Josiah said:
I see your point, Pops....
But Pops.... since it's true that ALL sin (the Bible says that).... and since it's true all are accountable for such (Bible says that, death PROVES it) ... well, I just wonder ..... maybe God would provide a way for the faithful to bring their children under God's grace, mercy and forgiveness?????? (those are question marks, not exclamation marks)... a bit like the blood on the doorposts of the homes in the Plagues????? Parents bringing their children under God's grace and mercy?
There MUST be SOME reason why Jesus and the Apostles and the NT puts SO much emphasis on baptism (and surely that's NOT because it can do nothing, God can't use it for anything, it's just a waste of time)..... There must be SOME reason why Christians at least by 63 AD (when most of the Apostles were still alive) were baptizing infants, why whole HOUSEHOLDS were baptized, why for over 1500 years, ALL Christians EVERYWHERE baptized children ( until one German man in 1523 suddenly "saw" all those Bible verses that state, "THOU CANST NOT DO THAT!") And while I can't answer that question, I suspect the answer is not, "Cuz Baptism can't do nothing." I ain't saying anything dogmatic, just wondering ....
.
All I am saying is that GOD is merciful and full of grace regardless of if an infant is baptised or not.
Understood....
Of course, God could just be merciful to all without the Cross.
Of course, God could just be merciful to all without the Bible or evangelism or mission work or preaching.
Of course, God could just save everyone, just by declaring it so.
God could have protected the Hebrews in the Exodus without that snake on a pole...
God could have protected the children of the faithful in the last plague without any sacrificed lamb or blood on the doorpost....
See my point, Pops?
But what we see (over and over and over, is that God's mercy tends to use means, tools.... such as teaching/preaching, the snake on a pole, that blood on the doorpost, that old rugged Cross. You are absolutely right, He doesn't HAVE to (I never tell God what He can and can't do), after all He gave John the Baptist faith before he was even born, while he was still in the womb (easy for God!). But that doesn't seem to be how His mercy generally works.
I simply raised a POSSIBILITY..... as God cared about the Hebrews threated by snakes.... as God cared about the Hebrews threatened by the angel of death.... by a pole with a snake on it and by blood on the doorpost of their houses.... so perhaps God also has provided a way for the faithful to protect their children?????
All men are guilty of sin. Show me one verse that says a single literal child is guilty of sin from any book.
"For all have sinned." (that comes from a book called the Bible). It doesn't say, "for all over the age of X have sinned but never those under that age."
And of course, it also says "the result of sin is death." And "for all have sinned, therefore for all have died." (That too comes from a book called the Bible). If children die, we have physical proof that they have sinned and that God has held them accountable for that.
Yeah, you could ASK how does God's mercy 'fit' with that since a little child can't intellectually comprehend the Gospel, can't chant the Sinner's Prayer and can't give public proof of their choosing Jesus as the personal Savior?" Well, I can't answer that question, but it makes me wonder if God has provided something kinda like He did when He sent the Angel of Death throughout the land of Egypt, on ALL first born males? Something that would mean God's wrath would pass over them and instead mercy fall upon them????? Just a question.
You are unwittingly limiting the grace and mercy of GOD to the physical capacities of man.
No. I don't limit God AT ALL. I don't tell God "you CANNOT use teaching and baptizing for anything cuz you just lack that ability!"
Yes, God could just snap His finger and all are saved. He didn't have to use physical things like a Savior, the Cross, the Tomb.... things like preaching and teaching. God didn't need to use a pole when those snakes came into the camp, He didn't have to use the blood of a lamb to save the firstborn males of the faithful. I'M not the one telling God what He can and can't do. But He did use physical things.... always to extend His mercy and grace.
that children learn sin and it is not naturally initially a part of them, but a learned behavior that sticks to them slowly or speedily molding their conscience away from good and very often searing it completely?
A child learns sin; period.
I think that's a flat out contradiction of the Bible. And as a dad myself, I'm guessing you've never had any kids, lol.....
But friend, this thread is not about original sin. There are other threads on that topic. The issue here is not whether children are morally perfect as God is, as holy as God is (and thus never die and thus the Bible is wrong when it says ALL have sin), no, the issue is whether God's unconditional love also embraces children or whether we should assume that it does not.
- Josiah
.
