An objective look into "the sinners prayer"

[Alithis]

The sinner's prayer appears to be okay on the whole. The theology that is behind it for some people is bad theology but the prayer itself seems okay. It says something like this, right?

Dear Lord Jesus, I know that I am a sinner, and I ask for Your forgiveness. I believe You died for my sins and rose from the dead. I turn from my sins and invite You to come into my heart and life. I want to trust and follow You as my Lord and Savior. In Your Name.

Amen​

It is vaguely reminiscent of an act of contrition which goes something like this.

O my God, I am heartily sorry for having offended Thee, and I detest all my sins, because they offend Thee, my God, Who are all good and deserving of all my love. I firmly resolve, with the help of Thy grace to amend my life. Amen​

exactly - .. so , where in scripture are we ever instructed or taught to do that and where in scripture is there ANY example of people preaching that to the unsaved ?

no where .
so from whence did it originate if the directive to do so does not exist in the scriptures ?
since God is not a man that he should lie and cannot contradict himself ,the directive has not originated in the Spirit of God .

 

[Alithis]

I"ve found what "Evangelicals" mean by "full gospel" is "no Gospel - just a LOT of OUR hoop jumping, a LOT of Law, a LOT of guilt, a LOT of making self the Savior. It usually means the elimination of the Gospel.

But that's probably another discussion for another day and thread.





.

odd statement ..elsewhere you insisted lutheran 'are' evangelical .
but no , evangelicals dont preach full gospel .
the term full gospel is a term which emcompasses the main fundations of salavation .
repentance ,baptism(dipping burial ) in water ,baptism in the holy Ghost etc . any gospel that excludes any of this is not considered to be a full gospel but a partial one .

 

[Alithis]

https://www.stevehill.org/about/about-you/need-forgiveness.html

oh my , messy how did you find such an awful website lol .. they even charge $$$ for their evangelism courses ?!?!?!?

the pioneer school is full 20 lessons absolutely FREE

it can be viewed here

 

[Alithis]

sinners prayer is garbage. like all these people think the prayer saves them. lol you got another thing coming

hi [MENTION=258]Nes[/MENTION] , thank you for your imput .
i would not go so far as to say it is garbage .. there are principles in it that are scripturally based .and we can't dispel those principles .

since ,i assume from your post , you agree that we are not ever taught in scripture to preach "the sinners prayer " what is it in your opinion we ARE told to preach ?

 

[Lamb]

confused .. whats that got to do with "the sinners prayer " ?

we are saved through those things .. and how / not by the recital of a prayer ... a person can recite a prayer until their face turns blue .but if they dont turn away from their sin and stop doing it they become guilty of it over and over again .

I'm not sure why you were confused over my post? I explained why a prayer does not save and how it's God who saves and He does so by grace through faith. Turning away from sin is not the prerequisite to God dying on the cross for our salvation. He did it. We receive the benefits. HE is the one who turns us to Him in repentance, showing us first our sins and then giving us faith to know we have His forgiveness. If He were to wait for us all to completely stop sinning all together, well, that would not happen and that's the reason HE came to die in our place...because we cannot completely stop from sinning. You can stop from some sins sure, we know that, but you are still a sinner who sins. If you deny it then you deceive yourself and the truth is not in you.

 

[Josiah]

WHO is the Savior?



IF you answer "Jesus" then Jesus is the Savior. Not you - not a bit, not at all, not now, not ever, not in any way or shape or form or manner. Salvation is entirely, wholly wrapped up in Jesus. It's entirely HIS work. HIS heart. HIS love. HIS mercy. HIS gift. HIS blessing. His life, His death, His resurrection. His Cross, His blood, His sacrifice. His righteousness, His obedience, His holiness. Not you. Not yours. You may have some other role in some other matter, but not this. The "job" of Savior belongs to Jesus. Not you. Not your feelings, not your prayer, not your decisions, not your anything because Jesus is the Savior and thus the job is taken.


IF you answer "ME!" then you are the Savior. Not Jesus. Not a bit, not at all. Not now, not ever. Not in any way, shape or form or manner. Salvation is all wrapped up in YOU. YOUR works. YOUR will. YOUR love. YOUR efforts. YOUR merits. YOUR words/chants/prayer. YOUR actions. YOUR obedience. YOUR righteousness. YOUR holiness. YOUR sacrifice. Not Jesus. Not Jesus'. Jesus may have some other role in some other matter, just not this one. The Savior is you. Jesus MAY be the possibility-maker or the helper or the model or the inspiration but not the Savior because you are.


