World Are fear and ignorance driving our politics?

[Lamb]

"controlling our borders" is code for rejecting the poor and hungry. "even Germany has closed its borders" they took 1,000,000 refugees in in one year. How many has your border state taken in in one year? "There has to be order and control" is code for we like our lives as they are and don't want to be hospitable to the poor and hungry.

Why is a temporary closure so evil when it can protect our loved ones?

 

[psalms 91]

"controlling our borders" is code for rejecting the poor and hungry. "even Germany has closed its borders" they took 1,000,000 refugees in in one year. How many has your border state taken in in one year? "There has to be order and control" is code for we like our lives as they are and don't want to be hospitable to the poor and hungry.

You have an answer for rverythibng, to bad you are not living it or even in the USA. Seems to me that the people who live with it should be the ones making the decisions and the rest of the world can take care and do as they wish

 

[MoreCoffee]

Why is a temporary closure so evil when it can protect our loved ones?

It cannot protect them. Most of the killings in the USA are from people already resident in the USA many of whom are citizens of the USA. Nor can it prevent residents from opening their internet to the ways and means of becoming radical and eventually terrorists.

 

[psalms 91]

You are right Lamm and wisdom says thatis what we should do

 

[tango]

Lets talk numbers since their goal is to destroy western civilization and institute Sharia law. Seems to me that when you face an enemy you dont allow him entrance and make no mistake muslims are the enemy of christians, if you dont believe that then you are not following the news. Christians all over are being killed and sold into slavery by these barbarians.

This is just more posting driven, ironically, by the "fear and ignorance" highlighted in the opening post.

It quite demonstrably isn't the goal of every single Muslin to destroy Western civilization and institute Sharia law. If it were then I'd have to wonder how I managed to live and work among so many Muslims without being decapitated.

You're still assuming that a few nutjobs represent a billion people. Do the antics of the Westboro Baptist Church reflect your worldview? Do the acts of violent rapists reflect your view of women? If not, you're applying double standards by insisting that a few terrorists who shout "Allahu Akbar" represent a billion Muslims.

 

[tango]

Tango, your words are self-twisting. You do not need my help. And to say that "one death is one too many" is a statement shaped like a pretzel. You are quite okay with the deaths of innocent American citizens -- whether it is one or thousands.

Really? I'm OK with American deaths? Where did you get that gem from? Or are you just twisting my words while claiming I'm twisting them yourself?

I say this because it is idiotic to open the door to a group of people when you KNOW that several among them are there to kill you.

Got it. We'd best ban men from entering as well because we know there are some men out there who are a real danger to women and children.

It is inebriated thinking like yours that has placed this nation in such grave danger. And, even as that danger increases exponentially, your support for bringing in even more is also increasing exponentially...

Care to provide some substance? I'm still waiting to hear some of this insight, but all I get is silly insults.

...and so is your silliness.

You really need to get your head on straight.

OK, that's enough. If you can't address the points you'd best bow out. I'm reporting this post. If you want to disagree with the points I make you have every right to do so but cut the personal attacks.

 

[tango]

call it what you will, doesnt change the fact that prudence and caution is necessary

There's a big difference between "prudence and caution" and "close the borders in a hysterical panic".

Nobody is saying we should just throw open the doors and let anyone in. But insisting that a billion people must be barred for the actions of a few is hysterical rather than rational. Vet people, check them out, and turn away the ones considered undesirable for reasons that are a little more than "brown skin and beard = bad".

 

[tango]

On that issue he makes sense. Illegal aliens should be stopped from entering and be deported if here. Muslims should be prevent ed from entering until the system is in order to properly vet them, that is prudent and wise. I still question why all these refugees do not go to other muslim nations.

Illegal aliens are, by definition, illegal. People who arrive illegally should be deported. But why single out Muslims from entering? It's back to the fear and ignorance. Would you apply the same to Hispanics in case they were drug lords? Ban everyone from Mexico southwards until some undefined system is in place to vet them? What about Orientals - they might be members of a group like the Triads or the Yakuza. Maybe we should keep out the Italians in case they are members of the Mafia. What about white people with really short hair, who look like they might be associated with some far-right extremist group looking to inflict casualties among the non-white population?

The reality is far more complex than "Muslim bad, non-Muslim good".

