- Joined
- Jun 12, 2015
- Messages
- 13,927
- Gender
- Male
- Religious Affiliation
- Lutheran
- Political Affiliation
- Conservative
- Marital Status
- Married
- Acceptance of the Trinity & Nicene Creed
- Yes
Here was/is THE principle issue: WHO is the Savior?
There really are only two places to look: To the Cross or the mirror.
IF you answer "Jesus" then Jesus is the Savior. Not you - not a bit, not at all, not now, not ever, not in any way or shape or form or manner. Salvation is entirely, wholly wrapped up in Jesus. It's entirely HIS work. HIS heart. HIS love. HIS mercy. HIS gift. HIS blessing. His life, His death, His resurrection. His Cross, His blood, His sacrifice. His righteousness, His obedience, His holiness. Not you. Not yours. If there is salvation, there is one reason: Jesus; one who accomplished this: Jesus; one to thank: Jesus. You may have some other role in some other matter, but not this. The "job" of Savior belongs to Jesus. Not you.
IF you answer "me" then you are the Savior. Not Jesus. Not a bit, not at all. Not now, not ever. Not in any way, shape or form or manner. Salvation is all wrapped up in YOU. YOUR works. YOUR will. YOUR love. YOUR efforts. YOUR merits. YOUR obedience. YOUR righteousness. YOUR holiness. YOUR sacrifice. YOUR decision. Not Jesus. Not Jesus'. Ultimately, you have one to thank: Yourself. Jesus may have some other role in some other matter, just not this one. The Savior is you.
Which is it? ALL Christianity hinges on this singular issue. And so did the Reformation 500 years ago.
Christianity is entirely founded, based, on this: Jesus is the Savior.
JESUS - There is no other name by which any is saved (and that included your name and mine), no one comes to the Father except by JESUS alone. Jesus is the Way.
IS Factually, really, definitely, this cannot be undermined
THE Exclusive, singular, all-sufficient,
SAVIOR Not just helper or teacher or inspiration or model.... not just possibility-maker or door-opener or offeror.... He is the one who SAVES people (rescues)...
Undermine any part of that even just a tiny bit - and Christianity crashes to the ground
The Devil works overtime, the Devil works HARD, the Devil applies all the creative tools at his disposal, to undermine that Gospel.... to get us to look less to the Cross and more in the mirror. He apples all he has to convince us that Jesus does not Save, He is NOT the Savior, He is NOT the reason: YOU are. Jesus may have made it POSSIBLE for you to be saved.... Jesus may be a divine helper.... Jesus may be the divine teacher who shows you how to save yourself.... Satan is more than willing to ascribe ANY high sounding role to Jesus that may appeal, as long as it's not The Savior. Can he appeal to your pride? Can he appeal to your since of smarts? Can he use questions you have? Can he even use Scripture (as he did with Jesus in the wilderness)? Can he even use things God said (as he did to Adam and Eve)? SURE! But you can tell it's him ... because he has one goal: Get your eyes off the Cross and on the Mirror; make Jesus as small as possible and self as big as possible.
Even Christians might answer: "Sure, Jesus is the Savior but to be saved you gotta ______________." Doesn't matter what goes in the blank, whatever it is, it cancels out the first part. It destroys Jesus as the Savior and makes self the reason one is going to heaven (and Satan smiles). The Devil is just fine with "Jesus opened the door to heaven but you gotta get yourself through it." "Jesus makes it possible for all to be saved but He doesn't actually save anyone." "God helps those who help themselves." "If you do x,y,z then God rewards that with salvation." They may parrot some misuse of Scripture or some "logic" Satan used on them... they may be sincere.... but they just destroyed Christianity. Satan works HARD to make a very simple question (Who is the Savior?) as muddy and complex as he can. And sadly, just as he had success in the Garden, well, he still too often does.
Every other religion on the planet, all the FALSE religions of Satan say this....
1) We've got a problem. Sin is real, the world is broken, we are not what God desires, our future is doomed because of this.
2) God wants this solved.
3) God supplies us with all the HELP, all the divine strength and wisdom and teaching we need to fix this.
4) Each of us needs to "tap" that power/help sufficiently and obey that wisdom sufficiently - and we'll climb out of this hole (at least for self) given enough time and if we "tap" God enough and try hard enough.
NO other religion has a Savior because none is needed: each saves self.
We parrot all wrong religions when we ultimately hold that Jesus is not the Savior but the Helper, the door-opener, the offerer... when we say I don't NEED to be saved - I just need sufficient help, wisdom and time to fix it myself and climb out of this and up to God.
