What or Who is the Church?

[Lees]

lees



Im not talking about the physical nation, Im talking about the people Israel, people of Faith, the Church which started in Genesis



Eph 3:3-6 says nothing about the church could not begin till after the cross



Talking about somebody perverting the scripture, look in he mirror ! The Church existed, it was a Mystery, it existed but unknown. The word mystery
hidden thing, secret, mystery

1. generally mysteries, religious secrets, confided only to the initiated and not to ordinary mortals
2. a hidden or secret thing, not obvious to the understanding
3. a hidden purpose or counsel

Not only did the Church exist in Genesis, Her Head did as well, Christ, Israel

You need to repent my friend

Again, the people who would make up the nation Israel began as the people of God in the time of Moses. (Deut. 27:9) is clear. "And Moses and the priests the Levites spake unto all Israel, saying, Take heed, and hearken, O Israel; this day thou art become the people of the LORD thy God." When God addresses Israel in the Bible, that is who He is addressing. Israel.



Concerning (Eph. 3:3-6), I have showed you before. "That the Gentiles should be fellowheirs, and of the same body, and partakers of his promise in Christ by the gospel." (6)

How does God make this 'one body'? (Eph 2:14-16) "For he is our peace, who hath made both one, and hath broken down the middle wall of partition between us; Having abolished in his flesh the enmity, even the law of commandments contained in ordinances; for to make in himself of twain one new man, so making peace. And that he might reconcile both unto God in one body by the cross, having slain the enmity thereby."

There could be no new body until the Cross. Scripture is clear. The Church could not exist until after the Cross. And it would be some 50 days later at Pentecost that this new body would begin.

(1 Cor. 12:13) "For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles...." That is the Church. It began at Penteost. See (Acts 2).

Lees

 

[brightfame52]

lees

No. (Is. 45:17) is clear. "But Israel shall be saved in the LORD with an everlasting salvation...." Israel is being addressed

It is clear, Isa 45:17,25 is about Israel, the Body of Christ, His Body the Church, there is Salvation in no other

Adding to the Scripture is not understanding Scripture

But understanding it isnt adding to it, I understand it, you apparently dont

(Rom. 4:16) addresses 'all the seed'

Correct, the Seed of Christ, the seed of Abraham, Israel, His Body the Church

Isa 53:10
10 Yet it pleased
the Lord to bruise him; he hath put him to grief: when thou shalt make his soul an offering for sin, he shall see his seed, he shall prolong his days, and the pleasure of the Lord shall prosper in his hand.


Ps 22:22-23,30

22 I will declare thy name unto my brethren[The Church]: in the midst of the congregation will I praise thee.

23 Ye that fear the Lord, praise him; all ye the seed of Jacob, glorify him; and fear him, all ye the seed of Israel.

30 A seed shall serve him; it shall be accounted to the Lord for a generation.

Gal 3:29

29 And if ye be Christ's[His Church], then are ye Abraham's seed[Israel], and heirs according to the promise

that the method of salvation for them was/is by faith

Thats Israel, all Justified by Faith, and that includes OT believers back into Gen 3

. Those who make up the Church are the seed,

Correct the seed of Israel/Abraham

Being of the Seed of God does not mean all are of the same body of believers

Yes it does, that was the Mystery, The Chosen Seed in Christ who is Israel Eph 1:4

4 According as he hath chosen us [The seed]in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love:

Jesus is the True Israel Isa 49:1-3 and His Church is in union with Him

You have been deceived, Only One Seed Christ and His Church to whom all the promises were made Gal 3:16,29

 

[Lees]

lees


It is clear, Isa 45:17,25 is about Israel, the Body of Christ, His Body the Church, there is Salvation in no other



But understanding it isnt adding to it, I understand it, you apparently dont



Correct, the Seed of Christ, the seed of Abraham, Israel, His Body the Church

Isa 53:10
10 Yet it pleased
the Lord to bruise him; he hath put him to grief: when thou shalt make his soul an offering for sin, he shall see his seed, he shall prolong his days, and the pleasure of the Lord shall prosper in his hand.


