The twelve gates of Revelation's New Jerusalem

[Cassia]

Just to throw in one more point... the four animal banners on each side of the temple were... an ox a lion, a bird, and a man... doesn't that work with the visions of Ezekiel?

Ezekiel 1:10 The form of each of their faces was that of a man, and each of the four had the face of a lion on the right, the face of an ox on the left, and the face of an eagle.

Or with the 4 living things in the view of heaven in Revelations 4

 

[visionary]

https://milkywayastrology.wordpress...-tribes-of-israel-also-the-babylonian-zodiac/

This website does a nice job of putting the tribes with the mazzaroth signs.

 

[Cassia]

Evidence of a correspondence between the Prediluvian Patriarchs and the signs of the Zodiac is found in the Jewish synagogue inscription from Engedi (below).

The synagogue itself was destroyed around AD 530 so this inscription dates some time from the early Byzantine period. It lists the Prediluvian Patriarchs first from Adam to Japheth in two rows, then immediately following the names of the signs of the Zodiac in two rows, then the names of the Hebrew months. Thus:


1. Adam, Seth, Enosh, Kenan, Mahalalel, Jared,|

2. Enoch, Methuselah, Lamech, Noah, Shem, Ham and Japheth,|

3. Aries, Taurus, Gemini, Cancer, Leo, Virgo,|

4. Libra, Scorpio, Sagittarius, Capricorn, and Aquarius, Pisces.|

5. Nisan, Iyar, Sivan, Tammuz, Av, Elul,|

6. Tishrei, Marheshvan, Kislev, Tevet, Shevat|

7. And Adar.


The three final Zodiac names are written in a curious way thus: gdy wdly dgym i.e. literally “Capricorn AND Aquarius Pisces”. Considering that these correspond positionally to Noah AND Shem, Ham-and-Japheth (the last two corresponding to the two linked fishes of Pisces), the odd phraseology is understandable.

yah you lost me lol

 

[visionary]

Here someone made connections between the signs and the apostles...

https://stjudasmaccabaeus.wordpress...tles-of-christianity-and-12-tribes-of-israel/

 

[MoreCoffee]

Linking the 12 forefathers of the tribes of Israel to the signs of the zodiac (the zodiac is a Babylonian invention I think) makes it seem as if you're attempting to make ancient Israel's religion into a derivation from pagan Babylonian religions.

History

Early history

The division of the ecliptic into the zodiacal signs originates in Babylonian ("Chaldean") astronomy during the first half of the 1st millennium BC, likely during Median/"Neo-Babylonian" times (7th century BC).[6] The classical zodiac is a modification of the MUL.APIN catalogue, which was compiled around 1000 BC. Some of the constellations can be traced even further back, to Bronze Age (Old Babylonian) sources, including Gemini "The Twins", from MAŠ.TAB.BA.GAL.GAL "The Great Twins", and Cancer "The Crab", from AL.LUL "The Crayfish", among others.

Babylonian astronomers at some stage during the early 1st millennium BC divided the ecliptic into twelve equal zones of celestial longitude to create the first known celestial coordinate system: a coordinate system that boasts some advantages over modern systems (such as the equatorial coordinate system). The Babylonian calendar as it stood in the 7th century BC assigned each month to a sign, beginning with the position of the Sun at vernal equinox, which, at the time, was depicted as the Aries constellation ("Age of Aries"), for which reason the first sign is still called "Aries" even after the vernal equinox has moved away from the Aries constellation due to the slow precession of the Earth's axis of rotation.[7]

Because the division was made into equal arcs, 30° each, they constituted an ideal system of reference for making predictions about a planet's longitude. However, Babylonian techniques of observational measurements were in a rudimentary stage of evolution and it is unclear whether they had techniques to define in a precise way the boundary lines between the zodiacal signs in the sky.[8] Thus, the need to use stars close to the ecliptic (±9° of latitude) as a set of observational reference points to help positioning a planet within this ecliptic coordinate system.[9] Constellations were given the names of the signs and asterisms could be connected in a way that would resemble the sign's name. Therefore, in spite of its conceptual origin, the Babylonian zodiac became sidereal.[10]

In Babylonian astronomical diaries, a planet position was generally given with respect to a zodiacal sign alone, less often in specific degrees within a sign.[11] When the degrees of longitude were given, they were expressed with reference to the 30° of the zodiacal sign, i.e., not with a reference to the continuous 360° ecliptic.[12] To the construction of their mathematical ephemerides, daily positions of a planet were not as important as the dates when the planet crossed from one zodiacal sign to the next.[13]

