the buzz about alcohol

[ImaginaryDay2]

Btw, what doctor do you know that lists "alcoholism" as a cause of death? I'll wait while you look that up...

 

[Stravinsk]

Not at all, it's entirely possible that the increased risk of death or disease still result in risks sufficiently low that death by natural causes precedes death by vice. Your statement would only hold true if you would otherwise live forever.

"Natural causes" sounds like a convenient excuse especially when we are talking about people below the age of 60 or so.

Statement holds true not by an immeasurable standard (forever) but by observable consequences based on behavior (in this case, consumption), given time, and application of that behavior over time. For example, this generation has the largest child sufferers of type 2 diabetes and youngest suffers of heart related problems.

Check out this dude. Looks healthy right?

Buff. In shape. Man's man. Total stud.

Dead at 26. Here's his autopsy results: https://generationiron.com/dallas-mccarver-autopsy-released/

Steroid user for starters. Also elevated LDL cholesterol (comes only from animal products), as well as Atherosclerosis (build up arterial plaque, mostly from animal fats but also from plant fats that have been denatured through excessive heat (as with frying)).

Sort of blows away a few myths right there. I'm sort of guessing he didn't drink or smoke - but I could be wrong. Maybe EVERYTHING is caused by alcohol and tobacco products

 

[Andrew]

Not that which goeth into the mouth defileth a man; but that which cometh out of the mouth, this defileth a man
Ya get drunk ya say bad thangs!

Things like liver failure heart disease and lung cancer seems to be part of the premature death. I still have a few beers with my dad when he cooks his bbq, i dont get drunk maybe just a light buzz 4 or 5 is about where i'll stop. Its a respect thing for him, he is finally retired and he puts his life into perspective and talks about it all with me, i enjoy it. I might get out my guitar and start playing some leadbelly and johnny cash songs he likes. But do I drink and drive? no, do I go to bars? never. I used to be a heavy drinker but now its very few, light and very sacred between me and my dad for bonding, barbequing and catching up.


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[ImaginaryDay2]

Check out this dude. Looks healthy right?

No

 

[Stravinsk]

Keep convincing yourself that what happens to the rest of the world as they consume too much alcohol and tobacco won't happen to you, and you might find out it does How's that?

Btw, what doctor do you know that lists "alcoholism" as a cause of death? I'll wait while you look that up...

To "the rest of the world"? Care to flesh that out with some kind of verifiable statistics?

I don't need to "convince myself" of anything that sounds like "alcohol and tobacco are healthy" because I know they aren't. I'm honest about that, unlike a great deal of people who consume absolute garbage food WHO AREN'T HONEST ABOUT IT.

And brother, I'm feeling that Christ like love. I admit publicly I have a problem and because you want to be a smart butt all you can do is shove it in my face.

Karma will come, when it comes. Perhaps when it smacks you in the gizzard I'll have humbled myself enough that I won't point and laugh.

 

[Stravinsk]

Not that which goeth into the mouth defileth a man; but that which cometh out of the mouth, this defileth a man
Ya get drunk ya say bad thangs!

Sometimes when I'm drunk I say bad things. Sometimes I just say things I wouldn't otherwise that happen to disturb some people.

Insofar as that quote, it seems like every Christian using it ALWAYS leaves out the context - which is about washed hands or not. It's understandable, because most Christians are not aware that this practice is in the Talmud, which is why the Jews brought it up. The talmud to them is like Paul's writings to Christians. Both written by Pharisees.

Things like liver failure heart disease and lung cancer seems to be part of the premature death. I still have a few beers with my dad when he cooks his bbq, i dont get drunk maybe just a light buzz 4 or 5 is about where i'll stop. Its a respect thing for him, he is finally retired and he puts his life into perspective and talks about it all with me, i enjoy it. I might get out my guitar and start playing some leadbelly and johnny cash songs he likes. But do I drink and drive? no, do I go to bars? never. I used to be a heavy drinker but now its very few, light and very sacred between me and my dad for bonding, barbequing and catching up.