Ps 22:22-23,30

22 I will declare thy name unto my brethren[The Church]: in the midst of the congregation will I praise thee.

23 Ye that fear the Lord, praise him; all ye the seed of Jacob, glorify him; and fear him, all ye the seed of Israel.

30 A seed shall serve him; it shall be accounted to the Lord for a generation.

Gal 3:29

29 And if ye be Christ's[His Church], then are ye Abraham's seed[Israel], and heirs according to the promise



Thats Israel, all Justified by Faith, and that includes OT believers back into Gen 3




Correct the seed of Israel/Abraham



Yes it does, that was the Mystery, The Chosen Seed in Christ who is Israel Eph 1:4

4 According as he hath chosen us [The seed]in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love:

Jesus is the True Israel Isa 49:1-3 and His Church is in union with Him

You have been deceived, Only One Seed Christ and His Church to whom all the promises were made Gal 3:16,29

Your cherry picking my words from post #(160) to fit your explanation certainly fits your very method of Bible interpretation. Here is my post (160) again.

No. (Is. 45:17) is clear. "But Israel shall be saved in the LORD with an everlasting salvation...." Israel is being addressed.

Adding to the Scripture is not understanding Scripture. I'm not opposing Scripture. I'm opposing you.

(Is. 45:25) is Israel also. It is very clear. "In the LORD shall all the seed of Israel be justified, and shall glory."

(Rom. 4:16) addresses 'all the seed' and that the method of salvation for them was/is by faith. That doesn't make Israel the Church. Nor does it make those from Adam to Moses the Church of Jesus Christ. Those who make up the Church are the seed, just as those who exercised faith from Adam to Moses are the seed, just as those who make up Israel are the seed. Being of the Seed of God does not mean all are of the same body of believers. But all who are of the Seed of God are so by faith.

Lees

As you can see, it reads differently then the cherries you picked.

You choose to interpret the Bible using your own definitions and not the Bible's. You identify the Church and Israel and all believers who will ever exist as the same body. But the Bible does not.

You say only one Seed. Which is true. But one Seed can spawn several bodies. The Church and Israel are of One Seed. But different bodies.

Lees

 

[brightfame52]

Your cherry picking my words from post #(160) to fit your explanation certainly fits your very method of Bible interpretation. Here is my post (160) again.


As you can see, it reads differently then the cherries you picked.

You choose to interpret the Bible using your own definitions and not the Bible's. You identify the Church and Israel and all believers who will ever exist as the same body. But the Bible does not.

You say only one Seed. Which is true. But one Seed can spawn several bodies. The Church and Israel are of One Seed. But different bodies.

Lees

Both Isa 45:17,25 pertain to The Church, the Body of Christ, Israel.

And there are not seeds as in many, but Seed which is Christ Israel and His Body Gal 3:16,29

You are claiming two seeds which is error

. 16 Now to Abraham and his seed were the promises made. He saith not, And to seeds, as of many; but as of one, And to thy seed, which is Christ.

 

[Lees]

Both Isa 45:17,25 pertain to The Church, the Body of Christ, Israel.

And there are not seeds as in many, but Seed which is Christ Israel and His Body Gal 3:16,29

You are claiming two seeds which is error

. 16 Now to Abraham and his seed were the promises made. He saith not, And to seeds, as of many; but as of one, And to thy seed, which is Christ.

No, the Church hadn't begun yet. See post #(161), that you have chosen to ignore. The Church could not begin till after the Cross. It then began on the day of Pentecost some 50 days later.

No I didn't claim there were two seeds. I said there was One Seed. See again post #(163). Israel is of the Seed. The Church is of the Seed.

Why do you ignore post #161?

Lees

 

[brightfame52]

No, the Church hadn't begun yet. See post #(161), that you have chosen to ignore. The Church could not begin till after the Cross. It then began on the day of Pentecost some 50 days later.

