The gospel of Jesus Christ...

[justbyfaith]

...is that God became a Man and went to the Cross to shed His blood in order that our sins might be forgiven.

1Co 15:1, Moreover, brethren, I declare unto you the gospel which I preached unto you, which also ye have received, and wherein ye stand;
1Co 15:2, By which also ye are saved, if ye keep in memory what I preached unto you, unless ye have believed in vain.
1Co 15:3, For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures;
1Co 15:4, And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures:

It is written,

2Co 6:2, (For he saith, I have heard thee in a time accepted, and in the day of salvation have I succoured thee: behold, now is the accepted time; behold, now is the day of salvation.)

There is an open door in front of each and every one of you.

Hos 14:2, Take with you words, and turn to the LORD: say unto him, Take away all iniquity, and receive us graciously: so will we render the calves of our lips.

Rom 10:9, That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.
Rom 10:10, For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.
Rom 10:11, For the scripture saith, Whosoever believeth on him shall not be ashamed.
Rom 10:12, For there is no difference between the Jew and the Greek: for the same Lord over all is rich unto all that call upon him.
Rom 10:13, For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved.

Act 2:37, Now when they heard this, they were pricked in their heart, and said unto Peter and to the rest of the apostles, Men and brethren, what shall we do?
Act 2:38, Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.
Act 2:39, For the promise is unto you, and to your children, and to all that are afar off, even as many as the Lord our God shall call.

Eze 36:25, Then will I sprinkle clean water upon you, and ye shall be clean: from all your filthiness, and from all your idols, will I cleanse you.
Eze 36:26, A new heart also will I give you, and a new spirit will I put within you: and I will take away the stony heart out of your flesh, and I will give you an heart of flesh.
Eze 36:27, And I will put my spirit within you, and cause you to walk in my statutes, and ye shall keep my judgments, and do them.

What you can do is, after having prayed a prayer of salvation in your own words, you can ask the Father to baptize you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins (so that He is the One doing the baptizing) as you pour the water over your own head.

You can ask Him to grant you remission of sins and the gift of the Holy Ghost; and also cleanse you from all your filthiness and idols and give you a new heart and a new spirit; taking the stony heart out of your flesh and giving you an heart of flesh; and that He might cause you to walk in His statutes and in His judgments.

It certainly won't hurt you to do all of these things that, in holy scripture, are prescribed as means of obtaining salvation.

 

[justbyfaith]

1Pe 3:20, Which sometime were disobedient, when once the longsuffering of God waited in the days of Noah, while the ark was a preparing, wherein few, that is, eight souls were saved by water.
1Pe 3:21, The like figure whereunto even baptism doth also now save us (not the putting away of the filth of the flesh, but the answer of a good conscience toward God,) by the resurrection of Jesus Christ:
1Pe 3:22, Who is gone into heaven, and is on the right hand of God; angels and authorities and powers being made subject unto him.

I have quoted it out of the kjv.

But if you want to be contentious and go to another version that says that eight souls were saved through water, I would say that my point is not refuted, that v.20 teaches us that the baptism spoken of in v.21 is water baptism.

Noticing that such a baptism is not the removing of the filth of the flesh;

While it does wash away sins.

Act 22:16, And now why tarriest thou? arise, and be baptized, and wash away thy sins, calling on the name of the Lord.

I have made it easy for you in this thread.

Why not just "get this one done" instead of arguing your way out of doing what you need to do?

It certainly can't hurt you to receive this ordinance.

 

[justbyfaith]

Baptism in Jesus' Name is not salvation by works. It is a point of contact by which we can receive a conditional promise by faith.

I would say that it is a clear identification with Jesus Christ in His death, burial, and resurrection and that as such, it is a confession of Jesus Christ before men.

See Matthew 10:32, Luke 12:8.

 

[Lees]

...is that God became a Man and went to the Cross to shed His blood in order that our sins might be forgiven.

1Co 15:1, Moreover, brethren, I declare unto you the gospel which I preached unto you, which also ye have received, and wherein ye stand;
1Co 15:2, By which also ye are saved, if ye keep in memory what I preached unto you, unless ye have believed in vain.
1Co 15:3, For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures;
1Co 15:4, And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures:

It is written,

2Co 6:2, (For he saith, I have heard thee in a time accepted, and in the day of salvation have I succoured thee: behold, now is the accepted time; behold, now is the day of salvation.)

