A thought (or two) on unity.

[popsthebuilder]

The only thing I will say is that Jesus said there is only one way on to the Father and that is by me and also does it not say that there is a way that seems right to man but leads to destruction?

The ways I speak of do not refute Jesus the Christ as the way and in fact speak to and prophesy about the fire, light, son,way, spirit, devotion, of GOD.

Things often seem one way, but are indeed another.

It does speak of a way that seems right hat is the path to destruction.

You and I both know that it is the path of the knowing hypocrite and misdirected, namely Babylon the whore

 

[psalms 91]

The ways I speak of do not refute Jesus the Christ as the way and in fact speak to and prophesy about the fire, light, son,way, spirit, devotion, of GOD.

Things often seem one way, but are indeed another.

It does speak of a way that seems right hat is the path to destruction.

You and I both know that it is the path of the knowing hypocrite and misdirected, namely Babylon the whore

Or those that think there are many ways to God, I knew a pastor who believed that, I did not sit under him.

 

[popsthebuilder]

Or those that think there are many ways to God, I knew a pastor who believed that, I did not sit under him.

There is one way. It is following the teachings and example of the Christ. This is reiderated in the faith I speak of, though most refuse to inquire if it, let alone accept it.

 

[TurtleHare]

This topic isn't about unity.

Nice how triune was slipped in there....Wholly negating any real unity. Life is a unit formed by and of GOD. Though there are seeming differences in sorts of faith in GOD, they do comprise the body of the church of GOD. This is world wide and in no way limited to "Christian's" regardless of what they have been lead to believe.

I'm sure this will be taken like a slap in the face....Interesting...Now I'm curious.

peace

I'm a little stunned by your response and I need to ask whether you think that non-Christians comprise the body of the church of God because doesn't God cast aside those who deny the one who died on the cross into the lake of fire since they are not of the faith?

 

[MoreCoffee]

This topic isn't about unity.

Nice how triune was slipped in there....Wholly negating any real unity. Life is a unit formed by and of GOD. Though there are seeming differences in sorts of faith in GOD, they do comprise the body of the church of GOD. This is world wide and in no way limited to "Christian's" regardless of what they have been lead to believe.

I'm sure this will be taken like a slap in the face....Interesting...Now I'm curious.

peace

The truth is that I put this topic here in this forum because I wanted to hear from chaps like Mark if he wanted to reply. I did it deliberately so that it would not be one of those pointless in fights between allegedly "true Christians".

 

[popsthebuilder]

I'm a little stunned by your response and I need to ask whether you think that non-Christians comprise the body of the church of God because doesn't God cast aside those who deny the one who died on the cross into the lake of fire since they are not of the faith?

None of the faithful unto GOD I speak of deny the Christ.

Fear and warmongering are the tactics of those against the will of GOD and these tactics are used to keep the ignorant blinded to the apparent. Though in this day and age, nothing can hold back the truth. The information age is a great thing.

 

[popsthebuilder]

The truth is that I put this topic here in this forum because I wanted to hear from chaps like Mark if he wanted to reply. I did it deliberately so that it would not be one of those pointless in fights between allegedly "true Christians".

Then I will desist in my current line of discussion. I would rather it not turn to that either.

 

[MoreCoffee]

This is just a little note by way of reminding folk what the thread is about. The thread started with a quote from a Catholic Church council document - it's official Catholic teaching. The quote introduces the idea of unity among Christians.

The restoration of unity among all Christians is one of the principal concerns of the Second Vatican Council. Christ the Lord founded one Church and one Church only. However, many Christian communions present themselves to men as the true inheritors of Jesus Christ; all indeed profess to be followers of the Lord but differ in mind and go their different ways, as if Christ Himself were divided.[SUP](1)[/SUP] Such division openly contradicts the will of Christ, scandalizes the world, and damages the holy cause of preaching the Gospel to every creature.

But the Lord of Ages wisely and patiently follows out the plan of grace on our behalf, sinners that we are. In recent times more than ever before, He has been rousing divided Christians to remorse over their divisions and to a longing for unity. Everywhere large numbers have felt the impulse of this grace, and among our separated brethren also there increases from day to day the movement, fostered by the grace of the Holy Spirit, for the restoration of unity among all Christians. This movement toward unity is called "ecumenical." Those belong to it who invoke the Triune God and confess Jesus as Lord and Savior, doing this not merely as individuals but also as corporate bodies. For almost everyone regards the body in which he has heard the Gospel as his Church and indeed, God's Church. All however, though in different ways, long for the one visible Church of God, a Church truly universal and set forth into the world that the world may be converted to the Gospel and so be saved, to the glory of God.

The Sacred Council gladly notes all this. It has already declared its teaching on the Church, and now, moved by a desire for the restoration of unity among all the followers of Christ, it wishes to set before all Catholics the ways and means by which they too can respond to this grace and to this divine call. (source)

1. Cf. 1 Cor. 1, 13.

 

[Rens]

There is no unity. Period. There was in WWII. Then it didnt matter if you were catholic or reformed or whatever in that concentration camp. They were like: yes!! a christian!! Help us pray and save these souls.