No I didn't claim there were two seeds. I said there was One Seed. See again post #(163). Israel is of the Seed. The Church is of the Seed.

Why do you ignore post #161?

Lees

The Church began in Genesis, so did Israel

No I didn't claim there were two seeds. I said there was One Seed

Thats correct, One Seed Christ Israel and His Body the Church. So all the seed of Israel shall be Justified in the Lord Israel who is the Head of His Body the Church, the Israel of God .Israel and the Church are the same. If you deny that, you deny what you say you dont deny which is two different seeds

Your problem is, you been deceived for so long that when you see evidence proving it, you wont straight out deny it, you mix it into a contradiction.

 

[Lees]

The Church began in Genesis, so did Israel



Thats correct, One Seed Christ Israel and His Body the Church. So all the seed of Israel shall be Justified in the Lord Israel who is the Head of His Body the Church, the Israel of God .Israel and the Church are the same. If you deny that, you deny what you say you dont deny which is two different seeds

Your problem is, you been deceived for so long that when you see evidence proving it, you wont straight out deny it, you mix it into a contradiction.

No, the Church did'nt begin in (Genesis). And I have showed you why in Scripture. Which you ignore.

See. You refuse to admit you're wrong. I never said there were two Seeds as you accused me of. Yet you do not admit your error.

And, you are lying in implying I am saying "One Seed Christ Israel and His Body the Church". You are deceptive and lying in what I have presented. Just as you are deceptive and lying in what the Scripture is saying. For I never said that.

You have'nt produced any evidence from Scripture proving your position. Which is why you avoid my post #(161).

Again, why do you ignore post #(161)?

Lees

 

[brightfame52]

lees

No, the Church did'nt begin in (Genesis).

Yes it did. Why you think Paul referred to Eve when writing to the church in Corinth ? 2 Cor 11:1-3

Would to God ye could bear with me a little in my folly: and indeed bear with me.

2 For I am jealous over you with godly jealousy: for I have espoused you to one husband, that I may present you as a chaste virgin to Christ.

3 But I fear, lest by any means, as the serpent beguiled Eve through his subtilty, so your minds should be corrupted from the simplicity that is in Christ.

The Church were those in Genesis who first began to call upon the Name of the Lord Geb 4:26

And to Seth, to him also there was born a son; and he called his name Enos: then began men to call upon the name of the Lord.

Again Paul writing to the Church at Corinth writes 1 Cor 1:2

2 Unto the church of God which is at Corinth, to them that are sanctified in Christ Jesus, called to be saints, with all that in every place call upon the name of Jesus Christ our Lord, both their's and our's:

They call upon the name of the Lord because they were given Faith in Christ. Christ was and is the Head of the Church from the beginning Col 1:17-18

17 And he is before all things, and by him all things consist.

18 And he is the head of the body, the church: who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead; that in all things he might have the preeminence.

He who is the head of the body the church, was also the beginning, He sustained that headship in the beginning of the world. I know this is going to be over your comprehension, but maybe someone else may be enlightened.

 

[brightfame52]

lees

And I have showed you why in Scripture. Which you ignore.

Friend, no disrespect, but you lack understanding of the scripture and have been deceived.

See. You refuse to admit you're wrong. I never said there were two Seeds as you accused me of. Yet you do not admit your error.

You saying it, then you unsay it, because you confused. There actually is two seeds, Abraham had a natural seed and he had a Spiritual Seed, his Spiritual Seed is Christ and the Church Israel, his natural seed was the nation of israel. But when the seed is mentioned here Gal 3:16 its only Abrahams Spiritual Seed being referred to, which is Christ and His Body the Church, which is Israel, but not the ethnic nation of israel. Rom 4:16 is talking about Israel the Church, Abrahams spiritual seed. In that seed ethnicity doesnt count, its marked by Faith in Christ, going all the way back to Genesis. Abel had Faith in Jesus Christ his Head Heb 11:4

4 By faith Abel offered unto God a more excellent sacrifice than Cain, by which he obtained witness that he was righteous, God testifying of his gifts: and by it he being dead yet speaketh.

