How is this fair????

[Jazzy]

To Increase Equity, School Districts Eliminate Honors Classes

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Thoughts about this?

 

[Lamb]

I was in all the accelerated classes in school so this isn't helping America at all. Our students are lower in testing scores than other countries and the nonsense in the fight over pronouns is putting us even lower than ever. We need strong leaders to encourage schools to do better but the public school system is failing which is why more people are going either private or doing homeschooling.

The article couldn't be loaded for me, btw, because it said I needed to sign up for that newspaper.

 

[hedrick]

Equity is a good thing where it applies. This is a bad reaction. I don’t think this is a trend, unless Florida carries out its threat to stop doing AP courses. I think parental reaction to the places that have tried it will limit the spread. San Diego has had to back off.

Improving education for minorities is a big problem. I don’t think this is the way. But there are and should be ongoing efforts to improve things. Some will likely be bad ideas.

 

[Lamb]

Equity is a good thing where it applies. This is a bad reaction. I don’t think this is a trend, unless Florida carries out its threat to stop doing AP courses. I think parental reaction to the places that have tried it will limit the spread. San Diego has had to back off.

Improving education for minorities is a big problem. I don’t think this is the way. But there are and should be ongoing efforts to improve things. Some will likely be bad ideas.

I totally agree! The town next to mine, where I used to live, didn't have as many graduates or good test scores and had more minorities. Some students started coming to my town's school, which normally is against their rules, but they allowed it under certain conditions. Not every student excelled at my town's school, but a lot of them did get a better education. I don't know if it's better teachers, a better curriculum, a more calming environment or what. It also could be that parents took more interest in their kids' educations?

What I learned growing up is that the kids who had parents who were smart...were most likely to be smart too. Their parents taught them things without needing tutors, but also their everyday interactions were teaching moments. My mom didn't graduate high school and my dad only had a high school diploma, but I was in the advanced classes because my parents were interested in me being able to learn so I could have a better life. So maybe that helped me out?

 

[Lanman87]

Like it or not, we are not all the same, we all learn at different speeds and have different levels of intelligence. Some are gifted, most are average, and some are below average. Each group needs to be taught in a way that helps the students to thrive.

Articles like the one posted are examples of why parents home school or spend tons of money on private schools. Public schools should be pushing students to excel at whatever level the student is at. If you put the gifted students in the same classroom as those who aren't gifted then either the gifted student is bored or the non-gifted gets left behind.

 

[Albion]

To Increase Equity, School Districts Eliminate Honors Classes

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Thoughts about this?

Reducing everything to the lowest level at which every last student can operate might be considered egalitarian, but that's not "equity." Not to deliberately hold back the brighter or harder-working students, it isn't.

On the other hand, that's the beauty of using a meaningless term like "equity" to describe a nutty policy. "Equality," which used to be the American ideal, is understandable, but "equity'' means whatever the rulers want it to mean...and it sounds good at the same time.

 

[Messy]

Like it or not, we are not all the same, we all learn at different speeds and have different levels of intelligence. Some are gifted, most are average, and some are below average. Each group needs to be taught in a way that helps the students to thrive.

Articles like the one posted are examples of why parents home school or spend tons of money on private schools. Public schools should be pushing students to excel at whatever level the student is at. If you put the gifted students in the same classroom as those who aren't gifted then either the gifted student is bored or the non-gifted gets left behind.

They threw it all together for 3 years when I was in school. The screamers, who were not interested in learning, made one teacher go mad and ruined it, but lol the 4th year it was just quiet kids who came to learn something and the physics teacher said: Please!! Say something!

 

[tango]

Reducing everything to the lowest level at which every last student can operate might be considered egalitarian, but that's not "equity." Not to deliberately hold back the brighter or harder-working students, it isn't.

On the other hand, that's the beauty of using a meaningless term like "equity" to describe a nutty policy. "Equality," which used to be the American ideal, is understandable, but "equity'' means whatever the rulers want it to mean...and it sounds good at the same time.

True - equity can mean something very good and it can also mean forcing equality by dragging everybody down to the same standard of misery. If we can't get the bottom people higher we'll just drag down those at the top and call it fairness. Except we won't drag down the ones at the top, we'll just drag down everybody below a certain level and create a bigger gap between the masses and the elite.

Because equality. Or because equity.

 

[tango]

 

[Albion]

True - equity can mean something very good and it can also mean forcing equality by dragging everybody down to the same standard of misery. If we can't get the bottom people higher we'll just drag down those at the top and call it fairness. Except we won't drag down the ones at the top, we'll just drag down everybody below a certain level and create a bigger gap between the masses and the elite.

Because equality. Or because equity.

