Name those sins Christ didn't die for

[Lamb]

The passages say that Job was perfect (blameless in some translations) it is written there just as much as any other statement in holy scripture is. Job 1:1,8.

He wasn't sinless though so please don't try to add where scripture doesn't state.

 

[popsthebuilder]

Do they have faith or not and really do you kniw a guy's heart because I doubt you do.

Wow, I was just asking a question based on scripture, and most assuredly wasn't assuming , accusing, or judging anyone whatsoever. You snapping on me like that kinda makes it seem like you have a guilty conscience.

But as far as scripture is concerned in reference to the wide path and the many who go along it; evidently their faith was either lacking or in the wrong thing otherwise scripture/ the Word of GOD wouldn't advise us to seek out the narrow path. Definitely a similar case when it speaks of those who proclaim to Christ all they have done in His name upon judgement yet He won't even hear their pleas.


You tell me, according to your scripture; were/are these individuals faith what Christ deemed fit? Is that what he taught? His example was such?

Peace

Faith in selfless Unity for Good.

 

[Stravinsk]

It appears we have some who believe that Christ didn't die for all their sins and we know that the sin of unbelief damns the human for all eternity but I want to know which of your sins didn't Christ die for since y'all claim that there are some that aren't forgiven. Name them off if you can and then justify why Christ didn't nail those to the cross like he did your other sins and when do you think he'll return to the cross to forgive them for you?

Matthew 18:21-35

The unmerciful servant was initially forgiven all his debt. But he did not practice forgiveness for one that owed him, he was ruthless, so in the end the Master had the wicked servant thrown into prison and tortured until he "should pay back all he owed".

So it seems the servant had to pay for his own sins. All of them.

 

[MoreCoffee]

He wasn't sinless though so please don't try to add where scripture doesn't state.

What sins do you say Job committed?

 

[Lamb]

Scripture doesn't say. It also doesn't say "sinless". As you can see either in this thread or the other, turtlhare pointed out that Noah was also called blameless and scripture pointed out his sin of drunkenness. Don't try to put into scripture what isn't there. We are all in need of a Savior.

 

[psalms 91]

absolutely

 

[MoreCoffee]

What sins do you say Job committed?

Scripture doesn't say. It also doesn't say "sinless". As you can see either in this thread or the other, turtlhare pointed out that Noah was also called blameless and scripture pointed out his sin of drunkenness. Don't try to put into scripture what isn't there. We are all in need of a Savior.

Holy scripture says that Job was perfect and upright. That's quite a recommendation when you consider that Jehovah said it about Job.

 

[psalms 91]

Holy scripture says that Job was perfect and upright. That's quite a recommendation when you consider that Jehovah said it about Job.

True but still a man and did sin. One that comes to mind is worry, he sacrificed for his children in case they sinned, he was worried about them and worry is sin

 

[MoreCoffee]

True but still a man and did sin. One that comes to mind is worry, he sacrificed for his children in case they sinned, he was worried about them and worry is sin

Where do the holy scriptures say that Job sinned? I think you're inventing accusations against a holy man of God. Job is said to be perfect and upright by Jehovah who can contradict God and be truthful?

 

[psalms 91]

perfect in what way? upright is not the samwe as not sinning and I dont invent anything, scripture talks of Job sacrificing for his children and why.

 

[MoreCoffee]

In whatever way Jehovah meant it when he said "Have you considered my servant Job? There is no one like him on the earth, a perfect and an upright man, one who fears God and turns away from evil"

 

[psalms 91]

David was also such a man and still committed grave sin, a man in every way that experienced Gods forgiveness and also the consequesnces of his sin

 

[MoreCoffee]

No sin is ever attributed in the holy scriptures to saint Job.

 

[Josiah]

In whatever way Jehovah meant it when he said "Have you considered my servant Job? There is no one like him on the earth, a perfect and an upright man, one who fears God and turns away from evil"

1. "ON EARTH." The comparison is to other people - none of whom is without sin. Compare that to say Matthew 5:48 which does NOT compare us to the mean of those now living on the Earth, but rather to an entirely different standard. "You must be perfect JUST AS GOD IN HEAVEN is PERFECT" - not "better than the average sinful bloat now living on the Earth" or even "Better than any of the sinful bloats now living on the Earth."