Moses was in the Body of Christ, he was given faith in Christ Heb 11:26

26 Esteeming the reproach of Christ greater riches than the treasures in Egypt: for he had respect unto the recompence of the reward.

Christ existed then in heaven and was the head of His Body the Church, He hasnt changed Heb 13:6-8

6 So that we may boldly say, The Lord is my helper, and I will not fear what man shall do unto me.

7 Remember them which have the rule over you, who have spoken unto you the word of God: whose faith follow, considering the end of their conversation.

8 Jesus Christ the same yesterday, and to day, and for ever.

 

[Lees]

@brightflame52

Respond to post #(161) which you ignore.

Lees

 

[Lees]

lees



Yes it did. Why you think Paul referred to Eve when writing to the church in Corinth ? 2 Cor 11:1-3

Would to God ye could bear with me a little in my folly: and indeed bear with me.

2 For I am jealous over you with godly jealousy: for I have espoused you to one husband, that I may present you as a chaste virgin to Christ.

3 But I fear, lest by any means, as the serpent beguiled Eve through his subtilty, so your minds should be corrupted from the simplicity that is in Christ.

The Church were those in Genesis who first began to call upon the Name of the Lord Geb 4:26

And to Seth, to him also there was born a son; and he called his name Enos: then began men to call upon the name of the Lord.

Again Paul writing to the Church at Corinth writes 1 Cor 1:2

2 Unto the church of God which is at Corinth, to them that are sanctified in Christ Jesus, called to be saints, with all that in every place call upon the name of Jesus Christ our Lord, both their's and our's:

They call upon the name of the Lord because they were given Faith in Christ. Christ was and is the Head of the Church from the beginning Col 1:17-18

17 And he is before all things, and by him all things consist.

18 And he is the head of the body, the church: who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead; that in all things he might have the preeminence.

He who is the head of the body the church, was also the beginning, He sustained that headship in the beginning of the world. I know this is going to be over your comprehension, but maybe someone else may be enlightened.

Just because Paul speaks of Eve doesn't mean Eve is in the Church.

Jesus is the Head of the Body the Church. He didn't become that Head until He rose from the dead. "The first born from the dead".

Respond to post #(161) which you ignore.

lees



Friend, no disrespect, but you lack understanding of the scripture and have been deceived.



You saying it, then you unsay it, because you confused. There actually is two seeds, Abraham had a natural seed and he had a Spiritual Seed, his Spiritual Seed is Christ and the Church Israel, his natural seed was the nation of israel. But when the seed is mentioned here Gal 3:16 its only Abrahams Spiritual Seed being referred to, which is Christ and His Body the Church, which is Israel, but not the ethnic nation of israel. Rom 4:16 is talking about Israel the Church, Abrahams spiritual seed. In that seed ethnicity doesnt count, its marked by Faith in Christ, going all the way back to Genesis. Abel had Faith in Jesus Christ his Head Heb 11:4

4 By faith Abel offered unto God a more excellent sacrifice than Cain, by which he obtained witness that he was righteous, God testifying of his gifts: and by it he being dead yet speaketh.

Moses was in the Body of Christ, he was given faith in Christ Heb 11:26

26 Esteeming the reproach of Christ greater riches than the treasures in Egypt: for he had respect unto the recompence of the reward.

Christ existed then in heaven and was the head of His Body the Church, He hasnt changed Heb 13:6-8

6 So that we may boldly say, The Lord is my helper, and I will not fear what man shall do unto me.

7 Remember them which have the rule over you, who have spoken unto you the word of God: whose faith follow, considering the end of their conversation.

8 Jesus Christ the same yesterday, and to day, and for ever.

That's rich. You claim first there is One Seed and accuse me for being in error in saying there are two seeds. Which I didn't say. You now claim there are two seeds.

