Tithing

[Hebrews 11]

Paul was a tent maker how often who knows but let's see his view on living off of the Gospel.
Philippians: 4. 11. Not that I speak in respect of want: for I have learned, in whatsoever state I am, therewith to be content. 12. I know both how to be abased, and I know how to abound: every where and in all things I am instructed both to be full and to be hungry, both to abound and to suffer need. 13. I can do all things through Christ which strengtheneth me. 14. Notwithstanding ye have well done, that ye did communicate with my affliction. 15. Now ye Philippians know also, that in the beginning of the gospel, when I departed from Macedonia, no church communicated with me as concerning giving and receiving, but ye only. 16. For even in Thessalonica ye sent once and again unto my necessity. 17. Not because I desire a gift: but I desire fruit that may abound to your account. 18. But I have all, and abound: I am full, having received of Epaphroditus the things which were sent from you, an odour of a sweet smell, a sacrifice acceptable, wellpleasing to God. 19. But my God shall supply all your need according to his riches in glory by Christ Jesus.

Yes Paul had hardship,take a look at his commission,but he certainly did not refuse to accept help.

This is why we post Scripture, for a foundation to discover the truth not supposition.

 

[tango]

What we're the conventional jobs of the Priest of the Temple?

Share Croppers,Butchers what?

Huh? How does "not allowed to work conventional jobs" turn into asking what the conventional jobs were?

 

[Hebrews 11]

It does not apply today.

What does the Catholic Church teach on giving?
What does the Catechism state on the subject?

 

[tango]

Paul was a tent maker how often who knows but let's see his view on living off of the Gospel.
Philippians: 4. 11. Not that I speak in respect of want: for I have learned, in whatsoever state I am, therewith to be content. 12. I know both how to be abased, and I know how to abound: every where and in all things I am instructed both to be full and to be hungry, both to abound and to suffer need. 13. I can do all things through Christ which strengtheneth me. 14. Notwithstanding ye have well done, that ye did communicate with my affliction. 15. Now ye Philippians know also, that in the beginning of the gospel, when I departed from Macedonia, no church communicated with me as concerning giving and receiving, but ye only. 16. For even in Thessalonica ye sent once and again unto my necessity. 17. Not because I desire a gift: but I desire fruit that may abound to your account. 18. But I have all, and abound: I am full, having received of Epaphroditus the things which were sent from you, an odour of a sweet smell, a sacrifice acceptable, wellpleasing to God. 19. But my God shall supply all your need according to his riches in glory by Christ Jesus.

Yes Paul had hardship,take a look at his commission,but he certainly did not refuse to accept help.

This is why we post Scripture, for a foundation to discover the truth not supposition.

He also wrote to the Thessalonians to show that they didn't take food from people for free but worked hard so they wouldn't be a burden.

2Th 3:7-9 NKJV For you yourselves know how you ought to follow us, for we were not disorderly among you; (8) nor did we eat anyone's bread free of charge, but worked with labor and toil night and day, that we might not be a burden to any of you, (9) not because we do not have authority, but to make ourselves an example of how you should follow us.

It's perfectly true to say that if people want their minister to work for the church full-time then the minister needs to be paid. If the people want a big church building it needs to be funded and maintained. That just means people have to give, not that people have to give a predetermined percentage of their income. If a church is full of hedge fund managers the chances are it can operate very well with nobody giving more than 1% of their income. If a church is full of low-paid people who want to make sure the minister can focus on ministry and not worry about the extra cost of providing food if he is entertaining people they may have to give more than 10% to make it happen. I don't see anybody saying we don't have to give anything at all, the question is whether we should give a literal and rigid 10% (which still leaves the question of whether it's 10% of gross income, net income, discretionary income etc) or give whatever we purpose in our hearts (as Paul mentioned)

Scripture does let us discover truth but merely posting a verse or two without explaining anything about how, or even whether, it is relevant to the discussion doesn't further any discussion.

 

[MoreCoffee]

1 Corinthians: 9. 13. Do ye not know that they which minister about holy things live of the things of the temple? and they which wait at the alter are partakers with the alter? 14. Even so hath the Lord ordained that they which preach the gospel should live of the gospel.

How does the Bishops Priest,and Pope live off of fairy dust?

Or does money fall from Heaven?

Or is God a counterfeiter?