2. As I understand it, the Hebrew word here does not mean void of any consequence of the Fall, void of any sinful nature, morally PERFECT since conception. This is what in theology is called "outward righteousness" - as compared to MAN, as seen/observed/witnessed by MAN. I've known people who - as far as I've witnessed - have never actually commited a sinful DEED. However, that does not lead me to conclude the Bible is false, wrong, errant, lying when it states (so often) that NO ONE is righteous - no not even one" (it does give ONE exception - the only exception who is not ONLY a man, the exception of the God/Man Jesus). The Bible does not lie when it says "NO ONE does what it right." "For ALL have sinned and fall short."

3. But what is stunning to me in all your posts is the passionate, persistent attempt to make yourself as big as possible and Christ as small as possible. You do this in a rich diversity of ways on anything having to do with Christianity. In this way, you are very Catholic - and you confirm what some non-Catholics believe about Catholicism.




Pax


- Josiah

 

[MoreCoffee]

Enoch pleased Jehovah. Job was perfect and upright. These are the statements of holy scripture.

 

[Josiah]

There is no one like him on the earth

1. "ON EARTH." The comparison is to other people - none of whom is without sin. Compare that to say Matthew 5:48 which does NOT compare us to the mean of those now living on the Earth, but rather to an entirely different standard. "You must be perfect JUST AS GOD IN HEAVEN is PERFECT" - not "better than the average sinful bloat now living on the Earth" or even "Better than any of the sinful bloats now living on the Earth."


2. As I understand it, the Hebrew word here does not mean void of any consequence of the Fall, void of any sinful nature, morally PERFECT since conception. This is what in theology is called "outward righteousness" - as compared to MAN, as seen/observed/witnessed by MAN. I've known people who - as far as I've witnessed - have never actually commited a sinful DEED. However, that does not lead me to conclude the Bible is false, wrong, errant, lying when it states (so often) that NO ONE is righteous - no not even one" (it does give ONE exception - the only exception who is not ONLY a man, the exception of the God/Man Jesus). The Bible does not lie when it says "NO ONE does what it right." "For ALL have sinned and fall short."


3. But what is stunning to me in all your posts is the passionate, persistent attempt to make yourself as big as possible and Christ as small as possible. You do this in a rich diversity of ways on anything having to do with Christianity. In this way, you are very Catholic - and you confirm what some non-Catholics believe about Catholicism.



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Enoch pleased Jehovah.

Nice. I suppose everyone does now and then. But "please" is not PERFECT JUST AS GOD IS PERFECT. 'Pleased" is not HOLY JUST AS GOD IS HOLY.

Job was perfect and upright

Among those ON EARTH (all of whom are sinful bloats).... compared to other sinful bloats but not as compared to God.


Again.... ANYTHING to make self BIG and Christ small..... Anything to get the focus on the wonderfulness of you and the irrelevance of Christ, the Cross, the Blood, the Lamb, mercy, forgiveness..... From every angle possible, that is your Catholic passion, obsession, ambition.




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[MoreCoffee]

Your posts rely on such scant "evidence" and hang on such flimsy threads. You say "on earth" as if it were a talisman that somehow proves a case when in fact it is no more than a fact of geography, incarnate human beings are found no place but on earth (with only three known exceptions). Jehovah holds forth saint Job as an example of human perfection and righteousness. You complain that it is "on earth". So what? Where else would one find a perfect and righteous human being still in the body than "on earth"? Enoch pleased God and you minimise that statement by saying "Nice. I suppose everyone does now and then." what a tawdry diminution or the praises of Jehovah you give. One ought to be ashamed to write such words of one to whom Jehovah gives testimony by assuming him into heaven because he pleased Jehovah.

By faith Enoch was assumed so that he should not see death; and he was not found, because God had taken him. Now before he was taken he was attested as having pleased God. (Hebrews 11:5)​

 

[Josiah]

Your posts rely on such scant "evidence" and hang on such flimsy threads. You say "on earth" as if it were a talisman that somehow proves a case when in fact it is no more than a fact of geography, incarnate human beings are found no place but on earth (with only three known exceptions).

