Water Baptism

YourTruthGod

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Pouring and sprinkling are not how it was done, no such teaching in the Bible. If you want to get particular about it, a person would be baptized and fully immersed while there was flowing water to symbolically wash their sins ‘away.’

However, the Ethiopian, when wanting to be baptized, saw some water, probably well water-drinking water, and not flowing water, because of where they were on the road to Gaza was in the desert. Philip still baptized him in that water.

Acts 8:26 Now an angel of the Lord said to Philip, “Go south to the road–the desert road–that goes down from Jerusalem to Gaza.”
Acts 8:36 As they traveled along the road, they came to some water and the eunuch said, “Look, here is water. What can stand in the way of my being baptized?”

As for Catholics and other denominations such as the ones Calvinists belong who do infant baptisms, we know this is not scriptural, since baptism in water is for the remission of sins. One must voluntarily want to be saved, confess, and repent of sins; and babies cannot do that.

John the baptizer prepared the way for Jesus. He came preaching a baptism of repentance for the forgiveness of sins (Luke 1:76-80).
We are still to confess that we are sinners, and to repent, to prepare the way for Jesus Christ to live in our heart.

Acts 20:21 I have declared to both Jews and Greeks that they must turn to God in repentance and have faith in our Lord Jesus.
Acts 26:20 First to those in Damascus, then to those in Jerusalem and in all Judea, and to the Gentiles also, I preached that they should repent and turn to God and prove their repentance by their deeds.

The Bible tells us before people were baptized-they repented.

Acts 2:38 Peter replied, “Repent and be baptized, every one of you, in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins. And you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.
Mark 1:5 The whole Judean countryside and all the people of Jerusalem went out to him. Confessing their sins, they were baptized by him in the Jordan River.
Acts 19:18 Many of those who believed now came and openly confessed what they had done.

Christians are to be water baptized, even after having received the Holy Spirit.

Acts 10:47 Then Peter said, “Can anyone keep these people from being baptized with water? They have received the Holy Spirit just as we have.”

Baptism represents how a believer equates his life with Christ’s death, burial, and resurrection. Our old person is to die to the sins of the world and be buried with Jesus through baptism into death. We are buried with the water, and raised out of the water, raised to live a new life through Jesus.

Picture how baptism looks…the believer comes to make the pledge to God, to die to the sins of the world; so now standing in the water the believer falls back, as if dead; then, the believer goes under the water, buried; then, the believer rises up out of the water, raises up to live a new life.

Romans explain this perfectly.
Romans 6:4 We were therefore buried with him through baptism into death in order that, just as Christ was raised from the dead through the glory of the Father, we too may live a new life.

Water baptism is when the person makes a promise of a good conscience to God in a ceremonial type of way. The person has already made the conscientious acknowledgement to God to stop sinning, but now follows through with obeying God by getting water baptized, by doing the ceremonial act of the promise.

Water baptism is a symbol of what has already happened in one’s heart. See 1 Peter 3:21 and this water symbolizes baptism that now saves you also—not the removal of dirt from the body but the pledge of a clear conscience toward God. It saves you by the resurrection of Jesus Christ,

Infants cannot make a promise, and children are not not required. The infant’s parents can make a promise for their child, nor can anyone make a promise for anyone else.

The kingdom of heaven already belongs to little children such as the ones brought to Jesus; children taught about God.

Matthew 19:14 Jesus said, “Let the little children come to me, and do not hinder them, for the kingdom of heaven belongs to such as these.” 15When he had placed his hands on them, he went on from there.
Matthew 18:3 And he said: “Truly I tell you, unless you change and become like little children, you will never enter the kingdom of heaven.
John 9:41 Jesus said, “If you were blind, you would not be guilty of sin; but now that you claim you can see, your guilt remains.

Infant baptism interferes with people knowing and obeying the Truth. Infant baptism confuses non-Christians and those who want to be a Christian.
Many people baptized as an infant do not understand why they do not really know the Lord. Those baptized as infants do not usually walk the path that Jesus teaches. Infant baptism has been confusing millions of people for years. It is more serious of an issue that most even realize.

Nowadays a person privately confesses to Jesus and repents of their sins before Jesus saves them, then, later or at the same time be baptized in water. Jesus can give the Holy Spirit before, during, or after the water baptism, as shown in the scriptures. I believe you can have someone you know help lower you in the water and help you come back up out of the water. I would not join a denomination to have this done, knowing what I know now. I would even baptize myself if I knew no one to baptize me. I would baptize myself in any body of water I had access to, even my bathtub in my home, as has been done in the Bible times. It is a ceremony where you promise to God. It makes a difference like saying things aloud makes a difference sometimes.
 