Hebrew astrology
Knowledge of the Babylonian zodiac is also reflected in the Tanakh, but is the first recorded astrological division into 12 constellations, elaborated on in the Talmuds, books of the Midrash Rabba, and other minor works. E. W. Bullinger interpreted the creatures appearing in the book of Ezekiel as the middle signs of the four quarters of the Zodiac,[14][15] with the Lion as Leo, the Bull is Taurus, the Man representing Aquarius and the Eagle representing Scorpio.[16] Some authors have linked the twelve tribes of Israel with the twelve signs. Martin and others have argued that the arrangement of the tribes around the Tabernacle (reported in the Book of Numbers) corresponded to the order of the Zodiac, with Judah, Reuben, Ephraim, and Dan representing the middle signs of Leo, Aquarius, Taurus, and Scorpio, respectively.Such connections were taken up by Thomas Mann, who in his novel Joseph and His Brothers attributes characteristics of a sign of the zodiac to each tribe in his rendition of the Blessing of Jacob.

 

[Cassia]

Linking the 12 forefathers of the tribes of Israel to the signs of the zodiac (the zodiac is a Babylonian invention I think) makes it seem as if you're attempting to make ancient Israel's religion into a derivation from pagan Babylonian religions.

I agree that astrology is not for Christians (that's why I was wondering about the mozaics) but astronomy is different because it is bible based
I'm sure you've seen Rick Lawson "The Star of Bethlehem" and the book "The Witness of the Stars" delves into scripture further
https://archive.org/details/witnessofthestar00bulluoft

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kO7Dz0uOMjM

 

[MoreCoffee]

I agree that astrology is not for Christians (that's why I was wondering about the mozaics) but astronomy is different because it is bible based
I'm sure you've seen Rick Lawson "The Star of Bethlehem" and the book "The Witness of the Stars" delves into scripture further

I've read neither.

 

[Cassia]

I've read neither.

I've read one

 

[visionary]

Linking the 12 forefathers of the tribes of Israel to the signs of the zodiac (the zodiac is a Babylonian invention I think) makes it seem as if you're attempting to make ancient Israel's religion into a derivation from pagan Babylonian religions.

Job was before Babylon days. That is why I was very careful to state it was "mazzaroth" signs.

 

[MoreCoffee]

Job was before Babylon days. That is why I was very careful to state it was "mazzaroth" signs.

Some say Job lived in the 19th century BC, old Babylon existed from around 32nd century BC until some time around the 20th century BC so it existed before Job's time.

Here's an image of Babylon's territory at around the time of Hammurabi,

 

[psalms 91]

Yes astronomy is bible based

 

[MoreCoffee]

Here's a map of old Babylon (Sumer) showing the centuries in which is existed.

 

[pinacled]

Interesting on the shifting of positions for each of the tribal members... as to where this thread is going.... I have no idea... it is exploratory on any clues that might help us figure it out...

I am curious as to where you got this order of the Tribes?

If I lay my head upon a stone in a certain place.

One thing stood out to me though. And this may ring a bell with you Visionary. As pertaining to the 144000 and the Levites.


