Will God destroy America?

[Lees]

A similar question to me would be, why shouldn't God destroy America?

Understand that nations are judged only in time. Not in eternity. Thus if a judgement is needed, it will be done in time. I say that because we in America like to think that if God does judge America and destroys it, it will be after Christ returns and all nations are judged. We don't like to think that God may judge America now, and destroy it for it's apostasy from God.

But, God most certainly judged Israel in time. The northern kingdom in 721 B.C. by the Assyrians. The southern kingdom in 586 B.C. by the Babylonians. And the restored Israel in 70 A.D. by the Romans. Though these were His chosen people, whom He loved, to whom He gave His written Word, to whom He performed miraculous works in order to preserve and keep them, to whom He sent His only Son as He always promised, He still brought a severe judgement.

Of course, it is this special relationship to God that actually demands God's judgement. This is a law of God. (Luke 12:42-48) Israel was given much light from God. And Israel rebelled against that light.

Wasn't America established by God? Wasn't America blessed with God's people populating it? Wasn't America weaned on the Word of God? Yet has not America cast God aside? Has not America done the same thing as Israel?

Yet we sit in our nation feeling safe and secure as though God would not judge us. As though judgement cannot come in a second. And so our nation goes about it's merry way flaunting it's sins in God's face.

It is my opinion that God has no choice but to judge America. And when He does, it will be with a severity comparable to that Israel has endured.

Lees

 

[atpollard]

A similar question to me would be, why shouldn't God destroy America?

God chose Israel (the people) to be His people.
God chose Israel (the ancient country) to be the land given to His people as an inheritance.
God chose to be the Theocratic ruler over His People and their Country.
God’s people revolted against their Theocratic ruler and were punished for it.

France was never a Theocracy. The French People were never God’s Chosen People living on God’s inheritance to them. All they did (as a government), both Good and Bad was never a revolt against their Theocratic Ruler.

God’s New Covenant people are sojourners in a foreign land. We have a Theocratic King whom we are called to obey. We are rewarded and chastised for our obedience and disobedience.

What evidence is there that the United States was ever a Covenant People or a Theocracy? Why is any national action an obligation for God to bless or punish our nation? As a nation, we are no different from France. The WORLD stores up wrath against itself for the day of wrath.

The “sin” in America is the church which has lost its saltiness. We are not preserving against decay. We are not enhancing the flavor of life. We are not a healing salve for the wounds of the people. So on whom does God’s judgement really belong?

 

[Lees]

God chose Israel (the people) to be His people.
God chose Israel (the ancient country) to be the land given to His people as an inheritance.
God chose to be the Theocratic ruler over His People and their Country.
God’s people revolted against their Theocratic ruler and were punished for it.

France was never a Theocracy. The French People were never God’s Chosen People living on God’s inheritance to them. All they did (as a government), both Good and Bad was never a revolt against their Theocratic Ruler.

God’s New Covenant people are sojourners in a foreign land. We have a Theocratic King whom we are called to obey. We are rewarded and chastised for our obedience and disobedience.

What evidence is there that the United States was ever a Covenant People or a Theocracy? Why is any national action an obligation for God to bless or punish our nation? As a nation, we are no different from France. The WORLD stores up wrath against itself for the day of wrath.

The “sin” in America is the church which has lost its saltiness. We are not preserving against decay. We are not enhancing the flavor of life. We are not a healing salve for the wounds of the people. So on whom does God’s judgement really belong?

If you disagree with what I have said, then answer my questions.

Asking me other questions without answering mine is being dishonest and deceptive. I will gladly answer yours...but first answer mine.

Or, just go away.

Lees

 

[atpollard]

If you disagree with what I have said, then answer my questions.

Asking me other questions without answering mine is being dishonest and deceptive. I will gladly answer yours...but first answer mine.

Or, just go away.

Lees

I apologize.
I thought my answer was self-evident from the point of my post.

Q. Will God destroy America?
A. No.

 

[atpollard]

Wasn't America established by God?

No.

Wasn't America blessed with God's people populating it?

Yes and no.
God’s people were among those that populated North America, but probably never a majority.

Wasn't America weaned on the Word of God?

Sorry, I don’t know how to answer the metaphor. There has always been a waning and waxing preaching of the Bible in America.

Yet has not America cast God aside?

Yes, God has been driven further from the foreground of public discourse in the life of the American people as our culture embraces post-Christianity values. (Many would say anti-Christian values)

Has not America done the same thing as Israel?

No. We were never a Theocracy and never God’s country.

 

[atpollard]

Was America more Christian when a man could not vote or hold office in the Virginia colony unless he belonged to the State Church? Was it more or less Christian to deny other “brothers in Christ” basic civil liberties because they refused to join our denomination and accept its dogma?