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Pouring and sprinkling are not how it was done, no such teaching in the Bible. If you want to get particular about it, a person would be baptized and fully immersed while there was flowing water to symbolically wash their sins ‘away.’

However, the Ethiopian, when wanting to be baptized, saw some water, probably well water-drinking water, and not flowing water, because of where they were on the road to Gaza was in the desert. Philip still baptized him in that water.

Acts 8:26 Now an angel of the Lord said to Philip, “Go south to the road–the desert road–that goes down from Jerusalem to Gaza.”
Acts 8:36 As they traveled along the road, they came to some water and the eunuch said, “Look, here is water. What can stand in the way of my being baptized?”

As for Catholics and other denominations such as the ones Calvinists belong who do infant baptisms, we know this is not scriptural, since baptism in water is for the remission of sins. One must voluntarily want to be saved, confess, and repent of sins; and babies cannot do that.

John the baptizer prepared the way for Jesus. He came preaching a baptism of repentance for the forgiveness of sins (Luke 1:76-80).
We are still to confess that we are sinners, and to repent, to prepare the way for Jesus Christ to live in our heart.

Acts 20:21 I have declared to both Jews and Greeks that they must turn to God in repentance and have faith in our Lord Jesus.
Acts 26:20 First to those in Damascus, then to those in Jerusalem and in all Judea, and to the Gentiles also, I preached that they should repent and turn to God and prove their repentance by their deeds.

The Bible tells us before people were baptized-they repented.

Acts 2:38 Peter replied, “Repent and be baptized, every one of you, in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins. And you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.
Mark 1:5 The whole Judean countryside and all the people of Jerusalem went out to him. Confessing their sins, they were baptized by him in the Jordan River.
Acts 19:18 Many of those who believed now came and openly confessed what they had done.

Christians are to be water baptized, even after having received the Holy Spirit.

Acts 10:47 Then Peter said, “Can anyone keep these people from being baptized with water? They have received the Holy Spirit just as we have.”

Baptism represents how a believer equates his life with Christ’s death, burial, and resurrection. Our old person is to die to the sins of the world and be buried with Jesus through baptism into death. We are buried with the water, and raised out of the water, raised to live a new life through Jesus.

Picture how baptism looks…the believer comes to make the pledge to God, to die to the sins of the world; so now standing in the water the believer falls back, as if dead; then, the believer goes under the water, buried; then, the believer rises up out of the water, raises up to live a new life.

Romans explain this perfectly.
Romans 6:4 We were therefore buried with him through baptism into death in order that, just as Christ was raised from the dead through the glory of the Father, we too may live a new life.

Water baptism is when the person makes a promise of a good conscience to God in a ceremonial type of way. The person has already made the conscientious acknowledgement to God to stop sinning, but now follows through with obeying God by getting water baptized, by doing the ceremonial act of the promise.

Water baptism is a symbol of what has already happened in one’s heart. See 1 Peter 3:21 and this water symbolizes baptism that now saves you also—not the removal of dirt from the body but the pledge of a clear conscience toward God. It saves you by the resurrection of Jesus Christ,

Infants cannot make a promise, and children are not not required. The infant’s parents can make a promise for their child, nor can anyone make a promise for anyone else.

The kingdom of heaven already belongs to little children such as the ones brought to Jesus; children taught about God.

Matthew 19:14 Jesus said, “Let the little children come to me, and do not hinder them, for the kingdom of heaven belongs to such as these.” 15When he had placed his hands on them, he went on from there.
Matthew 18:3 And he said: “Truly I tell you, unless you change and become like little children, you will never enter the kingdom of heaven.
John 9:41 Jesus said, “If you were blind, you would not be guilty of sin; but now that you claim you can see, your guilt remains.

Infant baptism interferes with people knowing and obeying the Truth. Infant baptism confuses non-Christians and those who want to be a Christian.
Many people baptized as an infant do not understand why they do not really know the Lord. Those baptized as infants do not usually walk the path that Jesus teaches. Infant baptism has been confusing millions of people for years. It is more serious of an issue that most even realize.