1And these are the names of the tribes; from the northern end, beside the way to Hethlon, to the road [leading] to Hamath, [to] Hazar Enan at the border of Damascus, to the north alongside Hamath; and he shall have from the eastern side to the sea, for Dan; one portion. אוְאֵלֶּה שְׁמוֹת הַשְּׁבָטִים מִקְצֵה צָפוֹנָה אֶל יַד דֶּרֶךְ חֶתְלֹן | לְבוֹא חֲמָת חֲצַר עֵינָן גְּבוּל דַּמֶּשֶׂק צָפוֹנָה אֶל יַד חֲמָת וְהָיוּ לוֹ פְאַת קָדִים הַיָּם דָּן אֶחָד:
2And alongside the border of Dan, from the eastern side to the western side, for Asher; one portion. בוְעַל | גְּבוּל דָּן מִפְּאַת קָדִים עַד פְּאַת יָמָּה אָשֵׁר אֶחָד:
3And alongside the border of Asher, from the eastern side to the western side, for Naftali; one portion. גוְעַל | גְּבוּל אָשֵׁר מִפְּאַת קָדִימָה וְעַד פְּאַת יָמָּה נַפְתָּלִי אֶחָד:
4And alongside the border of Naftali, from the eastern side to the western side, for Manasseh; one portion. דוְעַל | גְּבוּל נַפְתָּלִי מִפְּאַת קָדִמָה עַד פְּאַת יָמָּה מְנַשֶּׁה אֶחָד:
5And alongside the border of Manasseh, from the eastern side to the western side, for Ephraim; one portion. הוְעַל | גְּבוּל מְנַשֶּׁה מִפְּאַת קָדִמָה עַד פְּאַת יָמָּה אֶפְרַיִם אֶחָד:
6And alongside the border of Ephraim, from the eastern side to the western side, for Reuben; one portion. ווְעַל | גְּבוּל אֶפְרַיִם מִפְּאַת קָדִים וְעַד פְּאַת יָמָּה רְאוּבֵן אֶחָד:
7And alongside the border of Reuben, from the eastern side to the western side, for Judah; one portion. זוְעַל | גְּבוּל רְאוּבֵן מִפְּאַת קָדִים עַד פְּאַת יָמָּה יְהוּדָה אֶחָד:
8And alongside the border of Judah, from the eastern side to the western side, shall be the offering that you shall separate: 25,000 the width, and the length like one of the portions from the eastern side to the western side; and the Sanctuary shall be in its midst. חוְעַל גְּבוּל יְהוּדָה מִפְּאַת קָדִים עַד פְּאַת יָמָּה תִּהְיֶה הַתְּרוּמָה אֲשֶׁר תָּרִימוּ חֲמִשָּׁה וְעֶשְׂרִים אֶלֶף רֹחַב וְאֹרֶךְ כְּאַחַד הַחֲלָקִים מִפְּאַת קָדִימָה עַד פְּאַת יָמָּה וְהָיָה הַמִּקְדָּשׁ בְּתוֹכוֹ:
9The offering that you shall separate for the Lord, its length [shall be] 25,000 and its width 10, 000. טהַתְּרוּמָה אֲשֶׁר תָּרִימוּ לַיהֹוָה אֹרֶךְ חֲמִשָּׁה וְעֶשְׂרִים אֶלֶף וְרֹחַב עֲשֶׂרֶת אֲלָפִים:
10And these shall be the offering of the Sanctuary for the priests: to the north 25,000, and to the west the width is 10,000, and to the east the width is 10,000, and to the south the length is 25,000, and the Sanctuary of the Lord shall be in its midst. יוּלְאֵלֶּה תִּהְיֶה תְרוּמַת הַקֹּדֶשׁ לַכֹּהֲנִים צָפוֹנָה חֲמִשָּׁה וְעֶשְׂרִים אֶלֶף וְיָמָּה רֹחַב עֲשֶׂרֶת אֲלָפִים וְקָדִימָה רֹחַב עֲשֶׂרֶת אֲלָפִים וְנֶגְבָּה אֹרֶךְ חֲמִשָּׁה וְעֶשְׂרִים אָלֶף וְהָיָה מִקְדַּשׁ יְהֹוָה בְּתוֹכוֹ:


11The hallowed part will be for the priests of the sons of Zadok, who kept My watch, who did not stray when the Children of Israel strayed, as the Levites strayed. יאלַכֹּהֲנִים הַמְקֻדָּשׁ מִבְּנֵי צָדוֹק אֲשֶׁר שָׁמְרוּ מִשְׁמַרְתִּי אֲשֶׁר לֹא תָעוּ בִּתְעוֹת בְּנֵי יִשְׂרָאֵל כַּאֲשֶׁר תָּעוּ הַלְוִיִּם:







Now how is that the Levites strayed in Babylon or Edom. Astronomy has some to do with it.

Edom is kinda like the queen of the south. Drawing men away to the pleasures of the World.
1 Corinthians 7King James Version (KJV)

7 Now concerning the things whereof ye wrote unto me: It is good for a man not to touch a woman.


Just as it is written about the 144000
These are those who did not defile themselves with women, for they remained virgins. They follow the Lamb wherever he goes. They were purchased from among mankind and offered as firstfruits to God and the Lamb.


I wonder which geographic direction the Messiah walks. Just a note to where he actually walked.

 

[pinacled]

Where is Manasseh Ephraim and Zadok.



A quik wiki helped.

Zadok (Hebrew: Tsadoq צדוק, meaning "Righteous") or Zadoq was a priest, said to be descended from Eleazar the son of Aaron (1 Chron 6:4-8).[1] He aided King David during the revolt of his son Absalom and was subsequently instrumental in bringing King Solomon to the throne. After Solomon's building of The First Temple in Jerusalem, Zadok was the first High Priest to serve there.