Was America more Christian when Paedobaptists were drowning the Baptists along the Appalachian frontier for rejecting infant baptism and daring to call new believers to a believer’s baptism?

Was America more Christian when we were killing one another over the right to own people kidnapped from Africa, transported like animals and sold as property?

We could continue, but I have made my point. When were we “God’s Country” and were Americans “God’s Holy People”?

I trust that I have not avoided your questions this time.
Now you may insert Post #2 as my thoughts on what it means to be the people of God.

 

[Lees]

Q. Will God destroy America?
A. No.

Why not? Just because you don't believe God established America as a Christian nation?

No.


Yes and no.
God’s people were among those that populated North America, but probably never a majority.


Sorry, I don’t know how to answer the metaphor. There has always been a waning and waxing preaching of the Bible in America.


Yes, God has been driven further from the foreground of public discourse in the life of the American people as our culture embraces post-Christianity values. (Many would say anti-Christian values)


No. We were never a Theocracy and never God’s country.

You say 'no' America was not established by God. You say 'no' we were not created a Theocracy. Well, first of all, a country doesn't need to be a Theocracy to be established by God. I never said America replaced Israel. I said God established America as a Christian nation.

The Mayflower Compact:

"...Having undertaken, for the Glory of God and the advancement of the Christian faith and the honor of our king and country, a voyage to plant the first colony in the northern parts of Virginia, do by the presents solemenly and mutually in the presence of God and one of another, covenant and combine ourselves together into a civil body politic, for our better ordering and preservation and furtherance of the ends aforesaid, and by virtue hereof to enact, constitute, and frame such just and equal laws, ordanances, acts, constitutions, and offices from time to time, as shall be thought most meet and convenient for the general good of the colony...."

My statement about America being weaned on the Word of God the Bible was no metaphor. Churches were established everywhere in America with the Bible taught and preached as the Word of God. Every courthouse had a Bible to swear upon before testifying. Our President would swear upon the Bible before taking office. As well as the Supreme Court judges.

Yes God and the Bible has been and is being driven out of our politics, and all state run institutions. And the result is a sinfulness in America by the people of America. Which is why I say, for a nation that was established by God, a nation who was blessed with such light and political freedom to bask and worship in that light, for it to turn away from God, means God must destroy it.

In order for a nation to practice the true worship of God freely, political security is necessary. God did the same with Israel in destroying the heathen Canaanites. Just as He did with the Christians destroying the heathen Indians.

Do you think it coincidental that Columbus discovered America in 1492 and 25 years later Luther wrote his 95 thesis that would start the Reformation which would populate America with Protestant Christians? Not hardly.

Lees

 

[Lees]

Was America more Christian when a man could not vote or hold office in the Virginia colony unless he belonged to the State Church? Was it more or less Christian to deny other “brothers in Christ” basic civil liberties because they refused to join our denomination and accept its dogma?

Was America more Christian when Paedobaptists were drowning the Baptists along the Appalachian frontier for rejecting infant baptism and daring to call new believers to a believer’s baptism?

Was America more Christian when we were killing one another over the right to own people kidnapped from Africa, transported like animals and sold as property?

We could continue, but I have made my point. When were we “God’s Country” and were Americans “God’s Holy People”?

I trust that I have not avoided your questions this time.
Now you may insert Post #2 as my thoughts on what it means to be the people of God.

Determining who can vote in your state makes no one more or less Christian.

The errors in persecuting other believers is common among the Church. Does that mean the Church was not established by God? Of course not.

Slavery was established by God. Thus the existence of slavery does nothing to take away from the fact that America was created by God as a Christian nation.

Lees

 

[atpollard]

Why not? Just because you don't believe God established America as a Christian nation?

Not “just because”, but that is part of the reason. God established Israel as a Theocracy, so His country has rules that are unique and different from ALL OTHER countries. As for all countries except Israel:

As a nation, we are no different from France. The WORLD stores up wrath against itself for the day of wrath.

God will deal with “the world” all at once at the end.
America is part of “the world”.

At this point, I will step back and allow other voices to be heard.
Mine is just one opinion.

 

[Lees]

Not “just because”, but that is part of the reason. God established Israel as a Theocracy, so His country has rules that are unique and different from ALL OTHER countries. As for all countries except Israel:


God will deal with “the world” all at once at the end.
America is part of “the world”.

At this point, I will step back and allow other voices to be heard.
Mine is just one opinion.

Israel being a Theocracy has nothing to do with God establishing America as a Christian nation. Again, I never said America was a theocracy.

