The Mark of the Beast is Imminent?

[TheThirdAngel144]

Hmm. I see the opposite in Holland. Stores were always closed on sunday because of christian laws. Now ppl are forced to work on sunday. Nice for me to go get groceries if I'm too lazy to get em on friday, but quite antisocial for the ppl who have to work.

No one can force anyone to go on Sunday, in the same way anyone can force anyone not to work on Sunday. The idea that a Christian country would try to force that on someone, which is clearly a religious law, is wrong. The days which one can take off are chosen by themselves. Now, people might take time off, and want to take time off. But it should be up to the business, or individual, whether they want to make that decision which day they want to shut down, vs. when the government comes in and commands everyone else to cease, especially when the law purely has a religious connotation to it.

 

[TheThirdAngel144]

I finally got around to watching the video now that there's a proper link.

While I wouldn't put it past the RCC to assert some authority in the West by working with governments to institute Sunday laws, the idea that it is imminent isn't even close to being justified just because various groups are pushing for it in some way or another. That is the main push of the video, "Sunday laws are just around the corner, because look at group X,Y and Z who are in favor of them!" As a sort of weak nod to Revelation, it's just thrown in that all countries around the world will just adopt them also. With a lot less citing of groups for these latter regions.

I like some Adventist teaching, but this is cherry picking Revelation and trying to force an interpretation that is just not happening, not in the West, and certainly not in other parts of the world like the Muslim world or Hindu or elsewhere where Christianity is not the popular religion.

Besides all of this...I feel my points in my first post on this thread still stand.

God has to single out a single generation for this test, leaving all others out *by the going theory
Any practical implementation *by the going theory is going to leave out isolated groups or individuals all over the world (so as to nullify applying to "all men" as Revelation states)

*The going theory as for "buying and selling" being some sort of credit/debit and/or electronic trade mechanism that will have to, according to Revelation, be applied to "all men" (usually thought of as being in the future and of course just for the generation in which it happens, making God favor all previous ones). If one wants to get technical, any trade that involves buying or selling need not include any kind of currency at all, electronic, paper, gold/silver etc. If I have a bag of corn and want to trade it for a bag of wheat, and the wheat holder agrees, well, I've just "bought" the wheat with my corn, and he has just "sold" it.

Viola. No super smart computers, electronics, even electricity or just simply paper money need be involved. If that can happen, this nullifies the strong and exclusive language of Revelation IF the 'mark' is some sort of physical mechanism to facilitate trade or some sort of public acknowledgement of other gods, a physical idol etc.


For those who may be unaware, the similarity between the 4th beast of Daniel 7 and the Beast of Revelation means this beast power has been around for a very long time.

I think the idea that it is a lot closer than people realize, is totally correct. No man knows the day or the hour, but the enforcement of Sunday Laws looks very near. That which people declared would be asinine is proven to be something within our tangible future. The more people know about this, the harder these people are going to push forward, because they're caught. It's not just that groups are in favor of them, groups are actively pushing for them. The issue is being concealed, because to be very frank and open about this would be to declare every warning that people have been saying about these laws are right. I guarantee you, the louder the truth gets, and the more the blatant connections between the RCC and Protestantism working towards Sunday Laws are exposed, will casue them to the faster they are going to work to shut us up.

The idea that it other countries will not fall in line, is false when you have 175 nations that sign onto the Paris Climate Agreement, that was literally inspired by Pope Francis himself. His principles were embedded into the prologue of the Paris Agreement. More nations than you think are absolutely on board with this. But it is because this religious law is presented as a solution for climate change, which is something all around agree with.

Another thing, when Satan shows up, and starts declaring that he is Jesus, and easily calls for Sunday Laws, people will fall for this in droves. This is the strong, almost overmastering delusion. This is why it's important now to take part in studying the Scriptures, and looking at the connections that Scriptures have made to our current times.

 

[TheThirdAngel144]

Of course it is, but the trend at the moment is ever-more pressure on stores to open on Sunday rather than any government pressure to close. If anything protections put in place when Sunday trading laws were relaxed are being eroded. It's quite a bold move for a retail business to close their doors on Sunday these days.

Strongly disagree. I swing from one message board to another, and I had received possibly major backlash for suggesting that Protestant America should not fall for this trap. They think that an entire nation "turning to God" is okay in the sense of Sunday Laws, while declaring the truth the Scriptures declare to be of Satan. There is a reason that Poland is being uplifted before people in America, and are finding an alliance in themselves and Poland. And Poland literally just decided recently to phase out Sunday shopping by 2020. Things are getting incredibly serious right now. It is important that we study these truths for ourselves, and take a look into what the Bible says about God's Sabbath, and the incoming Sunday Laws.