There is only One Seed from God that makes up His people. And that is the Seed we have been discussing. And that Seed has produced the people of God from Adam to Moses who believed. A time when there was no Church and no Israel. (Rom. 5:14)

That Seed produced the people of God in Israel, in the Israelite who believed, which made up the true nation of Israel. Which began in the day of Moses. (Deut. 27:9)

That Seed produced the Church, in any who believe, which make up the Body and Bride of Christ, which began at Pentacost. (Eph. 2:14-16) (Eph. 3:5-6) (1 Cor. 12:13)

Just because there is One Seed doesn't mean there is only one body of believers.

Respond to post #(161) which you ignore.

Lees

 

[brightfame52]

lees

Just because Paul speaks of Eve doesn't mean Eve is in the Church.

I believe it does In fact she is the mother of all the living, which is the church

Jesus is the Head of the Body the Church. He didn't become that Head until He rose from the dead

False, as Head of the Church He created man

Respond to post #(161) which you ignore.

I have dealt with that already, you cant understand my conclusions

That's rich. You claim first there is One Seed and accuse me for being in error in saying there are two seeds. Which I didn't say. You now claim there are two seeds.

I repeat you lack understanding and have been deceived. I have taken the time to explain these things to you

There is only One Seed from God that makes up His people. And that is the Seed we have been discussing. And that Seed has produced the people of God from Adam to Moses who believed. A time when there was no Church and no Israel. (Rom. 5:14)

When it comes to Salvation/Justification there is only One Seed, Christ and His Church also known as Israel Isa 45:25

In the Lord shall all the seed of Israel[THe Church] be justified,
and shall glory.

Do you agree with that ? Yes or No...If you dont then you believe in a additional seed to be saved

That Seed produced the people of God in Israel, in the Israelite who believed, which made up the true nation of Israel. Which began in the day of Moses. (Deut. 27:9)

The Israelites that believed in the nation was the body of Christ, faith to believe comes from their Head Jesus Christ the Head of His Church, He has always been the author and finisher of His seeds Faith Heb 12:2

Just because there is One Seed doesn't mean there is only one body of believers.

Yes it does mean that , now you are stealthily introducing a second seed !

Respond to post #(161) which you ignore.

Already have and you lack understanding !

 

[Lees]

lees



I believe it does In fact she is the mother of all the living, which is the church



False, as Head of the Church He created man



I have dealt with that already, you cant understand my conclusions



I repeat you lack understanding and have been deceived. I have taken the time to explain these things to you



When it comes to Salvation/Justification there is only One Seed, Christ and His Church also known as Israel Isa 45:25

In the Lord shall all the seed of Israel[THe Church] be justified,
and shall glory.

Do you agree with that ? Yes or No...If you dont then you believe in a additional seed to be saved


The Israelites that believed in the nation was the body of Christ, faith to believe comes from their Head Jesus Christ the Head of His Church, He has always been the author and finisher of His seeds Faith Heb 12:2



Yes it does mean that , now you are stealthily introducing a second seed !



Already have and you lack understanding !

Just because Eve is the mother of all living doesn't place her in the Church. Nor does it place her in Israel. Israel began in the days of Moses. (Deut. 27:9) The Church began after the Cross at Pentecost. (Eph. 2:14-16) (Eph. 3:5-6) (1 Cor. 12:13)

Jesus cannot be the 'Head of His Body' until He had a Body. He could not be the Head of His Body, till that Body was resurrected and ascended into Heaven where that Head is. "The Firstborn from the dead" When Jesus rose from the dead, did His physical fleshly body rise? The Jesus that is in Heaven, is He a physical Man?

As the Son, the Son was involved with all creation. That was before the Son had a Body. Jesus.

No, you have'nt dealt with my post #(161). You ignore it. I understand your conclusions. And your conculusions are wrong. You understand post #(161) because it shows your conclusions are wrong. Which is why you ignore it.

Of course I don't agree with your statement that the Church and Israel are the same. All of believing Israel, which started in Moses day, will be saved. And they make up the true Israel. All of the believing in our day, since Pentecost, make up the Church, and will be saved. One Seed that produces the believing. The believing are found in different bodies.