The Lutheran Reformation - at it's core - was about this. Because of Rome's profound need for MONEY and Charles' need to get elected and stay in power, indulgence sellers preached Satan's lie. Luther (a "Doctor of the Church" with the responsibility of pointing out error in doctrine) noted this lie and how it violated Scripture, the Gospel, the Council of Orange, etc. The Catholic Church responded with a muddy, blurry cocktail that made the lies of the Indulgence sellers permissible - then turned this mess into dogma at the Council of Trent. Luther simply called the church back to the Gospel. And IF the whole discussion was not dominated by Rome's money problems, the politics of Europe at the time, the low esteem many had of Germans at the time, and the horrible corruption of Rome at that time (read about the life of Pope Alexander VI for example)... Luther probably would have succeeded and no Reformation would have happened. Who knows. But Luther's point STILL needs to be heard - and NOT only (or perhaps even especially) by the Catholic Church. Satan has never limited his ploy on those of any one denomination.
The Lutheran Reformation was/is NOT about the divine Call for CHRISTIANS (those saved, "justified" in the narrow sense) to holiness, love, service; not about the Call to become ever more Christ-like in all we think, say and do. All "sies" fully and passionately agreed on that (what is often called "sanctification" or "discipleship" or "the Christian life/walk") Both Luther and the Catholic Church of his day stressed this point and their agreement on this. The issue was/is not "What must Christians do?" but rather "who is the Savior?" It was justification ('born again'..... coming to spiritual life.... the changed relationship with God.... the change from enemy to child.... the coming of the Holy Spirit). Both Lutherans and Catholics passionately agree that good works are good and than bad works are bad; never has been any dispute over that. Neither has ever disputed that CHRISTIANS are called to love as Christ FIRST loved them, the issue is whether God first loves us because we loved Him, we jumped through various "hoops."
As a former Catholic myself, my PERSONAL OPINION (and no one is asked or expected to agree) is that the Catholic Church never "lost" or "forgot" the Gospel, the essence and foundation and keystone of Christianity. It's still "there." It's just that often (surely not always) it's very muddy... lots of things (much of these, TRUE things) are thrown together, mixed together, blended together - so that the result is a very confusing and bewildering mess (NO ISSUE IN CHRISTIANITY SHOULD BE CLEARER) that it leaves the door WIDE OPEN for the Devil's ploy. I had Catholic teachers tell me (verbatim!) "Jesus opened the doors to heaven but it's up to you to get through them." "Jesus actually saves no one but He has made it possible for everyone to save themselves." Frankly, I think some OTHER denominations often mix up stuff worse than the RCC currently does. Satan's ploy is unchanged... and it still works. The Gospel still needs to be proclaimed - boldly, clearly; among Catholics and Protestants, among believers and unbelievers alike. Nothing makes Satan weep more. Nothing makes Jesus rejoice more.
Blessings on the 505th anniversary of the Lutheran Reformation....
- Josiah
.
There really are only two places to look: To the Cross or the mirror.
IF you answer "Jesus" then Jesus is the Savior. Not you - not a bit, not at all, not now, not ever, not in any way or shape or form or manner. Salvation is entirely, wholly wrapped up in Jesus. It's entirely HIS work. HIS heart. HIS love. HIS mercy. HIS gift. HIS blessing. His life, His death, His resurrection. His Cross, His blood, His sacrifice. His righteousness, His obedience, His holiness. Not you. Not yours. If there is salvation, there is one reason: Jesus; one who accomplished this: Jesus; one to thank: Jesus. You may have some other role in some other matter, but not this. The "job" of Savior belongs to Jesus. Not you.
IF you answer "me" then you are the Savior. Not Jesus. Not a bit, not at all. Not now, not ever. Not in any way, shape or form or manner. Salvation is all wrapped up in YOU. YOUR works. YOUR will. YOUR love. YOUR efforts. YOUR merits. YOUR obedience. YOUR righteousness. YOUR holiness. YOUR sacrifice. YOUR decision. Not Jesus. Not Jesus'. Ultimately, you have one to thank: Yourself. Jesus may have some other role in some other matter, just not this one. The Savior is you.
Which is it? ALL Christianity hinges on this singular issue. And so did the Reformation 500 years ago.
Christianity is entirely founded, based, on this: Jesus is the Savior.
JESUS - There is no other name by which any is saved (and that included your name and mine), no one comes to the Father except by JESUS alone. Jesus is the Way.
IS Factually, really, definitely, this cannot be undermined
THE Exclusive, singular, all-sufficient,
SAVIOR Not just helper or teacher or inspiration or model.... not just possibility-maker or door-opener or offeror.... He is the one who SAVES people (rescues)...
Undermine any part of that even just a tiny bit - and Christianity crashes to the ground
The Devil works overtime, the Devil works HARD, the Devil applies all the creative tools at his disposal, to undermine that Gospel.... to get us to look less to the Cross and more in the mirror. He apples all he has to convince us that Jesus does not Save, He is NOT the Savior, He is NOT the reason: YOU are. Jesus may have made it POSSIBLE for you to be saved.... Jesus may be a divine helper.... Jesus may be the divine teacher who shows you how to save yourself.... Satan is more than willing to ascribe ANY high sounding role to Jesus that may appeal, as long as it's not The Savior. Can he appeal to your pride? Can he appeal to your since of smarts? Can he use questions you have? Can he even use Scripture (as he did with Jesus in the wilderness)? Can he even use things God said (as he did to Adam and Eve)? SURE! But you can tell it's him ... because he has one goal: Get your eyes off the Cross and on the Mirror; make Jesus as small as possible and self as big as possible.
