Five Reasons Why Babies Should be Baptized...

[Lamb]

Are you forgetting Romans 10:9-10, there is a process we have to do to recieve Christ as these verses tell us. I agree that the Holy Spirit draws but it is still a choice

When taken out of context it would seem that Paul is saying that. But you can't eliminate what earlier on was said in Romans about no one can say Jesus is Lord except by the Holy Spirit. And later on where it says that Faith comes by hearing and hearing by the word of God.

So how does that verse you supplied fit in? It's not saying it's up to us. Absolutely not. It's pointing to faith in Jesus and that believers will have a response. How can we not since there are signs of faith joy, hope, etc...

Here is a great audio about that verse in Romans you think is giving a salvation formula for you to follow (even though it's not since salvation is God's doing)
https://issuesetc.org/2014/10/17/2-...-with-your-mouth-pr-bryan-wolfmueller-101714/

Here is a site that specifically addresses infant baptism and your Romans verse
http://www.gslc-gsls.com/romans10-9-intro.html

 

[Lamb]

The point is it comes with consent. If I was baptised as an infant with no recollection of being baptized, I still believe it's the parents or guardians that are given the responsibility not the infant. They are held accountable not the baby for following in the way of the Lord by teaching the child as it grows, like Timothy's teachers. If, as I said in the previous post about my experience as a child, I had never gone to sunday school would I know how to prayer that began the first contact? Probably not, my parents used sunday school as a babysitter. In my 20's the dream came but I was busy living for me. Baptizm is a commitment to live for Him, to die to self. An infant cannot do that.

God is at work in baptism. Being baptized as a baby and not remembering it in NO WAY invalidates God's work in baptism.

 

[psalms 91]

When taken out of context it would seem that Paul is saying that. But you can't eliminate what earlier on was said in Romans about no one can say Jesus is Lord except by the Holy Spirit. And later on where it says that Faith comes by hearing and hearing by the word of God.

So how does that verse you supplied fit in? It's not saying it's up to us. Absolutely not. It's pointing to faith in Jesus and that believers will have a response. How can we not since there are signs of faith joy, hope, etc...

Here is a great audio about that verse in Romans you think is giving a salvation formula for you to follow (even though it's not since salvation is God's doing)
https://issuesetc.org/2014/10/17/2-...-with-your-mouth-pr-bryan-wolfmueller-101714/

Here is a site that specifically addresses infant baptism and your Romans verse
http://www.gslc-gsls.com/romans10-9-intro.html

Why would the Holy Spirit draw devils to call out His name? We are shown that when He set the demoniac free

 

[Josiah]

Why would the Holy Spirit draw devils to call out His name? We are shown that when He set the demoniac free

Knowledge, even acknowledgement, is not faith. The devil KNOWS everything about Jesus.... and evidently is beyond the "age of reasoning" and probably has a sufficient IQ. There's even some evidence he is well trained in Scripture. Has the devil thus saved himself by learning lots of stuff and being old enough and smart enough? IMO, no. Why? Because he has no FAITH (trust, reliance). THAT is the gift of God, not our own doing lest anyone can boast. This is just one reason why Jesus points us to the faith of a child, not of the Pharisees or the demons.

 

[Lamb]

Why would the Holy Spirit draw devils to call out His name? We are shown that when He set the demoniac free

I'm confused. How does that work in with infant baptism?

 

[Cassia]

Knowledge, even acknowledgement, is not faith. The devil KNOWS everything about Jesus.... and evidently is beyond the "age of reasoning" and probably has a sufficient IQ. There's even some evidence he is well trained in Scripture. Has the devil thus saved himself by learning lots of stuff and being old enough and smart enough? IMO, no. Why? Because he has no FAITH (trust, reliance). THAT is the gift of God, not our own doing lest anyone can boast. This is just one reason why Jesus points us to the faith of a child, not of the Pharisees or the demons.

Faith of a child, when they can only depend on others and cannot make the decision to live for themselves.

But I see this to be an argument that he who talks longest wins so I withdraw from the topic.

 

[Lamb]

Faith of a child, when they can only depend on others and cannot make the decision to live for themselves.

But I see this to be an argument that he who talks longest wins so I withdraw from the topic.

Your decision to live for Jesus isn't what saves you. His death on the cross is what forgives your sins and you have been given faith to believe that so you may have eternal life.

 

[Cassia]

Your decision to live for Jesus isn't what saves you. His death on the cross is what forgives your sins and you have been given faith to believe that so you may have eternal life.

No kidding? It seems what is being repeated is what every Christian knows and call that reasoning toward what is being questioned instead of giving answers that apply to the question in particular.

 

[Lamb]

No kidding? It seems what is being repeated is what every Christian knows and call that reasoning toward what is being questioned instead of giving answers that apply to the topic in particular.

What's being presented is Jesus as Savior and we are saved by grace through faith in Him. Baptism gives the gift of the Holy Spirit and faith.