Nowadays a person privately confesses to Jesus and repents of their sins before Jesus saves them, then, later or at the same time be baptized in water. Jesus can give the Holy Spirit before, during, or after the water baptism, as shown in the scriptures. I believe you can have someone you know help lower you in the water and help you come back up out of the water. I would not join a denomination to have this done, knowing what I know now. I would even baptize myself if I knew no one to baptize me. I would baptize myself in any body of water I had access to, even my bathtub in my home, as has been done in the Bible times. It is a ceremony where you promise to God. It makes a difference like saying things aloud makes a difference sometimes.
Jesus was baptised with water because it was a custom for Jews who ever wished of becoming a high priest, even the scribes had to fully bathe themselves before writing down the name of God. Jesus preached that we get baptised in the Name of THE one and only high priest!
Water is available, we need water to live, so 'symbolically' I find no harm in using actual water, water refreshes us and imo there is no reason to object to this practise.
I was baptised a child and I'm convinced that as a child with no understanding whatsoever (a born unbeliever) it did not heed my salvation, for my parents "hope-sake" it comforted them, but all you need is a believer in the Holy Spirit to baptise another coming into the Faith... If anyone came to me and said "I want to be baptised", even though that Faith HAS saved them, I would not hesitate to perform the ritual. Even though I was baptised by 'water' as an infant, I after becoming a believer wanted to be baptised again, and so I had two rituals of water baptism but only the second one was 'refreshing' to me because it IS symbolic of the actual baptism the Spirit gave to me, I relate the ritual to 'coming into fellowship' with not only Christ but with my brothers and sisters in faith. Jesus says "baptise" and so again, I find no reason to object water baptism... I am actually glad that we don't have to be physically baptised in FIRE!
So I find that baptism of fire and water is actually the believers baptism of the Holy Spirit and Repentance by the Spirits conviction (fire/truth) but that's what I understand personally, I am sure many people might not agree but oh well lol
 

MoreCoffee

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For Christians there is one baptism and it is with water. God told me that, he said there is one body and one Spirit: to this you have been called by the one hope of your calling: one Lord, one faith, one baptism, one God and Father of all, who is over all, and through all, and in us all. Yet to each one of us there has been given grace according to the measure allotted by Christ. The Lord also said to me that unless one has been reborn by water and the Holy Spirit, he is not able to enter into the kingdom of God. That is what baptism is, it is being born from above by means of water and the Spirit. It is one baptism given by Jesus Christ to the faithful.
 

YourTruthGod

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Jesus was baptised with water because it was a custom for Jews who ever wished of becoming a high priest, even the scribes had to fully bathe themselves before writing down the name of God. Jesus preached that we get baptised in the Name of THE one and only high priest!
Water is available, we need water to live, so 'symbolically' I find no harm in using actual water, water refreshes us and imo there is no reason to object to this practise.
I was baptised a child and I'm convinced that as a child with no understanding whatsoever (a born unbeliever) it did not heed my salvation, for my parents "hope-sake" it comforted them, but all you need is a believer in the Holy Spirit to baptise another coming into the Faith... If anyone came to me and said "I want to be baptised", even though that Faith HAS saved them, I would not hesitate to perform the ritual. Even though I was baptised by 'water' as an infant, I after becoming a believer wanted to be baptised again, and so I had two rituals of water baptism but only the second one was 'refreshing' to me because it IS symbolic of the actual baptism the Spirit gave to me, I relate the ritual to 'coming into fellowship' with not only Christ but with my brothers and sisters in faith. Jesus says "baptise" and so again, I find no reason to object water baptism... I am actually glad that we don't have to be physically baptised in FIRE!
So I find that baptism of fire and water is actually the believers baptism of the Holy Spirit and Repentance by the Spirits conviction (fire/truth) but that's what I understand personally, I am sure many people might not agree but oh well lol

I was baptized as an infant, and then after I left the Catholic church I was baptized in another denomination. After I was saved, I wanted to get baptized again, and did.

My beliefs about the fire baptism is different.

I believe John is speaking about the fire those NOT saved will experience.

Immediately after John tells us about Jesus baptizing with fire---he speaks of those not saved being put in the lake of fire.


Matthew 3:12 His winnowing fork is in his hand, and he will clear his threshing floor, gathering his wheat into the barn and burning up the chaff with unquenchable fire."
 

YourTruthGod

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For Christians there is one baptism and it is with water. God told me that, he said there is one body and one Spirit: to this you have been called by the one hope of your calling: one Lord, one faith, one baptism, one God and Father of all, who is over all, and through all, and in us all. Yet to each one of us there has been given grace according to the measure allotted by Christ. The Lord also said to me that unless one has been reborn by water and the Holy Spirit, he is not able to enter into the kingdom of God. That is what baptism is, it is being born from above by means of water and the Spirit. It is one baptism given by Jesus Christ to the faithful.

My parents died as Catholics and there is no way I would believe that they are not with Jesus now. However, it is important what we believe as God's Truth and many people nowadays will probably be held more accountable.
 