 

[TheThirdAngel144]

I disagree. I believe Monster Energy is the mark of the beast, you have it in your right hand and when you drink it the cross (in 'o') turns upside down. Im glad I only drink Red Bull so I dont go to hell.

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I think Monster is a bad product, but to take something like this drink to be the mark of the beast, is incorrect. God's word from Genesis to Revelation deals with man's transgression against God's law, whose law goes into your hands and forehead. When God's law explicitely declares to keep the 7th day, and people choose the first day, notwithstanding all the warnings in God's Word, and choose the Sunday Laws, then they will have chosen the mark of the beast, and will be cut off from God for all eternity.

 

[Andrew]

I think Monster is a bad product, but to take something like this drink to be the mark of the beast, is incorrect. God's word from Genesis to Revelation deals with man's transgression against God's law, whose law goes into your hands and forehead. When God's law explicitely declares to keep the 7th day, and people choose the first day, notwithstanding all the warnings in God's Word, and choose the Sunday Laws, then they will have chosen the mark of the beast, and will be cut off from God for all eternity.

Amen brother, the forehead is the mind (thinking) and the hands are the works(doing)! God marks us too, dont forget he marks our foreheads, and the works are HIS will not ours. At least that's how I see it. The whole Monster drink thing was a joke yet many people obsess over such nonsense to try and excuse themselves away from the simple issue.
We all fall unaware, but Christ wakes us up from the sleep. Be marked by God! Have God on your mind 24/7 and your works will be Good in HIS favor. God bless



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[Lamb]

I think Monster is a bad product, but to take something like this drink to be the mark of the beast, is incorrect. God's word from Genesis to Revelation deals with man's transgression against God's law, whose law goes into your hands and forehead. When God's law explicitely declares to keep the 7th day, and people choose the first day, notwithstanding all the warnings in God's Word, and choose the Sunday Laws, then they will have chosen the mark of the beast, and will be cut off from God for all eternity.

Stravinsk brought up a good point once before on this site about the calendar and HOW do you know you're actually on a Saturday instead of maybe a Friday or Monday because the calendars aren't the same as in ancient days. Are you sure you're doing it right?

 

[tango]

Strongly disagree. I swing from one message board to another, and I had received possibly major backlash for suggesting that Protestant America should not fall for this trap. They think that an entire nation "turning to God" is okay in the sense of Sunday Laws, while declaring the truth the Scriptures declare to be of Satan. There is a reason that Poland is being uplifted before people in America, and are finding an alliance in themselves and Poland. And Poland literally just decided recently to phase out Sunday shopping by 2020. Things are getting incredibly serious right now. It is important that we study these truths for ourselves, and take a look into what the Bible says about God's Sabbath, and the incoming Sunday Laws.

Seriously? You think businesses are suddenly going to be forced to shut down on Sunday? Try getting a job in retail if you don't want to work Sundays. Probably going to be tricky, unless you work for the kind of small business that does close and that probably also struggles to compete against the corporate behemoths.

I'm not sure what Poland deciding to phase out Sunday shopping has to do with the rest of the world. It wasn't that long ago that stores opening on Sunday in England was a big deal, paired with grand promises from politicians that Christians who worked for the stores would never be forced to work on a Sunday. From what I can tell that promise turned to be worth, well, about the same as any other promise from a politician.

Even if governments across the globe ban Sunday shopping, it's still not clear what that has to do with the mark of the beast. How does the prohibition from buying and selling apply if all that has happened is that stores are closed on Sundays?

One of my preferred diners decided to close on Sundays to allow their staff to spend time with their families and to attend church if they so chose - in an age when there's a constant push to open for longer hours on more days regardless of the imposition on staff it was a bold move. The bar literally next door to them continues to open on Sundays so I have no idea whether the Sunday trade they decided they don't want will turn out to be nothing more than losing Sunday trade, or whether they will lose more business as people get used to going elsewhere.

Bottom line, I'm still not buying the idea that the behemoths will be closing on Sunday any time soon and even if they do it's not clear what that has to do with the mysterious mark.

 

[tango]

I think Monster is a bad product, but to take something like this drink to be the mark of the beast, is incorrect. God's word from Genesis to Revelation deals with man's transgression against God's law, whose law goes into your hands and forehead. When God's law explicitely declares to keep the 7th day, and people choose the first day, notwithstanding all the warnings in God's Word, and choose the Sunday Laws, then they will have chosen the mark of the beast, and will be cut off from God for all eternity.