You say the Israelites that 'believed in the nation". Where in the world did you get that? Faith in the nation does nothing. Faith in God does. The true Israelite was one born a Jew and believed. Faith in God. And, no, that did not make the Israelite part of the Body of Christ. It made him part of God's Israel. Believing Israel. Which began in Moses day. (Deut. 27:9)

Yes, I see you ignored again the verses, (Eph. 2:14), (Eph. 3:5-6), (1Cor. 12:13) which show how the Church did not and could not begin until after the Cross and did begin on the day of Pentecost. (Acts 2) As I explained in post #(161). Which you refuse to reply to as they contradict your statements concerning the Church. You should consider your reluctance to address that. In other words, Scriputre is against you.

The Seed produces the believers who will believe. That includes the believers from Adam to Moses. It later includes another body, Israel, which began in the days of Moses. It later includes another body, the Church, Christs Body and Bride. True faith that saves is always directed towards Jesus Christ in some way. That doesn't mean that the Church is Israel or is composed of all believers from all time. And, in (Heb. 12:2) Paul is clear. The faith he is speaking of occurs after the Cross. The Church.

If a man and woman are married and have several children by that man and woman, the children are of one seed. Different people, different bodies, yet one seed. The same is true of the family of God, that God is creating.

No, you have not responded to post #(161). And, both you and I understand why.

Lees

 

[brightfame52]

lees

Just because Eve is the mother of all living doesn't place her in the Church

I believe it does, And her marriage to adam is a picture of Christ and the Church, the Mystery Eph 5:28-30

28 So ought men to love their wives as their own bodies. He that loveth his wife loveth himself. 29 For no man ever yet hated his own flesh; but nourisheth and cherisheth it, even as the Lord the church: 30 for we are members of his body, of his flesh, and of his bones. 31 For this cause shall a man leave his father and mother, and shall be joined unto his wife, and they two shall be one flesh. 32 This is a great mystery: but I speak concerning Christ and the church.

God created the world with the Church on His Mind and Purpose, the first marriage proves it:

Gen 2:21-24

21 And the Lord God caused a deep sleep to fall upon Adam, and he slept: and he took one of his ribs, and closed up the flesh instead thereof; 22 and the rib, which the Lord God had taken from man, made he a woman, and brought her unto the man. 23 And Adam said, This is now bone of my bones, and flesh of my flesh: she shall be called Woman, because she was taken out of Man. 24 Therefore shall a man leave his father and his mother, and shall cleave unto his wife: and they shall be one flesh.

 

[brightfame52]

lees

. Nor does it place her in Israel.

Israel is her Eves Seed as is the Church. After cain murdered Abela part of the church, God replaced him with Seth who Eve stated specifically he was her seed Gen 4:25-26

25 And Adam knew his wife again; and she bare a son, and called his name Seth: For God, said she, hath appointed me another seed instead of Abel, whom Cain slew. 26 And to Seth, to him also there was born a son; and he called his name Enos: then began men to call upon the name of the Lord.

Now it was through this seed Christ the Messiah/ the Head of Church would be born Christs birth can be traced back according to genealogy from the scriptures, to Adam and Eve Lk 3:23-38

