The government planned 9-11?

[NathanH83]

Did they?

 

[Lamb]

I don't believe it to be that way because there is evidence that in 1999 the al Qaeda "could crash-land an aircraft packed with high explosives (C-4 and Semtex) into the Pentagon, the headquarters of the CIA or the White House."

 

[JRT]

Over the last while I have been pondering a phenomenon that has actually been going for a very long time. I am referring to Denialists and Conspiracy Theorists. While they might seem to be different behaviours, I think they have a commonality in the sort of mind that subscribes to them. What also struck me as curious is the number of them that are centered around science, technology and medicine. Let me list a few.

>> the link between tobacco and cancer, particularly lung cancer

>> the fluoridation of water supplies to prevent tooth decay

>> the role of chlorofluorinated hydrocarbons in the deterioration of the ozone layer

>> the build up of DDT in the food chain and its effect on both reproduction success in birds and human health.

>> the link between HIV and AIDS

>> the role of vaccination in causing other health issues

>> the historicity of the moon landings

>>UFOs and aliens

>>flat earth

>> chemtrails

>> the human role in CO2 production and climate change

This is hardly an exhaustive list and it is easy to also point out others that have very little, if any, linkage to science, technology or medicine. For example, the historicity of the Holocaust, of the Twin Towers, of the assassination of President Kennedy and of both President Obama's birth place and religion.

What most puzzles me most is the state of mind of both those who advocate these theories and those who so readily subscribe to them. I will throw out a few random thoughts here in the hope that they will generate some discussion.

>> fear and powerlessness --- people feel overwhelmed by events that are beyond their control and require a scapegoat on which to pin their frustration and their anger.

>> fear and ignorance --- people are frightened by their own lack of understanding of the concepts and issues involved and suggest that 'the intellectuals' are trying to put one over on them.

>> the 'little guy syndrome' --- people fear big organizations, big government in particular, and feel the need to lash out at them by suggesting that the little guy is being somehow exploited.

>>contrarianism --- some people love to be different just for the sake of it

>>special knowledge syndrome --- a form of elitism where people like to feel they have some special or secret knowledge that makes them feel smarter and/or better informed than the rest, even if it doesn't have much practical application.

>> religion and political ideologies --- in at least a few cases the culprit is viewed as challenging religious and/or political beliefs.

To illustrate this last point we could look at two examples.

Political --- the fluoridation of water supplies to prevent tooth decay was opposed as a tactic by communists to poison the whole nation. This was particularly effective in the days of the 'red menace' but has a modern counterpart in the paranoia surrounding international terrorism.

Religious --- new technologies are viewed as challenging religious understandings. This goes back a long way in history. Two hundred years ago Timothy Dwight, Presbyterian minister and president of Yale University wrote “If God had decreed from all eternity that a certain person should die of smallpox, it would be a frightful sin to avoid and annul that decree by the trick of vaccination.” Today we see an echo of that religious fear in the debate surrounding stem cell research.

My final observation is that it seems to me that denialists, conspiracy theorists, and biblical fundamentalists / creationists are often the same people.

 

[tango]

What most puzzles me most is the state of mind of both those who advocate these theories and those who so readily subscribe to them. I will throw out a few random thoughts here in the hope that they will generate some discussion.

Without getting into the merits or otherwise of any particular theory, conspiracy or otherwise, there are some interesting points here.

>> fear and powerlessness --- people feel overwhelmed by events that are beyond their control and require a scapegoat on which to pin their frustration and their anger.

This works in some cases but frankly I find the theory that 9/11 was orchestrated by the US government far more worrying than the theory that it was orchestrated by a bunch of angry guys living in caves. If it was a bunch of angry guys who hate us and exploited a weakness in our security (and despite what the talking heads say I don't see how it would be difficult to pull it off, given the inclination) then things at least make some sense. If the government we rely on to protect us was behind it all, that changes everything.

A curious quirk of the 9/11 conspiracy theory is that George W Bush was apparently dumb enough that he could barely tie his own shoelaces while simultaneously being smart enough to pull off the kind of planning required to conduct the attacks and cover it all up without a single person spilling the beans.