If I recall some guy who said he was God said something about the Sabbath being made for man, not man for the Sabbath. I wonder if he was onto something.

 

[Imalive]

Did you know that the Mark of the Beast is being promoted as the solution to problems in our world? Even to Christians, the mark of the beast might seem like a good idea! It is being promoted to solve problems of climate change, to bringing families together more, for regulation in working and resting hours, to cause people to consume less material things, and even to fight against communism! What is this mark they are promoting? It is something that Christians accept, that is not Biblical at all! They are promoting world-wide SUNday Sabbath Laws!

Yep. It's happening in Amsterdam. The goodness how do you call that from the State reformed party wants ppl in Amsterdam to be free to close their shop on sunday if they want to, cause now they have to open it. Because they find it very important that ppl can have sunday as a rest day. She is one of the first women from that party btw. First it was forbidden for women to do anything in politics in that party, but theyre modernizing.

https://www.telegraaf.nl/video/1535493/sgp-wil-koopzondagen-amsterdam-aanpakken

 

[Imalive]

No one can force anyone to go on Sunday, in the same way anyone can force anyone not to work on Sunday. The idea that a Christian country would try to force that on someone, which is clearly a religious law, is wrong. The days which one can take off are chosen by themselves. Now, people might take time off, and want to take time off. But it should be up to the business, or individual, whether they want to make that decision which day they want to shut down, vs. when the government comes in and commands everyone else to cease, especially when the law purely has a religious connotation to it.

They were forced to close and now theyre forced to open.

 

[Andrew]

I thought Sabbath meant 'day of rest'... isn't Jesus Christ our sabbath? At least that's what I get out of it, he worked on the Sabbath so obviously he was showing that he was the fulfillment.
I suppose an imposed day of worship is what's being suggested by sunday law, I personally believe that Muslims are stuck in OT type laws, cutting off limbs for stealing and such (type laws, capital punishment) God didn't really go into detail about "not working" on Sabbath days anyway, that was OT Jewish law, similar to Roman law later on "long hair is shameful". However I doubt Jesus attended a roman hair stylist once a month.

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[tango]

They were forced to close and now theyre forced to open.

Forced to open? As in, if you open a retail shop you are not legally allowed to be closed on Sundays? Wow... I'd have thought it would be up to the owners to decide when they are open.

The Dutch government would love B&H Photography. It's a huge photo/video/computer/electronics store in Manhatten. It's run by observant Jews so they not only close for the Sabbath but they also close for every single Jewish festival. When they are closed they won't even take online orders - I forget whether the site lets you place the order but doesn't acknowledge it until they reopen, or if they won't even take an online order. But they are big enough, and their prices are good enough, that people accept it. I strongly suspect that if Burger King closed on Sundays people would just go to McDonalds and be done with it.

 

[tango]

I thought Sabbath meant 'day of rest'... isn't Jesus Christ our sabbath? At least that's what I get out of it, he worked on the Sabbath so obviously he was showing that he was the fulfillment.
I suppose an imposed day of worship is what's being suggested by sunday law, I personally believe that Muslims are stuck in OT type laws, cutting off limbs for stealing and such (type laws, capital punishment) God didn't really go into detail about "not working" on Sabbath days anyway, that was OT Jewish law, similar to Roman law later on "long hair is shameful". However I doubt Jesus attended a roman hair stylist once a month.

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Hence the thing about the Sabbath being made for man rather than the other way around. The idea is that we rest one day a week, rather than we exist primarily to honor the Sabbath. I have to say I'm glad that the medical staff weren't rigidly observing Sabbath when I slipped with the wallpaper scraper and cut my wrist on a Friday evening, or I'd have had to wait until sunset the following day to have my stitches.

 

[Imalive]

I thought Sabbath meant 'day of rest'... isn't Jesus Christ our sabbath? At least that's what I get out of it, he worked on the Sabbath so obviously he was showing that he was the fulfillment.
I suppose an imposed day of worship is what's being suggested by sunday law, I personally believe that Muslims are stuck in OT type laws, cutting off limbs for stealing and such (type laws, capital punishment) God didn't really go into detail about "not working" on Sabbath days anyway, that was OT Jewish law, similar to Roman law later on "long hair is shameful". However I doubt Jesus attended a roman hair stylist once a month.