23 And Jesus himself began to be about thirty years of age, being (as was supposed) the son of Joseph, which was the son of Heli, 24 which was the son of Matthat, which was the son of Levi, which was the son of Melchi, which was the son of Janna, which was the son of Joseph, 25 which was the son of Mattathias, which was the son of Amos, which was the son of Naum, which was the son of Esli, which was the son of Nagge, 26 which was the son of Maath, which was the son of Mattathias, which was the son of Semei, which was the son of Joseph, which was the son of Juda, 27 which was the son of Joanna, which was the son of Rhesa, which was the son of Zorobabel, which was the son of Salathiel, which was the son of Neri, 28 which was the son of Melchi, which was the son of Addi, which was the son of Cosam, which was the son of Elmodam, which was the son of Er, 29 which was the son of Jose, which was the son of Eliezer, which was the son of Jorim, which was the son of Matthat, which was the son of Levi, 30 which was the son of Simeon, which was the son of Juda, which was the son of Joseph, which was the son of Jonan, which was the son of Eliakim, 31 which was the son of Melea, which was the son of Menan, which was the son of Mattatha, which was the son of Nathan, which was the son of David, 32 which was the son of Jesse, which was the son of Obed, which was the son of Booz, which was the son of Salmon, which was the son of Naasson, 33 which was the son of Aminadab, which was the son of Aram, which was the son of Esrom, which was the son of Phares, which was the son of Juda, 34 which was the son of Jacob, which was the son of Isaac, which was the son of Abraham, which was the son of Thara, which was the son of Nachor, 35 which was the son of Saruch, which was the son of Ragau, which was the son of Phalec, which was the son of Heber, which was the son of Sala, 36 which was the son of Cainan, which was the son of Arphaxad, which was the son of Sem, which was the son of Noe, which was the son of Lamech, 37 which was the son of Mathusala, which was the son of Enoch, which was the son of Jared, which was the son of Maleleel, which was the son of Cainan, 38 which was the son of Enos, which was the son of Seth, which was the son of Adam, which was the son of God.

You see according to the flesh, Christ came through the seed of Eve Seth ! Also Israel according to election[Church] came through this line

God created Adam and Eve to populate the godly seed, the Church Mal 2:15

And did not he make one? Yet had he the residue of the spirit. And wherefore one? That he might seek a godly seed. Therefore take heed to your spirit, and let none deal treacherously against the wife of his youth.

I already know this is over your head, but it will serve as a testimony against you, unless of course God has mercy on you and give you eyes to see.

 

[brightfame52]

lees

The Church began after the Cross at Pentecost. (Eph. 2:14-16) (Eph. 3:5-6) (1 Cor. 12:13)

No it didnt, and not one of those scriptures say: "The Church began after the Cross at Pentecost" The Church began in Genesis !

 

[Lees]

lees



I believe it does, And her marriage to adam is a picture of Christ and the Church, the Mystery Eph 5:28-30

28 So ought men to love their wives as their own bodies. He that loveth his wife loveth himself. 29 For no man ever yet hated his own flesh; but nourisheth and cherisheth it, even as the Lord the church: 30 for we are members of his body, of his flesh, and of his bones. 31 For this cause shall a man leave his father and mother, and shall be joined unto his wife, and they two shall be one flesh. 32 This is a great mystery: but I speak concerning Christ and the church.

God created the world with the Church on His Mind and Purpose, the first marriage proves it:

Gen 2:21-24

21 And the Lord God caused a deep sleep to fall upon Adam, and he slept: and he took one of his ribs, and closed up the flesh instead thereof; 22 and the rib, which the Lord God had taken from man, made he a woman, and brought her unto the man. 23 And Adam said, This is now bone of my bones, and flesh of my flesh: she shall be called Woman, because she was taken out of Man. 24 Therefore shall a man leave his father and his mother, and shall cleave unto his wife: and they shall be one flesh.

Adam is a picture or type of Christ. Eve is also a picture or type of the Bride of Christ, the Church. That doesn't make Eve or Adam a part of the Church. That doesn't make Adam and Eve part of Israel. How stupid.

Everything God created was always known to Him. That doesn't make Eve or Adam part of the Church. That doesn't make Israel the Church or the Church Israel.

(Gen. 2:21-24) are good verses. They prove nothing of what you are saying.

Your position is so empty, so indefensible, that you cannot respond to all that I said. You just choose one sentence from my post #(173) and try to reply to it and ignore the rest. Just as you ignore my post #(161), so you now ignore my post #(173).

Again, your reluctance to respond to post #(161) shows you don't care what Scripture says. It shows you are wrong. And, you don't care if you're wrong.