You delete the words "ON EARTH" in order to imply the correct words are "IN HEAVEN." The singular, individual text you ripped out and isolated says there is no better person ON EARTH..... And as you point out, this is the realm of "incarnate human beings" - you know, the ones with original sin according to the RC Denomination. The verse does not say, "As compared to GOD." But Matthew 5:48 says, "Be perfect JUST AS GOD IN HEAVEN IS PERFECT" The Bible says, "Be HOLY JUST AS GOD IS HOLY" .... You have this need to change the point of reference from God and Heaven to the sinful bloats here on Earth. But Matthew 5:48 does not say, "TRY kinda hard a lot of time to be better than most sinful bloats." Or even "See if you can be like one or two other sinners on Earth who are the bestest of the sinners on earth."

But again.... what is remarkable to me.... what is revealing.... is your persistent obession you have to make self as BIG as possible, while making Christ so small He's entirely out of the picture.... self BIG, Christ small.... on and on and on and on about your wonderfulness, Christ's irrelevance (a HELPER at most, cuz all you need is a little help from your friends). You are so very, very well documenting why no many non-Catholics believe what they do about Catholicism on this point. And yes, EXACTLY as I was taught in my Catholic years.

Jehovah holds forth saint Job as an example of human perfection and righteousness.

Even if so, the Law is not that we be better than most sinners, better than the mean sinful bloat. The command is that we be perfect AS GOD IS, holy AS GOD is. Are you? Always? If not, I would suggest you abandon the Catholic soteriology, stop obessing about the wonderfulness of the one you see in the mirror, and look to the Cross.... Alone..... The Christ, the Blood, the Lamb..... HIS mercy.... His obedience, His righteousness, His love, His devotion, His works..... Cuz friend, you need more than a little help from a friend (the soteriology of Islam and some forms of Hindusim), you need MERCY (Sola Gratia)..... a SAVIOR - THE one and only and exclusive Savior (Solus Christus).... you need justification. Only then.... only after that..... do the little SIN-TAINTED goodies you do have any relevance, but then in sanctification as discipleship. Get your eyes off you, place them on the Savior. Lord, be MERICIFUL to me - the sinner. Lord, have mercy. Christ, have mercy. Lord, have mercy.

Enoch pleased God and you minimise that statement by saying "Nice. I suppose everyone does now and then."

Yes, when you pray, God is pleased. But it doesn't mean ERGO you are perfect just as God is perfect, holy just as God is holy. When one is full of self, there's no room for God. When you are obsessed looking the mirror, the Cross becomes in vain. "If we are saved by the law, then Christ died in vain."





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[MoreCoffee]

[MENTION=13]Josiah[/MENTION], it's absurd of you to write that I deleted some words. No words were deleted from the quote of Job 1:1,8.

 

[Josiah]

[MENTION=13]Josiah[/MENTION], its's absurd of you to write that I deleted some words. No words were deleted from the quote of Job 1:1,8.

You forgot the words "ON EARTH" and you delete the meaning there.... among those homo sapiens currently living on the Earth. Okay..... you might interpret that verse to mean that among the oh 100,000 or so people living on the planet at that moment, Job was the very bestest. Perhaps (although, I'm not sure I agree with that interp) but the Law is not to be better than the average sinner. It's not to be better at this moment than any of the other sinners. It's to be PERFECT AS GOD IS PERFECT (God.... in heaven)..... be HOLY just as God in Heaven is holy (God.... in heaven). Are you? From your conception and this will continue to the microsecond of your death? No sinful nature? No sin of thought or word or deed? No sin of omission or comission? You have loved all the people of teh planet just as Christ loved us on the Cross? You made disciples of all people on the earth? IF you - honestly - can say "yes" to that - and mean it NOT compared to any humans but to God Himself in Heaven..... then good luck with the Catholic thing. But it requires quite an ego. And what you are doing - making self as BIG as possible, Christ as little as possible. THAT'S the part that is remarkable, revealing to me. THAT'S the part that is stunning. And of course, THAT'S the part that so disturbs non-Catholics and why they state what they do about RCC soteriology.




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