So what if God will deal with the world? That doesn't mean He can't or won't destroy America first.

Step back? Why not address all of what I said?

Lees

 

[Albion]

So what if God will deal with the world? That doesn't mean He can't or won't destroy America first.

But there hardly seems to be a reason to destroy America first. Many nations have risen and later fallen, and many were officially or predominately Christian. History goes on until He calls an end to all of human history.

Do you think it coincidental that Columbus discovered America in 1492 and 25 years later Luther wrote his 95 thesis that would start the Reformation which would populate America with Protestant Christians?

There's no particular linkage between those events.

 

[atpollard]

Israel being a Theocracy has nothing to do with God establishing America as a Christian nation. Again, I never said America was a theocracy.

Are you punking me?

I never claimed that you said America was a theocracy. What I said was:

God established Israel as a Theocracy, so His country has rules that are unique and different from ALL OTHER countries.

Israel is a Theocracy and America falls into the group “ALL OTHER countries”. I claimed that Israel was different from all other countries. I do not know how I can express my opinion any clearer.

 

[Lees]

But there hardly seems to be a reason to destroy America first. Many nations have risen and later fallen, and many were officially or predominately Christian. History goes on until He calls an end to all of human history.


There's no particular linkage between those events.

Go back and reread what I have said, and then address it.

Or, if you're that scared, just stay away.

Lees

 

[Lees]

Are you punking me?

I never claimed that you said America was a theocracy. What I said was:

Israel is a Theocracy and America falls into the group “ALL OTHER countries”. I claimed that Israel was different from all other countries. I do not know how I can express my opinion any clearer.

You brought up America as a theocracy, not me. Again, America not being a theocracy has nothing to do with what I have said. Are you a punk?

You can express your opinion clearer by addressing what I have said instead of ignoring it. Instead of inviting others to your rescue and hoping they have more to say than you...which they don't.

My, my...everyone is so bold at the beginning of the discussion. Then they find places of retreat.

In other words...if you don't have nothing to say, then be quiet.

Lees

 

[Albion]

Go back and reread what I have said, and then address it.


Lees

It was in post #11 that I commented on your confused view of history. But of course I realize that it's always possible that some people might misunderstand whatever gets posted here, and for various reasons.

You'll have to point me to the parts that perplexed you if you want them restated in simpler language.

 

[atpollard]

A similar question to me would be, why shouldn't God destroy America?

Let’s try answering you again, from the beginning.

God should not destroy America because America is not now, and has never been His country. Therefore God has no reason to expect America to act as if it was or is His country.

Is that clear enough even for you?

 

[Lees]

It was in post #11 that I commented on your confused view of history. But of course I realize that it's always possible that some people might misunderstand whatever gets posted here, and for various reasons.

You'll have to point me to the parts that perplexed you if you want them restated in simpler language.

No need. Your language was very simple. You just said 'no He won't'. Deep stuff. I could just as easily say, 'yes He will'. Childish.

I gave reasons. Address them. Or not.

Lees

 

[Lees]

Let’s try answering you again, from the beginning.

God should not destroy America because America is not now, and has never been His country. Therefore God has no reason to expect America to act as if it was or is His country.

Is that clear enough even for you?

Address the reasons I gave that America was established by God as a Christian nation. That America from it's start has been given tremendous light from God and protection to walk in His ways and to honor Him.

Do you really believe that America has not been blessed and established by God in this way?

Lees

 

[Lees]

Not only did God create America as a Christian nation, but also as a refuge for His chosen nation, Israel.

The U.S. played an important role in providing a place for the Jews safety while they still suffered the judgement against them from God in their dispersion.

And does any deny the importance to the Jews of America's role in WWII in the defeat of Nazism? Or in the later establishment of Israel as a nation once again in 1948?

And how many times in the United Nations has America stood alone with Israel being a sole vote yay or nay in support for Israel?

God created America Christian. And He has used Her greatly in the world to protect both the Church and the Jews. And He has blessed Her tremendously.

But she as a nation has turned away from God. America perverts God's laws, making legal and protected by law that which is an abomination to God. She is contrary to the Bible and to God.

The sins of America cry out to God for judgement as they did with Sodom and Gomorrah. And they cry louder as they are done against the light of God that has made this country great.

Trump cannot make America great again because he cannot make America Christian. He cannot make it a Bible believing Christ worshipping nation.

Some believe a Revival from God will occur. I don't. The day for Revival has passed. America has filled up her cup of wrath and all that is left is for her to drink it.

In my opinion.

Lees

 

[Albion]

Albion said:

You'll have to point me to the parts that perplexed you....

No need.

Okay.