Regeneration

[atpollard]

Yeah, they say we cannot believe or obey until after we are saved.

God says you were chosen before the foundation of the world.
Was that before or after you were born?
Did you believe and obey before you were born?

PS. That is not quite what we say. We say that all people are blind and deaf and have a heart of stone, that none choose to obey and no one seeks God, that they are incapable of understanding the gospel or choosing to have faith ... UNTIL GOD ACTS FIRST: replacing a heart of stone with a heart of flesh, opening their eyes, giving them ears to hear, drawing them to the Son. Then, and only then, can the seed of the word be planted in the good soil.
(And we only say it because Scripture does.)

 

[YourTruthGod]

[Phl 2:12-13 NASB] 12 So then, my beloved, just as you have always obeyed, not as in my presence only, but now much more in my absence, work out your salvation with fear and trembling; 13 for it is God who is at work in you, both to will and to work for [His] good pleasure.
God draws, teaches and is at work in us both to “will and to work”.

No kidding we have to obey after we are saved, even more so!

[Act 10:44-48 NASB] 44 While Peter was still speaking these words, the Holy Spirit fell upon all those who were listening to the message. 45 All the circumcised believers who came with Peter were amazed, because the gift of the Holy Spirit had been poured out on the Gentiles also. 46 For they were hearing them speaking with tongues and exalting God. Then Peter answered, 47 "Surely no one can refuse the water for these to be baptized who have received the Holy Spirit just as we [did,] can he?" 48 And he ordered them to be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ. Then they asked him to stay on for a few days.
Holy Spirit first, THEN obedience.

CORNELIUS WAS A RIGHTEOUS MAN AND FEARED GOD.

... liar, liar. Pants on fire.

You have now judged yourself to be a liar.

Matthew 7:2 For in the same way you judge others, you will be judged, and with the measure you use, it will be measured to you.

 

[YourTruthGod]

God says you were chosen before the foundation of the world.
Was that before or after you were born?
Did you believe and obey before you were born?

The Bible doesn't say that. Your ignorant teachers taught you that; and you come here playing false teacher too.

 

[YourTruthGod]

Something like that.

Faith comes from hearing the word of Christ. Evidently hearing in this context implies believing too. But the passage says only hearing. That's oddly imprecise.

That's because you still don't get it. Here, how is this for precise:

Where does our faith come from? Our faith comes from HEARING the word, see Romans 10:17. From hearing the word and being TAUGHT, Colossians 1:5, 7. From continuing in what we have been CONVINCED of, see 2 Timothy 3:14, and being PERSUADED, 2 Corinthians 5:11.

 

[YourTruthGod]

At this point you are not arguing with me, you are explaining why the Apostle Paul didn’t mean what he wrote under the inspiration of the Holy Spirit and claiming that one verse in a paragraph of scripture contradicts the rest of the verses surrounding it.

Good luck explaining how Paul misunderstood God, but fortunately we have you to set us straight about what God really meant. :eatpopcorn:

You prove you are dishonest. You can't even discuss in a respectful, normal, and educated way.

 

[YourTruthGod]

Repenting includes believing and following false doctrines, and teaching too, because there are many here preaching their false doctrines.

 

[atpollard]

The Bible doesn't say that. Your ignorant teachers taught you that; and you come here playing false teacher too.

[Eph 1:3-5 NASB] 3 Blessed [be] the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who has blessed us with every spiritual blessing in the heavenly [places] in Christ, 4 just as He chose us in Him before the foundation of the world, that we would be holy and blameless before Him. In love 5 He predestined us to adoption as sons through Jesus Christ to Himself, according to the kind intention of His will,

[Rev 13:8 NASB] 8 All who dwell on the earth will worship him, [everyone] whose name has not been written from the foundation of the world in the book of life of the Lamb who has been slain.

Do you ever get tired of stating false opinions that are easily disproven, revealing who is really the FALSE TEACHER?

[Act 17:11 NASB] 11 Now these were more noble-minded than those in Thessalonica, for they received the word with great eagerness, examining the Scriptures daily [to see] whether these things were so.