There is an open door in front of each and every one of you.

Hos 14:2, Take with you words, and turn to the LORD: say unto him, Take away all iniquity, and receive us graciously: so will we render the calves of our lips.

Rom 10:9, That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.
Rom 10:10, For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.
Rom 10:11, For the scripture saith, Whosoever believeth on him shall not be ashamed.
Rom 10:12, For there is no difference between the Jew and the Greek: for the same Lord over all is rich unto all that call upon him.
Rom 10:13, For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved.

Act 2:37, Now when they heard this, they were pricked in their heart, and said unto Peter and to the rest of the apostles, Men and brethren, what shall we do?
Act 2:38, Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.
Act 2:39, For the promise is unto you, and to your children, and to all that are afar off, even as many as the Lord our God shall call.

Eze 36:25, Then will I sprinkle clean water upon you, and ye shall be clean: from all your filthiness, and from all your idols, will I cleanse you.
Eze 36:26, A new heart also will I give you, and a new spirit will I put within you: and I will take away the stony heart out of your flesh, and I will give you an heart of flesh.
Eze 36:27, And I will put my spirit within you, and cause you to walk in my statutes, and ye shall keep my judgments, and do them.

What you can do is, after having prayed a prayer of salvation in your own words, you can ask the Father to baptize you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins (so that He is the One doing the baptizing) as you pour the water over your own head.

You can ask Him to grant you remission of sins and the gift of the Holy Ghost; and also cleanse you from all your filthiness and idols and give you a new heart and a new spirit; taking the stony heart out of your flesh and giving you an heart of flesh; and that He might cause you to walk in His statutes and in His judgments.

It certainly won't hurt you to do all of these things that, in holy scripture, are prescribed as means of obtaining salvation.

After praying a prayer of salvation, you have remission of sins. Pouring water on your own head does nothing.

After praying a prayer of salvation, of faith in Jesus Christ, you are born-again. You are cleansed. You have a new heart/spirit.

Lees

 

[Lees]

Baptism in Jesus' Name is not salvation by works. It is a point of contact by which we can receive a conditional promise by faith.

I would say that it is a clear identification with Jesus Christ in His death, burial, and resurrection and that as such, it is a confession of Jesus Christ before men.

See Matthew 10:32, Luke 12:8.

The baptism in (Matt. 10:32) is that of the Kingdom. It has nothing to do with the believer in the Church. (Matt. 3:11) (Matt. 10:5-9)

Confession of Who Jesus is, or faith in Jesus Christ, is always the core of salvation. But that faith could be prior to the Mosaic Law, or during the Law, or after the Law. Any baptisms need to be defined under those time periods.

Lees

 

[justbyfaith]

Pouring water on your own head does nothing.

I would contend that there is a conditional promise in Acts 2:38-39.

Fulfill the condition, receive the promise.

Also, it is given to as many as the Lord our God shall call (Acts 2:39).

See Romans 8:30.

 

[justbyfaith]

After praying a prayer of salvation, you have remission of sins.

After praying a prayer of salvation, of faith in Jesus Christ, you are born-again. You are cleansed. You have a new heart/spirit.

I won't deny that you may in fact have remission of sins after praying a prayer of salvation.

I would just say that if there is any doubt in your mind, Acts 2:38 is an absolute promise of holy scripture and can remove all doubt;

And you might decide to fulfill the ordinance even if you think you are already saved, in order that you might receive a "second benefit" (2 Corinthians 1:15) of "remission of sins and the gift of the Holy Ghost" (Acts 2:38).

 

[Lees]

I would contend that there is a conditional promise in Acts 2:38-39.

Fulfill the condition, receive the promise.

Also, it is given to as many as the Lord our God shall call (Acts 2:39).

See Romans 8:30.

Pouring water on your own head does nothing.

Lees

 

[justbyfaith]

Pouring water on your own head does nothing.

Lees

By itself, you would be correct.

However, with prayer, there is a promise in Ezekiel 36:25-27 wherein we are promised that when God sprinkles clean water on us, He will cleanse us from all our filthiness and all our idols, will give us a new heart and a new spirit, will take the stony heart out our flesh and give us an heart of flesh; and will cause us to walk in His statutes and in His judgments.

Of course, we must ask the Father to do the sprinkling.