MoreCoffee

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The one baptism that I received and value was received when I was very young, too young to remember the event. It was conducted in a Lutheran church by a pastor surnamed Petersen (or maybe Peterson) which is a fitting name for a pastor who administers baptism according to the example set in the Catholic Church which is the Church that Jesus Christ founded and over which he appointed saint Peter as the first pope and whose successors govern in the Catholic Church to this day. I do not desire any more baptisms with water and since for Christians there is one baptism rather than many baptisms I am pleased to have received one baptism in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit.
 

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I was baptized as an infant, and then after I left the Catholic church I was baptized in another denomination. After I was saved, I wanted to get baptized again, and did.

My beliefs about the fire baptism is different.

I believe John is speaking about the fire those NOT saved will experience.

Immediately after John tells us about Jesus baptizing with fire---he speaks of those not saved being put in the lake of fire.


Matthew 3:12 His winnowing fork is in his hand, and he will clear his threshing floor, gathering his wheat into the barn and burning up the chaff with unquenchable fire."
Why then are we told of Jesus baptising us in the Holy Spirit and fire?
The "fire" to me is the 'desire' to walk with God through obstacles and temptations of the world and to learn conviction and correctness... we repent of "missing the mark" to begin with, but the fire is symbolic of becoming triumphant through out our tribulations, which in this world we will have.
 

YourTruthGod

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Why then are we told of Jesus baptising us in the Holy Spirit and fire?
The "fire" to me is the 'desire' to walk with God through obstacles and temptations of the world and to learn conviction and correctness... we repent of "missing the mark" to begin with, but the fire is symbolic of becoming triumphant through out our tribulations, which in this world we will have.

Well, those who reject Jesus will be baptized with fire at the end.
 

MoreCoffee

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Jesus told me that unless one has been reborn by water and the Holy Spirit, he is not able to enter into the kingdom of God and thus he indicates that baptism with water and the Spirit is baptism with the Spirit and water it is one baptism as the holy scriptures say there is one Lord, one faith, one baptism, one God and Father of all. Best not complicate the matter by inventing additional baptisms.
 

YourTruthGod

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Jesus told me that unless one has been reborn by water and the Holy Spirit, he is not able to enter into the kingdom of God and thus he indicates that baptism with water and the Spirit is baptism with the Spirit and water it is one baptism as the holy scriptures say there is one Lord, one faith, one baptism, one God and Father of all. Best not complicate the matter by inventing additional baptisms.

So you really believe that Catholic infants received the Holy Spirit at that time?
 

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Well, those who reject Jesus will be baptized with fire at the end.
As far as I know, and I have posted threads here about fire baptism, no body actually knows... so I go with my gut from what scripture has revealed to me in the Spirit, fire = desire and endurance through life's tribulations as a believer
 

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So you really believe that Catholic infants received the Holy Spirit at that time?

Amen, God said it and I believe it. Jesus said unless one has been reborn by water and the Holy Spirit, he is not able to enter into the kingdom of God.
 

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Amen, God said it and I believe it. Jesus said unless one has been reborn by water and the Holy Spirit, he is not able to enter into the kingdom of God.
Hitler was baptised the same year he was born :/
 

YourTruthGod

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As far as I know, and I have posted threads here about fire baptism, no body actually knows... so I go with my gut from what scripture has revealed to me in the Spirit, fire = desire and endurance through life's tribulations as a believer

I think I see exactly why you believe it to be like that, and in way I do too. Are you thinking like God being a refiner's fire?

As for the baptism with fire in Matthew 3, it sounds more like the fire that will consume His enemies:

John is speaking about the fire those NOT saved will experience.

Immediately after John tells us about Jesus baptizing with fire---he speaks of those not saved being put in the lake of fire.


Matthew 3:7 But when he saw many of the Pharisees and Sadducees coming to where he was baptizing, he said to them: “You brood of vipers! Who warned you to flee from the coming wrath? 8 Produce fruit in keeping with repentance. 9 And do not think you can say to yourselves, ‘We have Abraham as our father.’ I tell you that out of these stones God can raise up children for Abraham. 10 The ax is already at the root of the trees, and every tree that does not produce good fruit will be cut down and thrown into the fire.

11 “I baptize you with water for repentance. But after me comes one who is more powerful than I, whose sandals I am not worthy to carry. He will baptize you with
the Holy Spirit and fire. 12 His winnowing fork is in his hand, and he will clear his threshing floor, gathering his wheat into the barn and burning up the chaff with unquenchable fire.”
 

YourTruthGod

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Amen, God said it and I believe it. Jesus said unless one has been reborn by water and the Holy Spirit, he is not able to enter into the kingdom of God.