1 Corinthians: 9:13-14 speaks of the temple in Jerusalem which still operated when the verses were written (some time around 50 to 60 AD) and that's sufficient explanation for saint Paul's use of the example of the priests who minister in the temple. As for the ministers of the gospel it is obvious that since God commanded Israel to provide for the brethren in the tribe of Levi so saint Paul can urge the necessity of providing for the men who preached the gospel among the Gentiles and Jews of his time. Today we make provision by giving for the needs of the ministry (including building construction and maintenance and salaries for those who are employed by the Church). We do not demand a tithe (10% or more) because we receive sufficient without making such demands.

 

[Hebrews 11]

Well 1% and money managers may be great,totally your choice.
My choice is to give a tenth or more,because every thing I have had or will have he has given me and more.
It is a personal choice I suppose between you and God.

I have never regretted giving to the Church,and God has never failed me,he deserves my best he deserves the glory.
The house of God is not a house of money changers,who can increase 1 % but my God can feed 5000 with a bit of bread and a couple of fish.

I am done I will remove from this thread
God Bless

 

[pinacled]

Widow and orphan. Jeremiah 49 verse11 on in considering a tithe.

 

[tango]

Well 1% and money managers may be great,totally your choice.
My choice is to give a tenth or more,because every thing I have had or will have he has given me and more.
It is a personal choice I suppose between you and God.

A personal choice, which is pretty much what some of us have been saying all along. Give what you believe to be right, rather than slavishly giving 10%.

I have never regretted giving to the Church,and God has never failed me,he deserves my best he deserves the glory.
The house of God is not a house of money changers,who can increase 1 % but my God can feed 5000 with a bit of bread and a couple of fish.

Sure, it's not as if God needs us to hand over cash in church.

Of course another twist is that at least some of the preachers who teach that the tithe is necessary seem to think that not only is 10% a minimum but that it must be given to the church. There's no reason why someone with a huge income shouldn't decide to give 1% of it to their church and give to other projects and ventures as well. It's perfectly acceptable to give 1% to the church and also support the local homeless shelter, women's refuge, elementary school and so on.

 

[TurtleHare]

What tango wrote in his second paragraph is more in line with a Christian showing love to God and neighbors then a mandatory giving of only the church. Especially when you see how rich some preachers end up which I find totally vile.

 

[psalms 91]

Those who deny the tithe go against the bible. I have no problem where it is given but it shiould be given

 

[pinacled]

From what I have read so far. A shadow of things to come has not passed for some. If darkness is over the land there will be nothing to grow.
Following the school master to Christ a woman with an issue of blood reached out to our Lord's garment. Lamentations for one who cries out and lifts their heart in both hands.
The Law and the Prophets.

 

[MoreCoffee]

Those who deny the tithe go against the bible. I have no problem where it is given but it should be given

Didn't you write in a post (not so long ago) that it is up to the individual to decide what to give and to whom? (see post #102)

Since it is a choice and a matter between the individual and God then it is not a case of "Those who deny the tithe go against the bible" is it?

 

[tango]

Those who deny the tithe go against the bible. I have no problem where it is given but it shiould be given

So did Paul go against the Bible when he wrote this:

2Co 9:7 So let each one give as he purposes in his heart, not grudgingly or of necessity; for God loves a cheerful giver.

 

[tango]

From what I have read so far. A shadow of things to come has not passed for some. If darkness is over the land there will be nothing to grow.
Following the school master to Christ a woman with an issue of blood reached out to our Lord's garment. Lamentations for one who cries out and lifts their heart in both hands.
The Law and the Prophets.

Excellent, another post that has nothing whatsoever to do with tithing.

 

[pinacled]

Excellent, another post that has nothing whatsoever to do with tithing.

Do you think it possible that the pharoh of Egypt would tithe?
Also when was the first tithe?

 

[tango]

Do you think it possible that the pharoh of Egypt would tithe?
Also when was the first tithe?

I'm not sure how either of those questions ate relevant to the question of whether we should tithe today.

 

[psalms 91]

The first tithe I can recall was Abraham tithing to Melchesidak

 

[Lamb]

I kind of always thought of Abel as giving a joyful offering and Cain feeling the obligation to tithe.

 

[pinacled]

The first tithe I can recall was Abraham tithing to Melchesidak

Amen.
I hope am keeping with the fruit of repentence.

 

[MoreCoffee]

The first tithe I can recall was Abraham tithing to Melchesidak

Seems that was given as a custom and to set the stage for later revelation from God but not as Abraham following a command from God nor as an obligation. It's more of a lesson than a commandment, is it not, in the case of Abraham and Melchizedek?