Mat 7:7, Ask, and it shall be given you; seek, and ye shall find; knock, and it shall be opened unto you:
Mat 7:8, For every one that asketh receiveth; and he that seeketh findeth; and to him that knocketh it shall be opened.

There is also an absolute promise in Acts 2:38-39, that if we repent and are baptized in Jesus' Name for thr remission of sins, we shall receive remission of sins and the gift of the Holy Ghost.

You can disagree again if you want; but in doing so you would be disagreeing with scripture.

 

[Lees]

By itself, you would be correct.

However, with prayer, there is a promise in Ezekiel 36:25-27 wherein we are promised that when God sprinkles clean water on us, He will cleanse us from all our filthiness and all our idols, will give us a new heart and a new spirit, will take the stony heart out our flesh and give us an heart of flesh; and will cause us to walk in His statutes and in his judgments.

Of course, we must ask the Father to do the sprinkling.

Mat 7:7, Ask, and it shall be given you; seek, and ye shall find; knock, and it shall be opened unto you:
Mat 7:8, For every one that asketh receiveth; and he that seeketh findeth; and to him that knocketh it shall be opened.

There is also an absolute promise in Acts 2:38-39, that if we repent and are baptized in Jesus' Name for thr remission of sins, we shall receive remission of sins and the gift of the Holy Ghost.

You can disagree again if you want; but in doing so you would be disagreeing with scripture.

Pouring water on your own head does nothing.

Where in Scripture did anyone baptize themeselves? No where.

Lees

 

[justbyfaith]

Pouring water on your own head does nothing.

Where in Scripture did anyone baptize themeselves? No where.

Lees

Ask and it shall be given to you. If you ask the Father to baptize you in Jesus' Name for the remission of sins, when you pour the water over your head, He will do it.

I mean, you can try to make it harder for people to enter the kingdom by saying that you have to be baptized by a minister; or that immersion is necessary...but why?

Jesus wants to make the way into the kingdom easy. His yoke is easy and His burden is light.

Actually living the gospel may be hard; but initiation into the faith ought not to be convoluted.

It should be accessible to everyone.

But if you think that self-baptizing isn't good enough, go and get it done by a Oneness minister!

They are the only ones who use the proper formula (see Acts 2:38-39, 4:10-12).

 

[justbyfaith]

Pouring water on your own head does nothing.

It does do something. It did something for me. It brought to me remission of sins and the gift of the Holy Ghost, as promised.

 

[justbyfaith]

Pouring water on your own head does nothing.

And again, you are disagreeing with holy scripture.

 

[Lees]

Ask and it shall be given to you. If you ask the Father to baptize you in Jesus' Name for the remission of sins, when you pour the water over your head, He will do it.

I mean, you can try to make it harder for people to enter the kingdom by saying that you have to be baptized by a minister; or that immersion is necessary...but why?

Jesus wants to make the way into the kingdom easy. His yoke is easy and His burden is light.

Actually living the gospel may be hard; but initiation into the faith ought not to be convoluted.

It should be accessible to everyone.

But if you think that self-baptizing isn't good enough, go and get it done by a Oneness minister!

They are the only ones who use the proper formula (see Acts 2:38-39, 4:10-12).

Where in Scripture did anyone baptize themselves?

Lees

 

[Lees]

And again, you are disagreeing with holy scripture.

You haven't produced any Scripture showing a person can baptize themselves.

Lees

 

[Lamb]

...is that God became a Man and went to the Cross to shed His blood in order that our sins might be forgiven.

1Co 15:1, Moreover, brethren, I declare unto you the gospel which I preached unto you, which also ye have received, and wherein ye stand;
1Co 15:2, By which also ye are saved, if ye keep in memory what I preached unto you, unless ye have believed in vain.
1Co 15:3, For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures;
1Co 15:4, And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures:

It is written,

2Co 6:2, (For he saith, I have heard thee in a time accepted, and in the day of salvation have I succoured thee: behold, now is the accepted time; behold, now is the day of salvation.)

There is an open door in front of each and every one of you.

Hos 14:2, Take with you words, and turn to the LORD: say unto him, Take away all iniquity, and receive us graciously: so will we render the calves of our lips.

Rom 10:9, That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.
Rom 10:10, For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.
Rom 10:11, For the scripture saith, Whosoever believeth on him shall not be ashamed.
Rom 10:12, For there is no difference between the Jew and the Greek: for the same Lord over all is rich unto all that call upon him.
Rom 10:13, For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved.