Amazing that you went from heavy drinker to light beers and just once in a while. It's not all that common but if it's true, then hat is off to ya.

 

[ImaginaryDay2]

To "the rest of the world"? Care to flesh that out with some kind of verifiable statistics?

I don't need to "convince myself" of anything that sounds like "alcohol and tobacco are healthy" because I know they aren't. I'm honest about that, unlike a great deal of people who consume absolute garbage food WHO AREN'T HONEST ABOUT IT.

I freely admit the pizza I consumed was garbage and contributes to my obesity. I made the choice to eat it, though, with full knowledge of that fact.

And brother, I'm feeling that Christ like love. I admit publicly I have a problem and because you want to be a smart butt all you can do is shove it in my face.

But the problem has done nothing to you. You're healthy by your own admission. Where's the problem?

 

[ImaginaryDay2]

Btw, you didn't answer about alcoholism and cause of death. That was a serious question, and goes to your "statistics"

 

[Stravinsk]

I freely admit the pizza I consumed was garbage and contributes to my obesity. I made the choice to eat it, though, with full knowledge of that fact.

Good. Then there is hope for you if you ever wanted to turn that around. Accepting responsibility is the first step and none can be taken before it.

But the problem has done nothing to you. You're healthy by your own admission. Where's the problem?

I have no health problems, that is true. However I don't expect to go like I have the last 10 years or so for another 10 years without experiencing difficulties (health or otherwise) that relate to my bad habit.

 

[Stravinsk]

Btw, what doctor do you know that lists "alcoholism" as a cause of death? I'll wait while you look that up...

Btw, you didn't answer about alcoholism and cause of death. That was a serious question, and goes to your "statistics"

A person can die in one sitting drinking a large amount of high percentage alcohol - this is called alcohol poisoning.

Regular alcohol consumption strains the liver, leading to fatty liver disease. However, lots of people who don't even consume alcohol have fatty liver disease due to their high intake of animal products and other garbage.

 

[ImaginaryDay2]

I have no health problems, that is true. However I don't expect to go like I have the last 10 years or so for another 10 years without experiencing difficulties (health or otherwise) that relate to my bad habit.

Thanks for clarifying. My apologies for my arrogance

 

[Andrew]

Sometimes when I'm drunk I say bad things. Sometimes I just say things I wouldn't otherwise that happen to disturb some people.

Insofar as that quote, it seems like every Christian using it ALWAYS leaves out the context - which is about washed hands or not. It's understandable, because most Christians are not aware that this practice is in the Talmud, which is why the Jews brought it up. The talmud to them is like Paul's writings to Christians. Both written by Pharisees.



Amazing that you went from heavy drinker to light beers and just once in a while. It's not all that common but if it's true, then hat is off to ya.

Before I was suicidal drank strong liquor even made coolaid out of straight vodka, smoking kush and popping pills and then i would ride passenger in my hard hard heavy drinkers sports car and I didnt car if we crashed or not. I was that far gone.. I started reading the bible and one at a time a few habits dropped and then I went to a Pentecostal church and my strength came back, happiness and joy, these things were the high that I was always chasing after and here it was, at the alter I just had to receive it. I cut out all of the drugs and hard drinking from my life. When my dad asked to have a drink with him i turned him down and then again. I finally knew that those days were dead and gone and i prayed that this not be a mistake and so we sat down he have a beer, its just so different but its relaxing with him its nothing the hard stuff i was used to but it was just mellow and its only a few, thank God I found a level i can stand on, im good with a few light beers and a few weeks go by and he wants to bbq, he hands me one cheers. But its not the same addictive tendencies I had before I got saved. This is pleasant and comforting to know that im not constantly looking for a fix, I have rest now in the Lord and me and my dad have never been as close as we are now, he is actually pretty smart and pretty funny lol we have 2 acres of land and talks about all the stuff he want to do to it before he dies, I love that man

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[tango]

"Natural causes" sounds like a convenient excuse especially when we are talking about people below the age of 60 or so.