Even Christians might answer: "Sure, Jesus is the Savior but to be saved you gotta ______________." Doesn't matter what goes in the blank, whatever it is, it cancels out the first part. It destroys Jesus as the Savior and makes self the reason one is going to heaven (and Satan smiles). The Devil is just fine with "Jesus opened the door to heaven but you gotta get yourself through it." "Jesus makes it possible for all to be saved but He doesn't actually save anyone." "God helps those who help themselves." "If you do x,y,z then God rewards that with salvation." They may parrot some misuse of Scripture or some "logic" Satan used on them... they may be sincere.... but they just destroyed Christianity. Satan works HARD to make a very simple question (Who is the Savior?) as muddy and complex as he can. And sadly, just as he had success in the Garden, well, he still too often does.
Every other religion on the planet, all the FALSE religions of Satan say this....
1) We've got a problem. Sin is real, the world is broken, we are not what God desires, our future is doomed because of this.
2) God wants this solved.
3) God supplies us with all the HELP, all the divine strength and wisdom and teaching we need to fix this.
4) Each of us needs to "tap" that power/help sufficiently and obey that wisdom sufficiently - and we'll climb out of this hole (at least for self) given enough time and if we "tap" God enough and try hard enough.
NO other religion has a Savior because none is needed: each saves self.
We parrot all wrong religions when we ultimately hold that Jesus is not the Savior but the Helper, the door-opener, the offerer... when we say I don't NEED to be saved - I just need sufficient help, wisdom and time to fix it myself and climb out of this and up to God.
The Lutheran Reformation - at it's core - was about this. Because of Rome's profound need for MONEY and Charles' need to get elected and stay in power, indulgence sellers preached Satan's lie. Luther (a "Doctor of the Church" with the responsibility of pointing out error in doctrine) noted this lie and how it violated Scripture, the Gospel, the Council of Orange, etc. The Catholic Church responded with a muddy, blurry cocktail that made the lies of the Indulgence sellers permissible - then turned this mess into dogma at the Council of Trent. Luther simply called the church back to the Gospel. And IF the whole discussion was not dominated by Rome's money problems, the politics of Europe at the time, the low esteem many had of Germans at the time, and the horrible corruption of Rome at that time (read about the life of Pope Alexander VI for example)... Luther probably would have succeeded and no Reformation would have happened. Who knows. But Luther's point STILL needs to be heard - and NOT only (or perhaps even especially) by the Catholic Church. Satan has never limited his ploy on those of any one denomination.
The Lutheran Reformation was/is NOT about the divine Call for CHRISTIANS (those saved, "justified" in the narrow sense) to holiness, love, service; not about the Call to become ever more Christ-like in all we think, say and do. All "sies" fully and passionately agreed on that (what is often called "sanctification" or "discipleship" or "the Christian life/walk") Both Luther and the Catholic Church of his day stressed this point and their agreement on this. The issue was/is not "What must Christians do?" but rather "who is the Savior?" It was justification ('born again'..... coming to spiritual life.... the changed relationship with God.... the change from enemy to child.... the coming of the Holy Spirit). Both Lutherans and Catholics passionately agree that good works are good and than bad works are bad; never has been any dispute over that. Neither has ever disputed that CHRISTIANS are called to love as Christ FIRST loved them, the issue is whether God first loves us because we loved Him, we jumped through various "hoops."
As a former Catholic myself, my PERSONAL OPINION (and no one is asked or expected to agree) is that the Catholic Church never "lost" or "forgot" the Gospel, the essence and foundation and keystone of Christianity. It's still "there." It's just that often (surely not always) it's very muddy... lots of things (much of these, TRUE things) are thrown together, mixed together, blended together - so that the result is a very confusing and bewildering mess (NO ISSUE IN CHRISTIANITY SHOULD BE CLEARER) that it leaves the door WIDE OPEN for the Devil's ploy. I had Catholic teachers tell me (verbatim!) "Jesus opened the doors to heaven but it's up to you to get through them." "Jesus actually saves no one but He has made it possible for everyone to save themselves." Frankly, I think some OTHER denominations often mix up stuff worse than the RCC currently does. Satan's ploy is unchanged... and it still works. The Gospel still needs to be proclaimed - boldly, clearly; among Catholics and Protestants, among believers and unbelievers alike. Nothing makes Satan weep more. Nothing makes Jesus rejoice more.
Blessings on the 505th anniversary of the Lutheran Reformation....
- Josiah
.
Last edited:
