Does Jeremiah 29:11 apply to Christians?

[George]

I remember this being brought up in my Old Testament class and it was said that it only applies to Israel. But some Christians do say that it still applies to all.

 

[psalms 91]

I believe it is for all

 

[Romanos]

George, what do you think about these claims? Bill, what makes you believe that?

 

[MoreCoffee]

The verse is in a letter from Jeremiah to the exiles in Babylon. Why would his letter to the exiles be directly applicable to Christians living in 2016? Here is the full text of the letter:

And these are the words of the letter which Jeremiah, the prophet, sent from Jerusalem to the remnant of the elders of the transmigration, and to the priests, and to the prophets, and to all the people, whom Nebuchadnezzar had led away from Jerusalem to Babylon, after king Jeconiah, with the queen, and the eunuchs, and the leaders of Judah and of Jerusalem, and the craftsmen and engravers, had departed from Jerusalem. It was sent by the hand of Elasah, the son of Shaphan, and by Gemariah, the son of Hilkiah, whom Zedekiah, the king of Judah, sent to Babylon to Nebuchadnezzar, the king of Babylon, saying: "Thus says the Lord of hosts, the God of Israel, to all who have been taken away, whom I have caused to be transferred from Jerusalem to Babylon: Build houses and live in them. And plant gardens, and eat from their fruit. Take wives, and conceive sons and daughters. And give wives to your sons, and give your daughters to husbands, and let them bear sons and daughters. And be multiplied there, and do not choose to be few in number. And seek the peace of the city, to which I have caused you to be taken away, and pray to the Lord on its behalf. For your peace will be in its peace. For thus says the Lord of hosts, the God of Israel: Do not allow your prophets and your diviners, who are in your midst, to seduce you. And you should pay no attention to your dreams, which you are dreaming. For they prophesy falsely to you in my name, and I have not sent them, says the Lord.

For thus says the Lord: When the seventy years will begin to be completed in Babylon, I will visit you. And I will raise up over you my good word, so that I may lead you back to this place. For I know the thoughts that I think over you, says the Lord: thoughts of peace and not of affliction, so that I may give you patience and an end. And you shall call upon me, and you shall go forth. And you shall pray to me, and I will heed you. You shall seek me. And you will find me, when you have sought me with your whole heart. And I will be found by you, says the Lord. And I will lead you back from your captivity. And I will gather you from all the nations and all the places, to which I have expelled you, says the Lord. And I will return you from the place to which I sent you into captivity. For you have said: "The Lord has raised up prophets for us in Babylon." For thus says the Lord, to the king who sits upon the throne of David, and to all the people who live in this city, to your brothers who have not departed with you in the transmigration: Thus says the Lord of hosts: Behold, I will send among them the sword, and famine, and pestilence. And I will make them like the bad figs, which cannot be eaten, because they are very bad. And I will pursue them with the sword, and with famine, and with pestilence. And I will give them over to affliction, amid all the kingdoms of the earth: as a curse, and in stupor, and with hissing, and as a disgrace among all the nations to which I have driven them out. For they have not listened to my words, says the Lord, which I sent to them through my servants, the prophets, rising while it was still night, and sending. But you have not listened, says the Lord. Therefore, listen to the word of the Lord, all you of the transmigration, whom I have sent away from Jerusalem into Babylon. Thus says the Lord of hosts, the God of Israel, to Ahab, the son of Kolaiah, and to Zedekiah, the son of Maaseiah, who prophesy falsely to you in my name: Behold, I will deliver them into the hands of Nebuchadnezzar, the king of Babylon, and he will strike them down before your eyes. And a curse will be taken up about them, by all the captives of Judah that are in Babylon, saying: "May the Lord make you like Zedekiah, and like Ahab, whom the king of Babylon fried in the fire!" For they have acted foolishly in Israel, and they have committed adultery with the wives of their friends, and they have spoken lying words in my name, which I did not command them. I am the Judge and the Witness, says the Lord. Jeremiah 29:1-23​

I underlined the verse to which George referred.

 

[psalms 91]

One, I believe that those propmises were for all that believed present and future. Are we not grafted in? If so then we are a part of Israel

 

[Lamb]

I remember this being brought up in my Old Testament class and it was said that it only applies to Israel. But some Christians do say that it still applies to all.

MoreCoffee quoted the section on this and it's important to not pull a verse out of context.

What happened was that Israel ONCE AGAIN turned from God. They were then held captive by the Babylonians. God made them a promise but it wasn't what they wanted. He actually told them that there would be peace but he also told them that they were to remain there for 70 years. That meant that they would still be held captive in their lifetime. Yet God keeps His promises.

How could this fit for us? God allows us to go through bad times but He has given us the Savior and we know end the end that we will have peace, joy, and eternal life.

 

[MoreCoffee]

One, I believe that those propmises were for all that believed present and future. Are we not grafted in? If so then we are a part of Israel

But we're not in exile in Babylon, right?

 

[psalms 91]

nope not literally but I think at least the USA could be called a type of Babylon

 

[MoreCoffee]

nope not literally but I think at least the USA could be called a type of Babylon

Then the letter is not directly applicable to Christians living in 2016. It's lessons may be applicable like the lessons in many other passages but the letter itself is not.

 

[psalms 91]

Then the letter is not directly applicable to Christians living in 2016. It's lessons may be applicable like the lessons in many other passages but the letter itself is not.

Whatever you choose to believe

 

[tango]

One, I believe that those propmises were for all that believed present and future. Are we not grafted in? If so then we are a part of Israel

It still doesn't explain why people want to take Jer 29:11 in isolation, wrenching it out of context and ignoring the preceding verse that says "When the seventy years will begin to be completed in Babylon, I will visit you. And I will raise up over you my good word, so that I may lead you back to this place."

I don't have a problem believing that God has a plan for my life, and that the plan involves good things (even if those good things don't look very good when viewed through mortal eyes from afar). The problem is that people use translations like the GNB (Jer 29:11 I alone know the plans I have for you, plans to bring you prosperity and not disaster, plans to bring about the future you hope for), see the apparent promise of God's plan to bring them prosperity, then wonder why they struggle with poverty and disaster and assume God doesn't keep his promises.

In many ways it's little different to the people who rip Job 22:28 out of context and then wonder why the things they declare don't come to pass. The only difference is they took words God actually spoke before wrenching them out of context.


An analogy I often use goes like this. I say to a friend "If you rent a van and pick me up, I'll help you move house". The offer is clear, I'll help them move. The expectation is clear too, they need to get the van. If they show up in their car and expect me to help them shift the sofa, it's not going to happen. If a couple of years down the line someone else who heard me make the offer shows up and expects to hold me to the promise they'll be disappointed because I didn't make the promise to them. I don't mean them any harm, they just can't assume I'm going to help them move because I never promised I would.

Fundamentally if we're going to stand on a promise made by God we just need to be sure that God made the promise in the first place, and that he made it in a way that applies to us.

 

[psalms 91]

It still doesn't explain why people want to take Jer 29:11 in isolation, wrenching it out of context and ignoring the preceding verse that says "When the seventy years will begin to be completed in Babylon, I will visit you. And I will raise up over you my good word, so that I may lead you back to this place."

I don't have a problem believing that God has a plan for my life, and that the plan involves good things (even if those good things don't look very good when viewed through mortal eyes from afar). The problem is that people use translations like the GNB (Jer 29:11 I alone know the plans I have for you, plans to bring you prosperity and not disaster, plans to bring about the future you hope for), see the apparent promise of God's plan to bring them prosperity, then wonder why they struggle with poverty and disaster and assume God doesn't keep his promises.

In many ways it's little different to the people who rip Job 22:28 out of context and then wonder why the things they declare don't come to pass. The only difference is they took words God actually spoke before wrenching them out of context.


An analogy I often use goes like this. I say to a friend "If you rent a van and pick me up, I'll help you move house". The offer is clear, I'll help them move. The expectation is clear too, they need to get the van. If they show up in their car and expect me to help them shift the sofa, it's not going to happen. If a couple of years down the line someone else who heard me make the offer shows up and expects to hold me to the promise they'll be disappointed because I didn't make the promise to them. I don't mean them any harm, they just can't assume I'm going to help them move because I never promised I would.

Fundamentally if we're going to stand on a promise made by God we just need to be sure that God made the promise in the first place, and that he made it in a way that applies to us.

This I agree with, if the promise isnt kept then it is not God but us who fail, The promisrs of Gos are conditional, if you do this then i will do this. They need to dig and find out why God isnt moving

 

[Brighten04]

I think what God has promised Israel, the same goes for the church as ingrafted Israel.

 

[Rens]

Maybe it's for Israel now. Anyways, I don't care and pluck that text out of context and take it for myself too. Not the not so nice parts of course.

 

[tango]

This I agree with, if the promise isnt kept then it is not God but us who fail, The promisrs of Gos are conditional, if you do this then i will do this. They need to dig and find out why God isnt moving

The promises of God also need to be taken in context - the fact that God promised something to a specific individual at one point in history doesn't mean he will automatically offer the exact same thing to someone today. Obvious examples include the promise made to Cain in Gen 4:15 and the promise made to Abram in Gen 15:5.