>> fear and ignorance --- people are frightened by their own lack of understanding of the concepts and issues involved and suggest that 'the intellectuals' are trying to put one over on them.

This only works when the people considering the theories can't themselves be considered intellectual. I personally know a number of very intelligent people whose children developed autism-like symptoms shortly after being vaccinated and who gave (and, I believe, still give) at least some thought to the possibility the two are related. Of course an intellectual doesn't typically tend to argue in absolute black and white concepts the way the less intellectual might, and at the same time someone thinking about matters more deeply will accept that the assertion "vaccines are safe" is not the same as the assertion "there is zero risk of side effects", in the same way every single one of us who drives a car knows "driving is safe" isn't the same as "there's zero risk on the road".

>> the 'little guy syndrome' --- people fear big organizations, big government in particular, and feel the need to lash out at them by suggesting that the little guy is being somehow exploited.

This is a good point. Although I think it's quite common that the little guy is exploited - just ask the most junior staff at Amazon or Walmart - I'm not sure we need to specifically look for huge scale conspiracies to make the case.

>>contrarianism --- some people love to be different just for the sake of it

True, although I wonder how many people would believe outlandish theories just for the sake of being different. It's one thing to be the token oddball in a social circle and just kick the proverbial apple cart once in a while but another thing entirely to be arguing something outlandish in public where it could affect all sorts of other things.

>>special knowledge syndrome --- a form of elitism where people like to feel they have some special or secret knowledge that makes them feel smarter and/or better informed than the rest, even if it doesn't have much practical application.

Certainly some conspiracy theorists like to play the card that they are part of a small group who aren't blinded by the media, who aren't "sheeple", who actually think for themselves, even as they refuse to use reason to defend the theories they are pushing. Sometimes it can be interesting to see how someone responds to questions that indicate you're at least trying to take their theory seriously but just want details fleshed out a bit.

>> religion and political ideologies --- in at least a few cases the culprit is viewed as challenging religious and/or political beliefs.

True, although given the Bible says "test all things, hold fast what is true" it's curious that people should regard a call to test, wherever it originates, as a bad thing.

To illustrate this last point we could look at two examples.

Political --- the fluoridation of water supplies to prevent tooth decay was opposed as a tactic by communists to poison the whole nation. This was particularly effective in the days of the 'red menace' but has a modern counterpart in the paranoia surrounding international terrorism.

Perhaps, but there's also concern about the issue of dental fluorosis and the basic concept that putting any form of medication into the water runs into an immediate problem that there is little control over the dosage any individual might receive. Prescribing medication allows a doctor to specify the dose that should be taken but putting something in the water (or into flour, or bread, or milk, or anything else) leaves the dosage completely uncontrolled.

Religious --- new technologies are viewed as challenging religious understandings. This goes back a long way in history. Two hundred years ago Timothy Dwight, Presbyterian minister and president of Yale University wrote “If God had decreed from all eternity that a certain person should die of smallpox, it would be a frightful sin to avoid and annul that decree by the trick of vaccination.” Today we see an echo of that religious fear in the debate surrounding stem cell research.

Interestingly the possibility that God might have preordained a person to die of smallpox doesn't exclude the possibility that God might have preordained a scientist to discover the cure so that people didn't have to die any more. The "God might have preordained this outcome" is a lame excuse because God could just as easily have preordained a different outcome. Let's face it, even if God preordained that someone would die of smallpox he isn't much of a god if he can't arrange for that person to die of smallpox even if they are vaccinated. There's not much point claiming to follow a God who makes such preordinations and is then thwarted because he got outsmarted when Man invented something to unravel his eternal plan.

My final observation is that it seems to me that denialists, conspiracy theorists, and biblical fundamentalists / creationists are often the same people.

Perhaps some of the time. I've seen conspiracy theorists within the church and outside it. I can't say I've known enough people of other faiths to have a view as to whether Muslims, Hindus etc tend to subscribe to what we would call conspiracy theories.