Statement holds true not by an immeasurable standard (forever) but by observable consequences based on behavior (in this case, consumption), given time, and application of that behavior over time. For example, this generation has the largest child sufferers of type 2 diabetes and youngest suffers of heart related problems.

Check out this dude. Looks healthy right?

Buff. In shape. Man's man. Total stud.

Dead at 26. Here's his autopsy results: https://generationiron.com/dallas-mccarver-autopsy-released/

Steroid user for starters. Also elevated LDL cholesterol (comes only from animal products), as well as Atherosclerosis (build up arterial plaque, mostly from animal fats but also from plant fats that have been denatured through excessive heat (as with frying)).

Sort of blows away a few myths right there. I'm sort of guessing he didn't drink or smoke - but I could be wrong. Maybe EVERYTHING is caused by alcohol and tobacco products

All well and good, most of us can come up with someone who is far from what might be considered "average" in one direction yet statistics got them in another direction. Only last weekend I was at a memorial service for a young man who died barely a fortnight before his 22nd birthday. Did he smoke, drink, use drugs? I have no idea, I never knew him (I was just the sound guy for the service). He died in a car crash. Maybe, had he lived, he would have been someone who sat right in the middle of life's bell curve. On the other hand maybe he would have been one of the outliers.

A friend of a friend died in her early 40s. She was an all-out party girl. Maybe her exuberant lifestyle would have caught up with her and caused an earlier-than-expected death, had an aortic aneurysm not taken her out before that. There's no way of knowing, and the fact that something happens, on average, statistically speaking doesn't mean it will happen to you or to me.

It's like saying that the probability of rolling a die and getting a six is 1 in 6, and therefore assuming that if you roll the die enough times you are guaranteed a six. If you take the misguided belief that probabilities add up in a situation like this you'd conclude that if you roll the die six times you are guaranteed at least one six - the truth is that you could roll the die once and get a six, you could roll the die a million times and still not get a six (the chances are vanishingly small, but not quite zero).

You coming up with your guy who looks like an awesome stud but died at 26 is meaningless - not everybody is average. You might as well look at Ozzy Osbourne as "proof" that drink and drugs don't shorten your life. It would be just as useless, statistically speaking. That's what the whole thing about sample sizes is all about, and why it would be useless to walk into a Microsoft board meeting, see a bunch of billionaires sitting around talking, and conclude that there's no such thing as poverty any more because the average net worth of the people you looked at ran to 10 figures.

 

[Stravinsk]

Tango,

I will give you one thing. You are an absolute master at shifting the argument when you cannot counter it, making false comparisons and issuing summary dismissals based on them. I could break down your post, but I know from experience arguing with you that you'll just do the same thing again, lol.

All well and good, most of us can come up with someone who is far from what might be considered "average" in one direction yet statistics got them in another direction. Only last weekend I was at a memorial service for a young man who died barely a fortnight before his 22nd birthday. Did he smoke, drink, use drugs? I have no idea, I never knew him (I was just the sound guy for the service). He died in a car crash. Maybe, had he lived, he would have been someone who sat right in the middle of life's bell curve. On the other hand maybe he would have been one of the outliers.

A friend of a friend died in her early 40s. She was an all-out party girl. Maybe her exuberant lifestyle would have caught up with her and caused an earlier-than-expected death, had an aortic aneurysm not taken her out before that. There's no way of knowing, and the fact that something happens, on average, statistically speaking doesn't mean it will happen to you or to me.

It's like saying that the probability of rolling a die and getting a six is 1 in 6, and therefore assuming that if you roll the die enough times you are guaranteed a six. If you take the misguided belief that probabilities add up in a situation like this you'd conclude that if you roll the die six times you are guaranteed at least one six - the truth is that you could roll the die once and get a six, you could roll the die a million times and still not get a six (the chances are vanishingly small, but not quite zero).

You coming up with your guy who looks like an awesome stud but died at 26 is meaningless - not everybody is average. You might as well look at Ozzy Osbourne as "proof" that drink and drugs don't shorten your life. It would be just as useless, statistically speaking. That's what the whole thing about sample sizes is all about, and why it would be useless to walk into a Microsoft board meeting, see a bunch of billionaires sitting around talking, and conclude that there's no such thing as poverty any more because the average net worth of the people you looked at ran to 10 figures.