 

[psalms 91]

Illegal aliens are, by definition, illegal. People who arrive illegally should be deported. But why single out Muslims from entering? It's back to the fear and ignorance. Would you apply the same to Hispanics in case they were drug lords? Ban everyone from Mexico southwards until some undefined system is in place to vet them? What about Orientals - they might be members of a group like the Triads or the Yakuza. Maybe we should keep out the Italians in case they are members of the Mafia. What about white people with really short hair, who look like they might be associated with some far-right extremist group looking to inflict casualties among the non-white population?

The reality is far more complex than "Muslim bad, non-Muslim good".

Easy to say it when it is not you, once again it should be up to americans and noone else. I could also see a benevolent government helping the refugees toresettle in a muslim country, but that would not be PC would it?

 

[MoreCoffee]

Easy to say it when it is not you, once again it should be up to americans and noone else. I could also see a benevolent government helping the refugees toresettle in a muslim country, but that would not be PC would it?

Which Muslim country?

 

[psalms 91]

Take your pick seems like they should be wanting to help their fellow muslims, how about all of them

 

[MoreCoffee]

Take your pick seems like they should be wanting to help their fellow muslims, how about all of them

Why would they want to do that more than a Christian would want to?

 

[psalms 91]

Oh so it is just the United States that must be held accountable? What a crock. Muslims should wish to go to muslim countries simply because it is the lifestyle they are accustomed to not to mention saves going halfway round the world. In case you havent noticed the muslims are not keen on it any more than most other countries are yet it is the United States that gets bashed, wonder why that is?

 

[MoreCoffee]

Oh so it is just the United States that must be held accountable? What a crock. Muslims should wish to go to Muslim countries simply because it is the lifestyle they are accustomed to not to mention saves going halfway round the world. In case you haven't noticed the Muslims are not keen on it any more than most other countries are yet it is the United States that gets bashed, wonder why that is?

Christians are accountable. Muslims in Muslim lands are not accountable in the same way. To expect them to carry the burden on other human beings is to expect of them what it seems many Christians who fear Muslims are unwilling to do despite the calling of their Lord to go the extra mile and turn the other cheek and to forgive as we would want to be forgiven.

 

[psalms 91]

Christians are accountable. Muslims in Muslim lands are not accountable in the same way. To expect them to carry the burden on other human beings is to expect of them what it seems many Christians who fear Muslims are unwilling to do despite the calling of their Lord to go the extra mile and turn the other cheek and to forgive as we would want to be forgiven.

He also calls us to use wisdom and be wise

 

[MoreCoffee]

He also calls us to use wisdom and be wise

Yes but never to be cruel or evil. Never to treat the poor and the stranger like a leper.

 

[psalms 91]

pretty easy to say when you are not affected by it, if you really want them then change things in your country

 

[MoreCoffee]

pretty easy to say when you are not affected by it, if you really want them then change things in your country

When is it okay to treat others with cruelty?

 

[tango]

Easy to say it when it is not you, once again it should be up to americans and noone else.

Not sure what you're trying to say here. It was me living among Muslims before. Most of them are actually peaceful people who don't go round blowing things up and decapitating innocent passers-by.

My point is that it's silly to focus on Muslims as being some kind of unique threat when all sorts of other superficially similar groups of people include dangerous individuals - as I mentioned an Oriental might be a member of the Triads or Yakuza, an Italian might be a Mafia don, a Hispanic might be a drug lord. Where's the sense in ignoring all those possibilities to focus with such passion on young men with brown skin and beards?

I could also see a benevolent government helping the refugees toresettle in a muslim country, but that would not be PC would it?

In an ideal world the goal of every refugee would be to return home once their homeland was safe. Of course if it takes so long for their homeland to become safe that they had settled, laid down roots in their new home etc, it would seem a little heartless to rip them out and deport them, especially if they had become productive members of society.

 

[tango]

Take your pick seems like they should be wanting to help their fellow muslims, how about all of them

Sounds an awful lot like the priest and the Levite who crossed and passed by on the other side of the road, before the Good Samaritan took pity on the man.

Of course if life were as simple as Muslims being an amorphous mass who all think and believe the same things it would be easier. But, just like with Christianity, there are different groups within Islam. And would you expect to allow a Christian who happened to have brown skin and a beard to come to the US if they were fleeing persecution in, say, Syria? Someone who was born in that area would look much like a Muslim. How would you tell them apart?