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Yes, in Holland the reformed just replaced the O.T laws w self made laws. I'm on a Dutch reformed forum. One guy gets really upset if you have a Christmas tree. That's heathen and bad. And there are still ppl who dont use the car to church cause thats work but walking isnt work and they dont buy anything or eat somewhere out. It's just like the orthodox Jews I saw in Israel, but then on sunday. Makes no sense whatsoever. And why is driving a car working? I heard from someone its because they used to have a chart w a horse and then you'd let the horse work.

 

[Andrew]

Hence the thing about the Sabbath being made for man rather than the other way around. The idea is that we rest one day a week, rather than we exist primarily to honor the Sabbath. I have to say I'm glad that the medical staff weren't rigidly observing Sabbath when I slipped with the wallpaper scraper and cut my wrist on a Friday evening, or I'd have had to wait until sunset the following day to have my stitches.

Its sad, 3/4ths of mankind direct man away from God and try to drag the rest with them. Makes sense that a few elect keep his word.
America is young and unsettled but I gather that other countries may be affected emotionally by it, but they seem to be more cultured (Christian nations) and have better respect for God than the whole of America (a Christian nation). I mention this because I see a mindless war if this sunday law were to be forced onto Americans, good people here, but the majority of major populated cities are why the election college is in effect, can't trust the legend of crazed mobs deciding the path that causes the whole world to crumble.
Like I said, sabbath Law is just a dream of the Vatican and Christians suppress it, yes its prophesied that a mark be issued out but not to Christians, but the world.


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[Andrew]

Yes, in Holland the reformed just replaced the O.T laws w self made laws. I'm on a Dutch reformed forum. One guy gets really upset if you have a Christmas tree. That's heathen and bad. And there are still ppl who dont use the car to church cause thats work but walking isnt work and they dont buy anything or eat somewhere out. It's just like the orthodox Jews I saw in Israel, but then on sunday. Makes no sense whatsoever. And why is driving a car working? I heard from someone its because they used to have a chart w a horse and then you'd let the horse work.

I thought God said we have control over the use of animals lol you can't ride a horse on sunday?

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[Imalive]

I thought God said we have control over the use of animals lol you can't ride a horse on sunday?

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There was a law that they shouldnt let their animals work either on sabbath I thought. Although, you must milk a cow, I think. In some villages you see a whole bunch of ppl walk to church, women w hats on, cover your hair, and long skirts. No car. That's working. One teen complained on that forum. On sunday after church he wasnt allowed to go fish and his parents just went to bed after the service. They took it very literal.

 

[Andrew]

There was a law that they shouldnt let their animals work either on sabbath I thought. Although, you must milk a cow, I think. In some villages you see a whole bunch of ppl walk to church, women w hats on, cover your hair, and long skirts. No car. That's working. One teen complained on that forum. On sunday after church he wasnt allowed to go fish and his parents just went to bed after the service. They took it very literal.

Right, how can you make it to church without working? I really never understood that, a bundle of sticks?? Could they breathe? Or is that works?

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[Imalive]

Forced to open? As in, if you open a retail shop you are not legally allowed to be closed on Sundays? Wow... I'd have thought it would be up to the owners to decide when they are open.

The Dutch government would love B&H Photography. It's a huge photo/video/computer/electronics store in Manhatten. It's run by observant Jews so they not only close for the Sabbath but they also close for every single Jewish festival. When they are closed they won't even take online orders - I forget whether the site lets you place the order but doesn't acknowledge it until they reopen, or if they won't even take an online order. But they are big enough, and their prices are good enough, that people accept it. I strongly suspect that if Burger King closed on Sundays people would just go to McDonalds and be done with it.

Not everyone is forced to open, but in Amsterdam there are streets where you can only open your shop the rest of the week if you agree with opening it on sunday too.
Shops have all been closed on sunday a long time here.
Now once a month they may open on sunday and in Amsterdam it's now going the other way. Also the times are ruled when you may open your shop. You can't just leave it open after 6, except supermarkets.

 

[tango]

Right, how can you make it to church without working? I really never understood that, a bundle of sticks?? Could they breathe? Or is that works?

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From what I gather from talking to a Jewish friend the key question is whether you complete something on the Sabbath. I guess completing the journey to synagogue is considered acceptable. But, for instance, he won't answer the phone on the Sabbath becauase that would mean completing a phone connection.

As for what the Jews consider to be "working" on the Sabbath it seems very weird to me. From what I gather you can move a sofa but can't pick up a paper clip, for example.