 

[Imalive]

I don't drink w ppl at the office anymore cause after 2 drinks I act weird. I'm not used it.

 

[tango]

Tango,

I will give you one thing. You are an absolute master at shifting the argument when you cannot counter it, making false comparisons and issuing summary dismissals based on them. I could break down your post, but I know from experience arguing with you that you'll just do the same thing again, lol.

I'm not shifting the argument at all, merely saying that an increase in probability that something will happen is not the same as a guarantee it will happen.

Your example of a 26-year-old bodybuilder who died at 26 is no more and no less statistically valid than my counterexample of Ozzy Osbourne who is well known for his life of drink, drugs and wild partying and yet is still alive. Statistically speaking it's more likely that your bodybuilder would live a longer life than someone like Ozzy but the simple reality is that we aren't all average.

 

[tango]

One other note, the insurance industry exists because we aren't all average and in many cases can't financially afford to be the one who doesn't sit nicely in the middle of a distribution curve. On average buying insurance is a bad idea - that's how insurance companies stay in business. The average person pays more in than they take out, which means the average person is better off without insurance. The trouble is, if you cease to be average because your house burned down, or you got a diagnosis of progressive heart failure, or someone stole your brand new car three days after you got it home, chances are you can't afford to pay the bill yourself. Hence, you take out insurance in case you are not-average in ways you can't afford to fund.

 

[Stravinsk]

I'm not shifting the argument at all, merely saying that an increase in probability that something will happen is not the same as a guarantee it will happen.

Your example of a 26-year-old bodybuilder who died at 26 is no more and no less statistically valid than my counterexample of Ozzy Osbourne who is well known for his life of drink, drugs and wild partying and yet is still alive. Statistically speaking it's more likely that your bodybuilder would live a longer life than someone like Ozzy but the simple reality is that we aren't all average.

The sad thing is, you think you are being clever with your rhetoric. All you are doing is displaying your ignorance.

If I feed you eggs, your cholesterol (LDL) will increase. The more I feed you, the higher it will go. These aren't games of chance like your false example of dice.
The more dietary animal fat your consume, the greater chances, given that you are not doing something to clear it also with diet, that you will have higher blood pressure due to increasing atherosclerosis.

The autopsy shows clearly that this body builder consumed massive amounts of animal products with his LDL cholesterol and buildup of arterial plaque. It is a FACT that animal fats do this, not plant based foods.

I don't have Ozzy's autopsy report (he's still alive isn't he) so you just drew an example out of your butt and used it as a proof. Congratulations though, you did seem to convince someone, and a staff member who has cancer at that. Maybe extra congratulations are in order for helping to feed people who don't need it extra lies.

 

[Lamb]

The sad thing is, you think you are being clever with your rhetoric. All you are doing is displaying your ignorance.

If I feed you eggs, your cholesterol (LDL) will increase. The more I feed you, the higher it will go. These aren't games of chance like your false example of dice.
The more dietary animal fat your consume, the greater chances, given that you are not doing something to clear it also with diet, that you will have higher blood pressure due to increasing atherosclerosis.

The autopsy shows clearly that this body builder consumed massive amounts of animal products with his LDL cholesterol and buildup of arterial plaque. It is a FACT that animal fats do this, not plant based foods.

I don't have Ozzy's autopsy report (he's still alive isn't he) so you just drew an example out of your butt and used it as a proof. Congratulations though, you did seem to convince someone, and a staff member who has cancer at that. Maybe extra congratulations are in order for helping to feed people who don't need it extra lies.

Don't bring my cancer into this since you are ignorant of my type of cancer.

 

[Stravinsk]

Don't bring my cancer into this since you are ignorant of my type of cancer.

Just remember that if your problem returns, there or elsewhere, then the experts advising you didn't solve the problem.

As for medical advice, I give you none - save to point you to Genesis and Daniel. My conscience is good with this. Love.