Act 2:37, Now when they heard this, they were pricked in their heart, and said unto Peter and to the rest of the apostles, Men and brethren, what shall we do?
Act 2:38, Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.
Act 2:39, For the promise is unto you, and to your children, and to all that are afar off, even as many as the Lord our God shall call.

Eze 36:25, Then will I sprinkle clean water upon you, and ye shall be clean: from all your filthiness, and from all your idols, will I cleanse you.
Eze 36:26, A new heart also will I give you, and a new spirit will I put within you: and I will take away the stony heart out of your flesh, and I will give you an heart of flesh.
Eze 36:27, And I will put my spirit within you, and cause you to walk in my statutes, and ye shall keep my judgments, and do them.

What you can do is, after having prayed a prayer of salvation in your own words, you can ask the Father to baptize you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins (so that He is the One doing the baptizing) as you pour the water over your own head.

You can ask Him to grant you remission of sins and the gift of the Holy Ghost; and also cleanse you from all your filthiness and idols and give you a new heart and a new spirit; taking the stony heart out of your flesh and giving you an heart of flesh; and that He might cause you to walk in His statutes and in His judgments.

It certainly won't hurt you to do all of these things that, in holy scripture, are prescribed as means of obtaining salvation.

The bible does not give instruction for us to pour water over our own head for baptism.

 

[Lamb]

Ask and it shall be given to you. If you ask the Father to baptize you in Jesus' Name for the remission of sins, when you pour the water over your head, He will do it.

I mean, you can try to make it harder for people to enter the kingdom by saying that you have to be baptized by a minister; or that immersion is necessary...but why?

Jesus wants to make the way into the kingdom easy. His yoke is easy and His burden is light.

Actually living the gospel may be hard; but initiation into the faith ought not to be convoluted.

It should be accessible to everyone.

But if you think that self-baptizing isn't good enough, go and get it done by a Oneness minister!

They are the only ones who use the proper formula (see Acts 2:38-39, 4:10-12).

If you're Oneness then you do not agree with the Trinity. I'm going to change your profile to reflect that and move this thread to the appropriate forum.

 

[Albion]

The bible does not give instruction for us to pour water over our own head for baptism.

That's very true. What's more, it clearly teaches us that Jesus had someone else baptize Him and, later, he commanded his chosen Apostles to do the baptizing of people who would hear the Gospel from them and accept Jesus as Lord and Savior.

 

[Josiah]

...What you can do

@justbyfaith


I'm 100% with you ... until this point.
Your insistence of what the DEAD, unbelieving, atheistic, fallen, sinful, unregenerate person CAN DO.

This video is 11 minutes long but makes the point well that Jesus is the Savior. Not self. Self doesn't save self by "deciding."

Then, if you care what Scripture (and centuries of Christianity) says, you can also view this one (it's 6 minutes long)...

@justbyfaith the Bible specifically says that without faith, unregenerate people are spiritually DEAD. D-E-A-D. Now, what can dead people to? Not much. They CANNOT change that. The Bible says they CANNOT believe or choose or DO anything spiritual. Can GOD change that? Can God give life, faith, salvation? Can GOD save us? The Bible says yes.... indeed only HE can. So, instead of people patting themselves on the back for doing something they didn't could not and did not do... praising themselves for being the reason they are spiritually alive and justified... it is the point of Scripture and Christianity to praise JESUS, to insist the HE saved us (not just made it possible for us to save ourselves by some action we did when we were dead but He actually did it), to affirm that Jesus actually IS the Savior - the one who actually saves. Christianity lifts high the Cross. Christianity affirms that it is God who saves, not self.


Blessings!

Josiah




.

 

[justbyfaith]

If you're Oneness then you do not agree with the Trinity. I'm going to change your profile to reflect that and move this thread to the appropriate forum.

I am not absolutely Oneness and I do believe in three distinct Persons within the Godhead (therefore I believe that I believe in the Trinity).

You can read my post in the "appropriate forum" which gives my take on the Trinity and see if it conforms with the Trinity well enough for you to count me as a brother in Christ.

If you are able to count me as a brother after reading the post, then please reinstate my posting privileges.

Oneness--coexistent modalism as the true Trinity

I have decided to post this in this section of the forums as in this post I will express a certain dissent with what is written in the creeds. To the moderators, I give you the option of changing my status so that I can only post in this section or else trust in the fact that I will not post...

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