No infant can repent of sins.
 

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No infant can repent of sins.

Baptism does not require deliberate conscious repentance from an infant and infants cannot deliberately and consciously sin anyway. They are too young to act with deliberate volition in a sinful way.
 

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I think I see exactly why you believe it to be like that, and in way I do too. Are you thinking like God being a refiner's fire?

As for the baptism with fire in Matthew 3, it sounds more like the fire that will consume His enemies:

John is speaking about the fire those NOT saved will experience.

Immediately after John tells us about Jesus baptizing with fire---he speaks of those not saved being put in the lake of fire.


Matthew 3:7 But when he saw many of the Pharisees and Sadducees coming to where he was baptizing, he said to them: “You brood of vipers! Who warned you to flee from the coming wrath? 8 Produce fruit in keeping with repentance. 9 And do not think you can say to yourselves, ‘We have Abraham as our father.’ I tell you that out of these stones God can raise up children for Abraham. 10 The ax is already at the root of the trees, and every tree that does not produce good fruit will be cut down and thrown into the fire.

11 “I baptize you with water for repentance. But after me comes one who is more powerful than I, whose sandals I am not worthy to carry. He will baptize you with
the Holy Spirit and fire. 12 His winnowing fork is in his hand, and he will clear his threshing floor, gathering his wheat into the barn and burning up the chaff with unquenchable fire.”
I think of it as 'Truth' trampling over and burning away all lies that come in it's path... definitely a refining and correction process, like conviction of the heart, just a hunch, sadly if it's a non capitalised word in the KJV people wont discuss it, the word "fire" is in lower case so we all kind of shrug our shoulders to it.
 

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For Christians there is one baptism and it is with water. God told me that, he said there is one body and one Spirit: to this you have been called by the one hope of your calling: one Lord, one faith, one baptism, one God and Father of all, who is over all, and through all, and in us all. Yet to each one of us there has been given grace according to the measure allotted by Christ. The Lord also said to me that unless one has been reborn by water and the Holy Spirit, he is not able to enter into the kingdom of God. That is what baptism is, it is being born from above by means of water and the Spirit. It is one baptism given by Jesus Christ to the faithful.

Jesus told me that unless one has been reborn by water and the Holy Spirit, he is not able to enter into the kingdom of God and thus he indicates that baptism with water and the Spirit is baptism with the Spirit and water it is one baptism as the holy scriptures say there is one Lord, one faith, one baptism, one God and Father of all. Best not complicate the matter by inventing additional baptisms.

You are repeating yourself.


[Eph 4:4-6 NASB] 4 [There is] one body and one Spirit, just as also you were called in one hope of your calling; 5 one Lord, one faith, one baptism, 6 one God and Father of all who is over all and through all and in all.

Was the baby called?
Does the baby have faith?
You are ASSUMING much when you baptize infants.

“Baptism” in Eph 4:5 is (βάπτισμα), the Nominative Neuter Singular form of G908 (baptisma).
βάπτισμα báptisma, bap'-tis-mah; from G907; baptism (technically or figuratively)

G907
βαπτίζω baptízō, bap-tid'-zo; from a derivative of G911; to immerse, submerge; to make whelmed (i.e. fully wet)
1. properly, to dip repeatedly, to immerge, submerge (of vessels sunk, Polybius 1, 51, 6; 8, 8, 4; of animals, Diodorus 1, 36).
2. to cleanse by dipping or submerging, to wash, to make clean with water; in the middle and the 1 aorist passive to wash oneself, bathe; so Mark 7:4 [where WH text ῥαντίσωνται]; Luke 11:38 (2 Kings 5:14 ἐβαπτίσατο ἐν τῷ Ἰορδάνῃ, for טָבַל; Sir. 31:30 (Sir. 34:30); Judith 12:7).

You call it ‘baptism’ but what you do is not what the Apostles wrote (unless you are Eastern Orthodox). A little pour or sprinkle is not one ‘βάπτισμα’.
 

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I think of it as 'Truth' trampling over and burning away all lies that come in it's path... definitely a refining and correction process, like conviction of the heart, just a hunch, sadly if it's a non capitalised word in the KJV people wont discuss it, the word "fire" is in lower case so we all kind of shrug our shoulders to it.

God is a consuming fire, so I just can't accept that those who are saved will be baptized with fire since it is negative in the only place it is mentioned.
 

YourTruthGod

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Baptism does not require deliberate conscious repentance from an infant and infants cannot deliberately and consciously sin anyway. They are too young to act with deliberate volition in a sinful way.

Repentance absolutely does require a deliberate consciousness.
 
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