before my Father in heaven.
_

 

[Albion]

.
I rather suspect that the Christian ritual of water baptism for obtaining the Spirit
birth Jesus spoke of in John 3:3-8 is popular with folks is because it's impersonal,
i.e. it doesn't require them taking the initiative to start a rapport with Heaven.

How so? They have to make a public profession of their conversion to Christ, answer questions, take vows about being committed to that new life, and undergo the ritual with water, etc.

That sounds to me like it's anything BUT an "impersonal" thing that "doesn't require them taking the initiative to start" anything different from what they were the day before they were baptized!