Not to disagree with what you've said here, but the sudden replacement of "equality" with "equity" in every school, corporation, public discussion, and so on was done for two reasons--

1. The average person will think the two terms mean the same thing or else will not even notice the change, and

2. "Equity" can mean whatever the user wants it to mean, whereas there is a generally understood meaning to "equality." Today's 'woke' activists aren't interested in promoting MLKing-type equality in our society.

 

[tango]

Not to disagree with what you've said here, but the sudden replacement of "equality" with "equity" in every school, corporation, public discussion, and so on was done for two reasons--

1. The average person will think the two terms mean the same thing or else will not even notice the change, and

2. "Equity" can mean whatever the user wants it to mean, whereas there is a generally understood meaning to "equality." Today's 'woke' activists aren't interested in promoting MLKing-type equality in our society.

I suspect it relates to the way equity can be taken to mean something that is more useful than equality, but can also be taken to mean tipping the scales in any way considered necessary to achieve the desired results.

It's hard to argue against the "equity, in theory" of the meme I posted. Giving everyone an equal box to help them see the game isn't much help to the shortest and offers no benefit to the tallest. Giving the shortest two boxes and not giving the tallest any boxes simply means everybody gets to see. That's the face of equity that makes a lot of sense.

When equity ends up constantly fighting "privilege" (whatever that means today) you know it will miss the mark. The white teenage boys with a drug-addicted mother and no idea who their father is, living in the trailer park with practically nothing in the way of prospects, would probably love a dose of this "white privilege" they keep hearing about. Meanwhile the black girl whose parents are a doctor and a lawyer and who love her and provide for her isn't "oppressed" even though she is black and female.

 

[Albion]

It's hard to argue against the "equity, in theory" of the meme I posted. Giving everyone an equal box to help them see the game isn't much help to the shortest and offers no benefit to the tallest. Giving the shortest two boxes and not giving the tallest any boxes simply means everybody gets to see. That's the face of equity that makes a lot of sense.

In principle, that's so, although it could also be "equitable" to refuse to allow taller persons to attend the game at all (so that more short people could be accommodated).

The beauty of describing one's actions as being done in the interest of "equity" is that there is no particular standard by which to judge the change.

A certain change could be thought of as fair by the administrator, or it could be something entirely different. But it's not easy to get away with that lack of precision when the stated objective is "equality." That's why that word had to go!

This movement or development is part of the wider effort to refashion the language so that the radicals can do just about whatever they want and favor whomever they choose, while continuing to describe their campaign using words that seem good and principled.

In practice, "equity" means nothing in particular. It's just the description adopted by those who did not want to be vulnerable to criticism for imposing changes that are easily seen by the average person as promoting inequality.

When equity ends up constantly fighting "privilege" (whatever that means today) you know it will miss the mark. The white teenage boys with a drug-addicted mother and no idea who their father is, living in the trailer park with practically nothing in the way of prospects, would probably love a dose of this "white privilege" they keep hearing about. Meanwhile the black girl whose parents are a doctor and a lawyer and who love her and provide for her isn't "oppressed" even though she is black and female.

 

[tango]

True, although equality can also mean multiple things. Pushing towards equality of opportunity is a good thing but equality of outcome is a bad thing. There's already plenty of wiggle room.

Years ago a friend of mine attended an evening class. The class was constantly disrupted by a particular person there. That person hadn't even paid to attend the course - it was paid for under some welfare arrangement. The disruptive person basically couldn't keep up with the course requirements but couldn't be kicked off the course because of "equal opportunities".

Trying to explain that "equal opportunities" was about not denying access to the course based on race, gender, sexual orientation rather than not denying access to the course based on inability to process the course materials was, needless to say, a total waste of time.

 

[Josiah]

To Increase Equity, School Districts Eliminate Honors Classes

---

Thoughts about this?

Liberalism: Lower some so that all are equal.
Conservatism: Rise up some so that all are equal.



.

 

[Messy]

True, although equality can also mean multiple things. Pushing towards equality of opportunity is a good thing but equality of outcome is a bad thing. There's already plenty of wiggle room.

Years ago a friend of mine attended an evening class. The class was constantly disrupted by a particular person there. That person hadn't even paid to attend the course - it was paid for under some welfare arrangement. The disruptive person basically couldn't keep up with the course requirements but couldn't be kicked off the course because of "equal opportunities".

Trying to explain that "equal opportunities" was about not denying access to the course based on race, gender, sexual orientation rather than not denying access to the course based on inability to process the course materials was, needless to say, a total waste of time.

If you study you get more money. If you dont study or not even do anything you get just as much in Holland. I don't care, cause for the same amount I can work part time, but I feel sorry for ppl who didnt study and do full time hard work. They always warned us for communism and that's what you have now. Ppl stop working full time, cause you're forced to work for others.