Which is it? Try answering that. If you do, a LOT of Christianity falls into place. Every justification heresy stems from giving the wrong answer, thus entirely destroying Christianity which has as its keystone that Jesus is the Savior.




Pax Christi



- Josiah

 

[MoreCoffee]

exactly - .. so , where in scripture are we ever instructed or taught to do that and where in scripture is there ANY example of people preaching that to the unsaved ?...

In the Lord's prayer. It says:

Matthew 6:9-13 [9] Therefore, you shall pray in this way: Our Father, who is in heaven: May your name be kept holy. [10] May your kingdom come. May your will be done, as in heaven, so also on earth. [11] Give us this day our life-sustaining bread. [12] And forgive us our debts, as we also forgive our debtors. [13] And lead us not into temptation. But free us from evil. Amen.​

Many prayers in the psalms also are petitions to God for forgiveness. For example

Psalm 51:1-19 [For the choirmaster Of David When the prophet Nathan had come to him because he had gone to Bathsheba]
[1] Have mercy on me, O God, in your faithful love, in your great tenderness wipe away my offences;
[2] wash me clean from my guilt, purify me from my sin.
[3] For I am well aware of my offences, my sin is constantly in mind.
[4] Against you, you alone, I have sinned, I have done what you see to be wrong, that you may show your saving justice when you pass sentence, and your victory may appear when you give judgement,
[5] remember, I was born guilty, a sinner from the moment of conception.
[6] But you delight in sincerity of heart, and in secret you teach me wisdom.
[7] Purify me with hyssop till I am clean, wash me till I am whiter than snow.
[8] Let me hear the sound of joy and gladness, and the bones you have crushed will dance.
[9] Turn away your face from my sins, and wipe away all my guilt.
[10] God, create in me a clean heart, renew within me a resolute spirit,
[11] do not thrust me away from your presence, do not take away from me your spirit of holiness.
[12] Give me back the joy of your salvation, sustain in me a generous spirit.
[13] I shall teach the wicked your paths, and sinners will return to you.
[14] Deliver me from bloodshed, God, God of my salvation, and my tongue will acclaim your saving justice.
[15] Lord, open my lips, and my mouth will speak out your praise.
[16] Sacrifice gives you no pleasure, burnt offering you do not desire.
[17] Sacrifice to God is a broken spirit, a broken, contrite heart you never scorn.
[18] In your graciousness do good to Zion, rebuild the walls of Jerusalem.
[19] Then you will delight in upright sacrifices,-burnt offerings and whole oblations -- and young bulls will be offered on your altar.​

Too many professed Christians are unwilling to learn from the holy scriptures how to pray. Too many are too proud of themselves and their doctrine to ask for mercy from God because they are sinners in need of forgiveness.

 

[Lamb]

The Lord's Prayer is for believers.

The Sinner's Prayer is something invented for unbelievers to become believers supposedly without God doing anything to save them because they first need to pray some prayer.

 

[psalms 91]

The Lord's Prayer is for believers.

The Sinner's Prayer is something invented for unbelievers to become believers supposedly without God doing anything to save them because they first need to pray some prayer.

Romans 10: 9-10

 

[Lamb]

Romans 10: 9-10

Did you read where it says in there about professing your faith?

You do realize that it's not saying that we are saved on account of our profession of faith right? You do realize it's still about the Savior who saves us. Right?

Those who claim the sinner's prayer for their salvation are forgetting that it's not the prayer. It's the Savior who saves. Are you saved because you have a Savior and only by grace through faith can make such a proclamation? Or did you save yourself because you said some silly prayer and are in control of your own destiny? Isn't that what sinful man wants? To have full control of his own destiny? Isn't that why Adam and Eve fell?

 

[Josiah]

Romans 10: 9-10

Bill, See post # 25.


Then let's see if we can return to the subject of the thread?

 

[psalms 91]

Did you read where it says in there about professing your faith?

You do realize that it's not saying that we are saved on account of our profession of faith right? You do realize it's still about the Savior who saves us. Right?

Those who claim the sinner's prayer for their salvation are forgetting that it's not the prayer. It's the Savior who saves. Are you saved because you have a Savior and only by grace through faith can make such a proclamation? Or did you save yourself because you said some silly prayer and are in control of your own destiny? Isn't that what sinful man wants? To have full control of his own destiny? Isn't that why Adam and Eve fell?