Lees

 

[brightfame52]

lees

The Seed produces the believers who will believe. That includes the believers from Adam to Moses. It later includes another body, Israel, which began in the days of Moses. It later includes another body, the Church, Christs Body and Bride

Thats madness, Its all one seed, one body, Christs Spiritual Seed that He redeemed Isa 53:10

10 Yet it pleased the Lord to bruise him; he hath put him to grief: when thou shalt make his soul an offering for sin, he shall see his seed, he shall prolong his days, and the pleasure of the Lord shall prosper in his hand.

Everyone Christ soul was made an offering for, is Israel, is the Church, that's it. All who belongs to the seed will be given faith in Christ, from genesis to revelation

If a man and woman are married and have several children by that man and woman, the children are of one seed. Different people, different bodies, yet one seed. The same is true of the family of God, that God is creating.

Nobody denies differences. in races, sex, social status, but none of those physical differences changes the fact that all the Justified are one in Christ Gal 3:27-29

27 For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ.

28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus.

29 And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.

You making physical differences in Spiritual Israel, contrary to the Gospel, Paul rebuked Peter for that foolishness'. In essence you are saying God saved or saves some people based on their flesh, race, in the Lord Jesus Christ.

The Israel that God promised to Save in Jesus Christ has nothing to do with race Isa 45:17

17 But Israel shall be saved in the Lord with an everlasting salvation: ye shall not be ashamed nor confounded world without end.

Do you believe the Lord here in this scripture is the Lord Jesus Christ here Gal 3:28-29

28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus.

29 And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.

 

[Lees]

lees



Israel is her Eves Seed as is the Church. After cain murdered Abela part of the church, God replaced him with Seth who Eve stated specifically he was her seed Gen 4:25-26

25 And Adam knew his wife again; and she bare a son, and called his name Seth: For God, said she, hath appointed me another seed instead of Abel, whom Cain slew. 26 And to Seth, to him also there was born a son; and he called his name Enos: then began men to call upon the name of the Lord.

Now it was through this seed Christ the Messiah/ the Head of Church would be born Christs birth can be traced back according to genealogy from the scriptures, to Adam and Eve Lk 3:23-38



You see according to the flesh, Christ came through the seed of Eve Seth ! Also Israel according to election[Church] came through this line

God created Adam and Eve to populate the godly seed, the Church Mal 2:15

And did not he make one? Yet had he the residue of the spirit. And wherefore one? That he might seek a godly seed. Therefore take heed to your spirit, and let none deal treacherously against the wife of his youth.

I already know this is over your head, but it will serve as a testimony against you, unless of course God has mercy on you and give you eyes to see.

So, just how many Seeds are there with you? Seed of God? Seed of Abraham? Seed of Eve? Yet you claimed there is only One Seed. Then you claimed there are two seeds. Now you claim ther are three seeds. Please make up your mind...if possible.

Israel and the Church are of the Seed of God. Eve is of the Seed of God. Just because Eve is of the Seed of God doesn't make Eve part of Israel or the Church. Just because Eve bore another seed, Seth, doesn't make her part of the Church or Israel.

Just because Christ would be that seed, doesn't make Adam and Eve, or those from Adam to Moses, part of Israel or the Church.

No, it's not over my head. But it is all over my boots as something I stepped in. But keep talking. I have stepped through this..stuff...before.

And, respond to post #(161) and (173).

lees



No it didnt, and not one of those scriptures say: "The Church began after the Cross at Pentecost" The Church began in Genesis !

Oh yes, those Scriptures say just that. (Eph 2:14-16) (Eph. 3:5-6) (1 Cor. 12;13)

The Chruch of Jesus Christ did not begin in (Genesis), as these Scriptures prove. Israel began in the days of Moses as (Deut. 27:9) proves.

Your position is false. Scripture is against you.

You are typical of those who hold the position you do. You run and hide. You try and not answer the questions that prove from Scripture how wrong you are.

Lees

 

[brightfame52]

lees

No, you have not responded to post #(161). And, both you and I understand why.

Yes I have, you dont understand the response, its obvious.