 

[Cassia]

What's being presented is Jesus as Savior and we are saved by grace through faith in Him. Baptism gives the gift of the Holy Spirit and faith.

Whitewash away from infant baptism. :sigh: but of course evryone is following so no further bringing up old posts to questions need apply, right?

 

[Lamb]

Whitewash away from infant baptism. :sigh: but of course evryone is following so no further bringing up old posts to questions need apply, right?

What questions do you have? You brought up about a baby can't decide to live for Jesus as a reason why babies shouldn't be baptized. But scripture doesn't state that THAT is a per-requisite. Jesus told the disciples to baptize and teach. They go hand in hand. Jesus didn't say ONLY teach first and then baptize. Or only baptize people of a certain age.

 

[Josiah]

What questions do you have? You brought up about a baby can't decide to live for Jesus as a reason why babies shouldn't be baptized. But scripture doesn't state that THAT is a per-requisite. Jesus told the disciples to baptize and teach. They go hand in hand. Jesus didn't say ONLY teach first and then baptize. Or only baptize people of a certain age.

Correct.


Jesus said, "baptize and teach." He didn't say, "But only if they have an IQ above the level of 'X' and accept all the philosophies of the Enlightenment and have attained the age of 'X'."

The "and" here is a connector. The word "kai" (just like our word "and") does not mandate or even imply order, it just connects the two. Yes..... faith, baptism, repentance, teach.... yes, they are connected, but removing the word "and" (just deleting that) and replacing it with "then" is CHANGING Scripture, not believing Scripture. And adding "but only if the person has celebrated their ___ birthday and have an IQ above the level of _____and have first expressed their remorse and faith in Christ's mercy and recited 'The Sinner's Prayer' and performed the rite of an altar call...." are also CHANGING Scripture, not believing Scripture.



Soli DEO Gloria



- Josiah

 

[Lamb]

Correct.


Jesus said, "baptize and teach." He didn't say, "But only if they have an IQ above the level of 'X' and accept all the philosophies of the Enlightenment and have attained the age of 'X'."

The "and" here is a connector. The word "kai" (just like our word "and") does not mandate or even imply order, it just connects the two. Yes..... faith, baptism, repentance, teach.... yes, they are connected, but removing the word "and" (just deleting that) and replacing it with "then" is CHANGING Scripture, not believing Scripture. And adding "but only if the person has celebrated their ___ birthday and have an IQ above the level of _____and have first expressed their remorse and faith in Christ's mercy and recited 'The Sinner's Prayer' and performed the rite of an altar call...." are also CHANGING Scripture, not believing Scripture.

Right!

Baptism is inclusive because Jesus said to baptize all nations. Baptism is Gospel. Those who say baptism is merely a commitment have turned it into Law, being something they think they're doing. But be baptized is passive, you aren't doing anything in it. Something is being done to you. God's word is efficacious. It's not just information for us to ponder and then make a decision. It's actually alive and powerful and at work. God has given promises in baptism and that means it is effective because of His word. He doesn't lie.

 

[ImaginaryDay2]

Your decision to live for Jesus isn't what saves you. His death on the cross is what forgives your sins and you have been given faith to believe that so you may have eternal life.

No kidding?

No kidding:

I didn't get baptized until I was in my 30's and that's when, with the decision to commit, that the spirit was fully awakened and He became my source in life.

The Spirit that was awakened in you drew you to baptism. Your source in life, the Source of all life, showed His grace to you, and led you.

 

[MoreCoffee]

Have we agreed that baptism is rightly administered to infants yet?

 

[ImaginaryDay2]

Have we agreed that baptism is rightly administered to infants yet?

Yeeeeaaaahhhhhhh..... no.

 

[psalms 91]

nope

 

[Lamb]

Have we agreed that baptism is rightly administered to infants yet?

Those who do not agree still don't see that it's God's work in baptism and that it effects what He promises through the water and word. Otherwise they would would gladly bring their entire households to be baptized as the early Christians did. They would want those benefits that God gives to be given to everyone!

 

[Cassia]

..Is there a ceremony that they go thru to dedicate themselves after leaving their parents ?

What questions do you have? You brought up about a baby can't decide to live for Jesus as a reason why babies shouldn't be baptized. But scripture doesn't state that THAT is a per-requisite. Jesus told the disciples to baptize and teach. They go hand in hand. Jesus didn't say ONLY teach first and then baptize. Or only baptize people of a certain age.

The first question asked was whether an infant has a later ceremony if/when they make a decision to die to the world and become one with Christ.

 

[Lamb]

The first question asked was whether an infant has a later ceremony if/when they make a decision to die to the world and become one with Christ.

Should he?

In my church there are catechism classes that children take and then there is Confirmation and that is where the child professes faith (faith given to them at their baptisms if baptized as babies) in Jesus as their Savior in front of the congregation. Lutherans don't put emphasis on man like other churches do so decision isn't part of our theology. The scriptures focus on God's work for our salvation. We acknowledge and receive Him.