Of course it is the saviour that saves us and Romans 10: 9-10 tells us how now doesnt it or are we narrowing tjhis to the point it loses all meaning?

 

[psalms 91]

Bill, See post # 25.


Then let's see if we can return to the subject of the thread?

Funny I thought that was the subject, the sinners prayer right? Or are we going to claim it is off topic that seems to come up a lot especially on opposing viewpoints

 

[Lamb]

Of course it is the saviour that saves us and Romans 10: 9-10 tells us how now doesnt it or are we narrowing tjhis to the point it loses all meaning?

Romans 10 does not state that prayer is what saves us. We both agree the Savior saves. It's because of His death and blood, not by something or anything we can do or ever do. God gives us faith to trust in that. That's Christianity. Any prayer to God is to acknowledge and profess the Savior. The Sinner's Prayer did not save anyone, the Savior does.

 

[psalms 91]

Romans 10 does not state that prayer is what saves us. We both agree the Savior saves. It's because of His death and blood, not by something or anything we can do or ever do. God gives us faith to trust in that. That's Christianity. Any prayer to God is to acknowledge and profess the Savior. The Sinner's Prayer did not save anyone, the Savior does.

I agree again but I raise the issue of what do you use to lead someone to Christ, I am talking unchurched, not familiar with the bible, seems to me that the sinners prayer is useful at least I have found it so

 

[Lamb]

I agree again but I raise the issue of what do you use to lead someone to Christ, I am talking unchurched, not familiar with the bible, seems to me that the sinners prayer is useful at least I have found it so

I build relationships with them. I don't convince them a prayer will get them to heaven since that's not truth. I have many non believing friends. That Sinner's prayer is a mockery. It doesn't lead them to Christ but away.

 

[Alithis]

I'm not sure why you were confused over my post? I explained why a prayer does not save and how it's God who saves and He does so by grace through faith. Turning away from sin is not the prerequisite to God dying on the cross for our salvation. He did it. We receive the benefits. HE is the one who turns us to Him in repentance, showing us first our sins and then giving us faith to know we have His forgiveness. If He were to wait for us all to completely stop sinning all together, well, that would not happen and that's the reason HE came to die in our place...because we cannot completely stop from sinning. You can stop from some sins sure, we know that, but you are still a sinner who sins. If you deny it then you deceive yourself and the truth is not in you.

Thats all quite a bit off topic.your refering mostly to topics on other threads. Not addressing " the sinners prayer." and where in scripture we are told to preach it.
I know the biblical concept ofceasing from doing sin when you know it is sin is one you seem to loathe. . but it remains there in scripture and in more then one place..if you wish to discuss it further please do start a thread on it. Thanks.

 

[Alithis]

The Lord's Prayer is for believers.

The Sinner's Prayer is something invented for unbelievers to become believers supposedly without God doing anything to save them because they first need to pray some prayer.

Ok ,now.... Youve raised this issue often.
Let me ask clarification.
Your saying ..dont pray to be saved
Dont repent to be saved
Dont get baptised to be saved
Dont obey god in any form what so ever.
Why dont you add in dont believe while your at it.
You do not see how much your opposing the gospel as preached in the book of acts. The apoatles give clear cut instructions of what all men everywhere must do to be saved.
There is serious warning of what will happen to those who do not obey the Gospel.how much worse then for those who teach others to disobey it.

Faith- is not knowing about it
Faith ,is doing it!

 

[Lamb]

Ok ,now.... Youve raised this issue often.
Let me ask clarification.
Your saying ..dont pray to be saved
Dont repent to be saved
Dont get baptised to be saved
Dont obey god in any form what so ever.
Why dont you add in dont believe while your at it.
You do not see how much your opposing the gospel as preached in the book of acts. The apoatles give clear cut instructions of what all men everywhere must do to be saved.
There is serious warning of what will happen to those who do not obey the Gospel.how much worse then for those who teach others to disobey it.

Faith- is not knowing about it
Faith ,is doing it!

You need to stop twisting what people say on this site.

 

[psalms 91]

I build relationships with them. I don't convince them a prayer will get them to heaven since that's not truth. I have many non believing friends. That Sinner's prayer is a mockery. It doesn't lead them to Christ but away.

Relationships are important and when possible yes, I do as well, I strongly disagree that it leads them away from Christ, only those mentoring a new believer can do that