Stealing a crucifix

[Jazzy]

A Los Angeles County coroner’s investigator has been arrested on suspicion of stealing a gold chain and crucifix from around the neck of a dead man, prosecutors said Wednesday.

While responding to the heart-attack death of a warehouse worker last January, the investigator was recorded on surveillance video removing the crucifix necklace from the body and placing it in his medical bag, the statement said. He did not return the item or document it as required in a property receipt.

Full article

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That is very bad karma.

Thoughts about stealing a crucifix?

 

[tango]

Why is stealing a crucifix any different from stealing anything else of similar value?

 

[Faith]

Why is stealing a crucifix any different from stealing anything else of similar value?

Because it’s a holy religious item.

 

[tango]

Because it’s a holy religious item.

So why is stealing a cross-shaped piece of gold different from stealing a star-shaped piece of gold? Is a cross-shaped piece of gold holier than a piece of gold in some other shape? What makes a piece of gold more holy than another piece of gold? Does the emotional or religious attachment someone has to a piece of gold make it more or less serious an issue to steal it after they are dead?

 

[Faith]

So why is stealing a cross-shaped piece of gold different from stealing a star-shaped piece of gold? Is a cross-shaped piece of gold holier than a piece of gold in some other shape? What makes a piece of gold more holy than another piece of gold? Does the emotional or religious attachment someone has to a piece of gold make it more or less serious an issue to steal it after they are dead?

I assume it was blessed by a priest and is a sacramental.

 

[Faith]

I assume it was blessed by a priest and is a sacramental.

Plus it has the image of Jesus on it.

 

[Albion]

I assume it was blessed by a priest and is a sacramental.

That's an interesting point, but it's not usually the case that a cross worn on a chain has been blessed by anyone.

Plus it has the image of Jesus on it.

Yes, and stealing it would be unusually tacky or disrespectful, wouldn't it? Nevertheless, stealing is stealing no matter what the item happens to be, so there's probably no ranking system involved with this.

 

[Faith]

That's an interesting point, but it's not usually the case that a cross worn on a chain has been blessed by anyone.

Yes, and stealing it would be unusually tacky or disrespectful, wouldn't it? Nevertheless, stealing is stealing no matter what the item happens to be, so there's probably no ranking system involved with this.

i disagree. I think a lot of crucifix necklaces, if not most, have been blessed.

 

[tango]

I assume it was blessed by a priest and is a sacramental.

Why would you assume such a thing?

Even if you're right, what difference does it make? How does stealing something from a dead person become somehow worse because a priest blessed it?

 

[tango]

Plus it has the image of Jesus on it.

So what if it has the image of a generic male figure that we assume in Jesus on it?

 

[Stravinsk]

Can one steal an earthly item from a dead man? I don't think so. However, if he had loved ones/relatives he had left a will to, then it would be stealing from them. Otherwise, how can it still be his?

 

[Albion]

i disagree. I think a lot of crucifix necklaces, if not most, have been blessed.

Some, yes. Most, no.

 

[tango]

Can one steal an earthly item from a dead man? I don't think so. However, if he had loved ones/relatives he had left a will to, then it would be stealing from them. Otherwise, how can it still be his?

I suppose technically you'd be stealing from his estate, on the basis that until the will is processed it doesn't belong to the heirs yet.

 

[Faith]

Some, yes. Most, no.

Most of the Catholics I know have theirs blessed.

 

[Faith]

Why would you assume such a thing?

Even if you're right, what difference does it make? How does stealing something from a dead person become somehow worse because a priest blessed it?

If you’ve ever been Catholic, and I don’t think you have, you’d understand. For the same reason blessed palms must be incinerated instead of thrown away. It’s a Catholic thing. Or it’s sort of the same reason a Communion Host being stolen after Consecration is worse than stealing one prior to that, though the Crucifix is a sacramental and the Host is a Sacrament.

 

[tango]

If you’ve ever been Catholic, and I don’t think you have, you’d understand. For the same reason blessed palms must be incinerated instead of thrown away. It’s a Catholic thing. Or it’s sort of the same reason a Communion Host being stolen after Consecration is worse than stealing one prior to that, though the Crucifix is a sacramental and the Host is a Sacrament.

An awful lot of people who wear crosses aren't Catholic. In any event, it's still far from clear why it's worse to steal something because it has religious value to the owner or why it's worse to steal something that someone blessed.

Your comment about stealing the communion is an assertion that doesn't prove your point, it's simply stating the same belief as if it changed anything.

 

[Faith]

An awful lot of people who wear crosses aren't Catholic. In any event, it's still far from clear why it's worse to steal something because it has religious value to the owner or why it's worse to steal something that someone blessed.

Your comment about stealing the communion is an assertion that doesn't prove your point, it's simply stating the same belief as if it changed anything.

We’ll just have to agree to disagree.

 

[Lees]

Whether a crucifix is blessed or not doesn't matter to me. The fact that it represents the Cross of Christ does.

What might ask, 'how about the real Cross on which Jesus died'? If someone had the wood today from that Cross...would you steal it? I mean...it's just wood?

One who steals a crucifix reveals a disdain for the things of God and Christ.

I believe I have told these true stories before on this forum. Years ago, in the military, I had two similar events. Was overseas. Wasn't walking with the Lord. Me and others were sitting around drinking and so on. Marijuana was present also being passed around. But then we ran out of papers. No problem one man said. He took out his pocket New Testament, we all were issued, and ripped some pages out and rolled another one. I couldn't believe it. When it came around to me, I told them, no way man. No way. But to others, it didn't matter.

During that same military time, I was in some barracks. We were all field-daying the barracks. (Clean up) A man near me was sweeping and asked if I had a dust pan. I said no. Again, no problem he said. He too had a Bible , which was normal size, and ripped the front cover off to use as a dust pan. Again, I couldn't believe it. I said what are you doing? That's a Bible. He said, it doesn't matter. Ill just throw it away, and he threw it and the cover he ripped off in the trash can. I asked, do you mind if I have it? He said no. So I took it out of the trash. I have both it and the ripped off cover today.

My point is, the things we associate with God and Christ have meaning to the believer. But to the non-believer they mean nothing.

Lees

 

[tango]

We’ll just have to agree to disagree.

I suspect so. I wonder if we're disagreeing over the issue of something having a special meaning to the person who lost it, compared to the law taking a neutral stance and looking at the financial value rather than the sentimental or emotional value. From a legal perspective all the law can do is consider an objectively measureable value because otherwise anyone could claim that a worthless trinket was priceless to them because of (reasons) and there would be no way to determine whether something really had such value.

I think of a fork I have in my kitchen. It used to belong to my mother and she used it for mixing stuff when she was baking. I think her mother used it before her. It's so worn the tines on the fork fit neatly into the curvature of a mixing bowl. From a purely objective perspective it's a fork much like any other fork except less useful, but it's worth something to me. If someone stole it I'd be much more upset about that fork than about any of the other forks in the same drawer but the legal system wouldn't punish them for stealing it because what they stole has no objectively measurable value.

 

[prism]

Perhaps it was a GOLD chain and the crucifix was attached, this coroner was after ?

A Los Angeles County coroner’s investigator has been arrested on suspicion of stealing a gold chain and crucifix from around the neck of a dead man, prosecutors said Wednesday.