 

[YourTruthGod]

[Eph 1:3-5 NASB] 3 Blessed [be] the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who has blessed us with every spiritual blessing in the heavenly [places] in Christ, 4 just as He chose us in Him before the foundation of the world, that we would be holy and blameless before Him. In love 5 He predestined us to adoption as sons through Jesus Christ to Himself, according to the kind intention of His will,

[Rev 13:8 NASB] 8 All who dwell on the earth will worship him, [everyone] whose name has not been written from the foundation of the world in the book of life of the Lamb who has been slain.

Do you ever get tired of stating false opinions that are easily disproven, revealing who is really the FALSE TEACHER?

[Act 17:11 NASB] 11 Now these were more noble-minded than those in Thessalonica, for they received the word with great eagerness, examining the Scriptures daily [to see] whether these things were so.

You can get your name added on and blotted out.

 

[YourTruthGod]

atpollard,

Tell us about all those dogs and pigs that are now saved Greeks and Gentiles.

Remember, don't go to the Gentiles?

 

[YourTruthGod]

We have to come to Him and believe and repent and then THE BLOOD OF JESUS CLEANSES US FROM ALL SIN.

That is the washing of regeneration. See Titus 3:5 5 ...He saved us through the washing of rebirth and renewal by the Holy Spirit,

 

[Josiah]

We have to come to Him and believe and repent and then THE BLOOD OF JESUS CLEANSES US FROM ALL SIN. That is the washing of regeneration. See Titus 3:5 5 ...He saved us through the washing of rebirth and renewal by the Holy Spirit,

When you make up your mind, let us know. You preach works righteousness, the dead giving life and salvation to self by being obedient (although you can't name even one who is).... then quote a verse completely contradicting yourself. Titus 3:5 is correct, proving you are wrong, so very, very wrong.


Sometimes you say we "GET saved" (passive) and then you contradict yourself by insistng the dead, unregenrate, atheistic enemy of God saves himself because he adequately has jumped through whatever hoop you are thinking about at the time. You can't seem to decide whether Jesus is the Savior or self, whether it's Jesus' obedience or our own, Jesus dying and rising or the dead one obeying God and adequately jumping through a bunch of hoops. It seems you want to SOUND Christian by occasionally mentioning Jesus while denying that He does anything other than shouting orders to dead people who can't hear or respond.

In any case, the Bible teaches that Jesus SAVES. Not that self does, and not that self makes it possible for Jesus to save us (weak and inadequate as He is). The Bible teaches that God GIVES life to those who have no life, not that God helps those who help themselves or that God adds life to those who have already given it to themselves.


Read these....

Ephesians 2:8-9

John 6:63

1 Corinthians 12:3

1 Corinthians 2:14

Ephesians 2:1

Romans 8:7

Ezekiel 37:1-14

Ezekiel 37:25-27

2 Corinthians 4:6

John 3:5

John 3:6-8

Romans 8:6-13


God GIVES salvation, God GIVES faith, God GIVES life (spiritual and physical).

As God GIVES faith, that faith embraces/apprehends all the gifts from God - His grace, His justification, His Holy Spirit... and life itself.

Lift high the Cross, not yourself.



See https://christianityhaven.com/showth...sus-The-Savior




.

 

[YourTruthGod]

When you make up your mind, let us know. You preach works righteousness, the dead giving life and salvation to self by being obedient (although you can't name even one who is).... then quote a verse contradiction yourself. Titus 3:5 is correct, proving you are wrong, so very, very wrong.


Sometimes you say we "GET saved" (passive) and then you contradict yourself by insistng the dead, unregenrate, atheistic enemy of God saves himself because he adequately has jumped through whatever hoop you are thinking about at the time. You can't seem to decide whether Jesus is the Savior or self, whether it's Jesus' obedience or our own, Jesus dying and rising or the dead one obeying God and adequately jumping through a bunch of hoops. It seems you want to SOUND Christian by occasionally mentioning Jesus while denying that He does anything other than shouting orders to dead people who can't hear or respond.

In any case, the Bible teaches that Jesus SAVES. Not that self does, and not that self makes it possible for Jesus to save us (weak and inadequate as He is). The Bible teaches that God GIVES life to those who have no life, not that God helps those who help themselves or that God adds life to those who have already given it to themselves.