 

[MoreCoffee]

There is no unity. Period. There was in WWII. Then it didnt matter if you were catholic or reformed or whatever in that concentration camp. They were like: yes!! a christian!! Help us pray and save these souls.

But it is not like that here

 

[Rens]

But it is not like that here

If people were more interested in saving souls they'd put aside all the nonsensical fights over differences the devil only uses so that the world won't see that He sent us.

 

[MoreCoffee]

If people were more interested in saving souls they'd put aside all the nonsensical fights over differences the devil only uses so that the world won't see that He sent us.

Obviously some folk prefer to fight. That is why a thread about Christian unity is filled with negative sentiment about Catholicism rather than address the topic (unity) the posters get all upset that the quote in the first post came from the second Vatican council - it is as if they don't think anything said or written by Catholics is worth hearing or reading.

 

[Rens]

Obviously some folk prefer to fight. That is why a thread about Christian unity is filled with negative sentiment about Catholicism rather than address the topic (unity) the posters get all upset that the quote in the first post came from the second Vatican council - it is as if they don't think anything said or written by Catholics is worth hearing or reading.

It must be very tiresome.

 

[MoreCoffee]

It must be very tiresome.

It would be but for knowing that God hears the good and eschews the complaints of the doubters.

 

[popsthebuilder]

Obviously some folk prefer to fight. That is why a thread about Christian unity is filled with negative sentiment about Catholicism rather than address the topic (unity) the posters get all upset that the quote in the first post came from the second Vatican council - it is as if they don't think anything said or written by Catholics is worth hearing or reading.

That is simply not true for me.

You know my problem is proclaiming a triune understanding of GOD as pertinent to salvation. That is all

 

[Rens]

There has NEVER been just one parish or denomination of such to which ALL Christians belonged. So the "restore" emphasis of yours is silly and misleading. More disturbing is your denial of the the unity we DO have by faith in Christ (as we confess in the Creed and as proclaimed in Scripture) and in lieu of that, in place of that, in stead of that, your entire focus on institutional denominations.

I agree - there will NEVER be ONE parish (and denomination of such) to which ALL Christians (past and present) are officially registered in. That has NEVER been the case, isn't now, and never will be. It's just that such has NOTHING to do with our unity, the one and holy and catholic communion of believers, the Body (not bodies) of Christ. It just means that only living Christians can officially register in a parish and because not all Christians live with say 5 miles of each other, there's likely to be more than one parish and while for 1700 years there have been denominations, NONE of these has owned and operated ALL parishes on the planet (and NONE of those parishes has had EVERY Christian officially registered in it). Won't happen. Can't happen. Doesn't need to happen.




.

At the start there was just one church. Ah but we can all go with Torben Sondergaards last reformation to get back to that lol.

 

[Rens]

That is simply not true for me.

You know my problem is proclaiming a triune understanding of GOD as pertinent to salvation. That is all

Oh but that is a real good one, because I think you can't see how God is One unless we are first all one. What about Messianics who don't believe Trinity?

 

[MoreCoffee]

At the start there was just one church. Ah but we can all go with Torben Sondergaards last reformation to get back to that lol.

How about following some even more recent chap who started a church last week? Surely the more recent that "reformation" the better it is

 

[Josiah]

And the assumption is, of course, that the Roman Catholic church is that "one true church".

Of course, the singular RC Denomination IS united with it itself. Uniquely. Solely. Only. Of course, the LDS Denomination is equally united with it itself - uniquely, solely, only. So is the EOC denomination. So is the UCC and UMC and UPC and URC and LCMS and ELCA and Unitarian/Universalist denomination.... I can't think of ANY denomination that is not at least officially, legally, institutionally at "unity" with ITSELF. But does that prove that ergo IT itself - individually, singularly, uniquely - has "unity?" Is "true?" IF so, then the LDS has attained just as much "unity" and is just as "true" as the RC Denomination.

Our Catholic friend has stressed some RESTORATION of unity. But refuses to say WHAT unity - and WHEN such existed. He refuses to say WHEN all Christians totally agreed with ALL Christians on ALL matters (unity of teachings, belief, etc.) or when ALL Christians were officially registered in ONE parish in ONE place (institutional unity) - or even when there was ONE denomination of all the parishes of the world which together contained ALL Christians on the planet (and only Christians). The whole premise of the thread is that this "unity" once existed - but he cannot (or will not) say WHEN. How can we "restore" something that never existed? Now... he can argue that ALL Christians (alive and in heaven) SHOULD be all in perfect agreement on ALL matters of thought and practice ... and that ALL Christians SHOULD all be officially registered in one parish owned and operated by one denomination.... but maybe the place for him to start is with Catholics and the RC Denomination - neither has either. And never has.

I'm not saying the RC Denomination is ergo a BAD denomination (much the same observation could be made for most denominations)..... only that it's not unique, not united in any more sense than several thousand others that might be named.


MY half cent.


- Josiah




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[Rens]

It was in the book of Acts. Then it stayed one church, but quite quickly some were from Paul, some from Apollos. This division was also when you only had Israel. 12 brothers couldn't even have unity.