The prophet Ezekiel extols the sons of Zadok as staunch opponents of paganism during the era of its pagan worship and indicates their birthright to unique duties and privileges in the future temple (Ezekiel 42:13, 43:19).

 

[Cassia]

Here's an illustration of where the gates are according to Ezekial

Ezekial 48:31 The north side's gates are Reuben, Judah and Levi
Ezelial 48:32 The gates on the east side are Joseph, Benjamin and Dan
Ezekial 48:33 The south side's gates are Simeon, Issachar and Zebulun
Ezekial 48:34 The gates on the west side are Gad, Asher and Naphtali

I'm not sure where your going with this thread visionary but this may help?

The map from Ezekial has Levi included while the other maps don't

 

[pinacled]

The map from Ezekial has Levi included while the other maps don't

Quite amazing isnt it. Even the account of Genesis can possibly be seen. Where Joseph called for his little brother.
A whole tribe becoming a part of the encampment maybe as a lesson from Judges." the Levi priest and his concubine.
Judges 19New International Version (NIV)

A Levite and His Concubine
19 In those days Israel had no king.
Now a Levite who lived in a remote area in the hill country of Ephraim took a concubine from Bethlehem in Judah.

And also maybe a telling of a future Solomon incident. Queen of the south. All shadows of the Light that is already ahead.

The scepter will not depart from Judah, nor the ruler's staff from between his feet, until he to whom it belongs shall come and the obedience of the nations shall be his.

 

[pinacled]

The map from Ezekial has Levi included while the other maps don't

http://biblehub.com/hebrew/3058.htm

Yehu.
What a Beautiful Vision.
Sorry about the double post Having trouble with this silly machine.

Once heard if you have a head covering and proceed to face NE. Each corner of the covering will be in the cardinal Directions.

Notice then how all the Brides of Israel are inline. According to the position of the Sons.

 

[Cassia]

Quite amazing isnt it. Even the account of Genesis can possibly be seen. Where Joseph called for his little brother.
A whole tribe becoming a part of the encampment maybe as a lesson from Judges." the Levi priest and his concubine.
Judges 19New International Version (NIV)

A Levite and His Concubine
19 In those days Israel had no king.
Now a Levite who lived in a remote area in the hill country of Ephraim took a concubine from Bethlehem in Judah.

And also maybe a telling of a future Solomon incident. Queen of the south. All shadows of the Light that is already ahead.

The scepter will not depart from Judah, nor the ruler's staff from between his feet, until he to whom it belongs shall come and the obedience of the nations shall be his.

Revelations has Dan and Ephram removed presumably because of adulotry Joseph and Manessa are both there

Revelation 7:4-8
4 Then I heard the number of those who were sealed: 144,000 from all the tribes of Israel.
5 From the tribe of Judah 12,000 were sealed,
from the tribe of Reuben 12,000,
from the tribe of Gad 12,000,
6 from the tribe of Asher 12,000,
from the tribe of Naphtali 12,000,
from the tribe of Manasseh 12,000,
7 from the tribe of Simeon 12,000,
from the tribe of Levi 12,000,
from the tribe of Issachar 12,000,
8 from the tribe of Zebulun 12,000,
from the tribe of Joseph 12,000,
from the tribe of Benjamin 12,000.

I'm not sure what you mean by the queen of the south?

oops don't know how I messed up that quote ... newbie :blush:

 

[pinacled]

Revelations has Dan and Ephram removed presumably because of adulotry Joseph and Manessa are both there

Revelation 7:4-8
4 Then I heard the number of those who were sealed: 144,000 from all the tribes of Israel.
5 From the tribe of Judah 12,000 were sealed,
from the tribe of Reuben 12,000,
from the tribe of Gad 12,000,
6 from the tribe of Asher 12,000,
from the tribe of Naphtali 12,000,
from the tribe of Manasseh 12,000,
7 from the tribe of Simeon 12,000,
from the tribe of Levi 12,000,
from the tribe of Issachar 12,000,
8 from the tribe of Zebulun 12,000,
from the tribe of Joseph 12,000,
from the tribe of Benjamin 12,000.

I'm not sure what you mean by the queen of the south?

oops don't know how I messed up that quote ... newbie :blush:

Queen of the South. Sheba.

 

[psalms 91]

Queen of the South. Sheba.

Yup