Read these....

Ephesians 2:8-9

John 6:63

1 Corinthians 12:3

1 Corinthians 2:14

Ephesians 2:1

Romans 8:7

Ezekiel 37:1-14

Ezekiel 37:25-27

2 Corinthians 4:6

John 3:5

John 3:6-8

Romans 8:6-13


God GIVES salvation, God GIVES faith, God GIVES life (spiritual and physical).

As God GIVES faith, that faith embraces/apprehends all the gifts from God - His grace, His justification, His Holy Spirit... and life itself.

Lift high the Cross, not yourself.



See https://christianityhaven.com/showth...sus-The-Savior

Tell us about all those dogs and pigs that are now saved Greeks and Gentiles.

Remember, don't go to the Gentiles?

 

[atpollard]

You can get your name added on and blotted out.

YOU can get YOUR NAME added and blotted out ...

... but I have been “marked in him with a seal, the promised Holy Spirit, who is a deposit guaranteeing MY inheritance until the redemption of those who are God's possession” [Eph 1:13-14 NIV] all because “He who began a good work in ME will carry it on to completion”. [Phl 1:6 NIV]

 

[Andrew]

YOU can get YOUR NAME added and blotted out ...

... but I have been “marked in him with a seal, the promised Holy Spirit, who is a deposit guaranteeing MY inheritance until the redemption of those who are God's possession” [Eph 1:13-14 NIV] all because “He who began a good work in ME will carry it on to completion”. [Phl 1:6 NIV]

Grieve not the Holy Spirit wherein you are sealed until the final day of Judgment.

 

[MoreCoffee]

Where does our faith come from? Our faith comes from HEARING the word, see Romans 10:17. From hearing the word and being TAUGHT, Colossians 1:5, 7. From continuing in what we have been CONVINCED of, see 2 Timothy 3:14, and being PERSUADED, 2 Corinthians 5:11.

At some point the hearing changes to believing what is heard.

 

[YourTruthGod]

YOU can get YOUR NAME added and blotted out ...

... but I have been “marked in him with a seal, the promised Holy Spirit, who is a deposit guaranteeing MY inheritance until the redemption of those who are God's possession” [Eph 1:13-14 NIV] all because “He who began a good work in ME will carry it on to completion”. [Phl 1:6 NIV]

It can be a dreadful thing to fall into God's hands.

See Hebrews 10:31 and see if you put yourself in God's hands to be punished.

 

[YourTruthGod]

At some point the hearing changes to believing what is heard.

I would say at some point, if one heard the right gospel, the next thing would be to obey what they heard.

 

[MoreCoffee]

I would say at some point, if one heard the right gospel, the next thing would be to obey what they heard.

I do not think people obey things that they do not believe or at the very least are willing to test to see if they are true. If they do not believe what they hear and are not willing to put it to the test they are likely to ignore it or mock it. Many people hear the gospel and mock it. People mock many things that they do not believe to be true.

 

[YourTruthGod]

I do not think people obey things that they do not believe or at the very least are willing to test to see if they are true.

Your church baptizes infants. So tell me how the infant can obey and believe.

I they do not believe what they hear and are not willing to put it to the test they are likely to ignore it or mock it. Many people hear the gospel and mock it. People mock many things that they do not believe to be true.

Don't you see that if you believe what you just said to me...which is true...that you could not stay in a denomination that teaches to baptize infants?

 

[MoreCoffee]

Your church baptizes infants. So tell me how the infant can obey and believe.

The facts demonstrate that the majority of infants baptised who live into years of responsibility do in fact believe and bear witness to their faith in Jesus Christ. It is also true that in teen years many abandon their beliefs. Some return to faith later in adulthood when they have children of their own or when they reconsider the rebelliousness of their youth.

Don't you see that if you believe what you just said to me...which is true...that you could not stay in a denomination that teaches to baptize infants?

On the contrary I see daily children who are of age professing Christ and every year I see dozens upon dozens professing their faith in Jesus Christ in public in Church before witnesses.