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Infant Baptism, Yea or Nay?

Webster

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Reformation Red Pill Podcast: Episode 22 - A Biblical Defense of Infant Baptism
On this week's episode of The Reformation Red Pill Podcast, Joshua Haymes, and Robert Murphy outline the arguments that convinced them of the Paedobaptist position.

Been listening to the Reformation Red Pill Podcast (TL/DR: Interesting podcast but there are a bunch of points that, as an Adventist, I have contention with those in the Reformed/Calvinist camp over) and one of those contentions is over baptism. For the record, I believe one should be baptized only at the age in which they are able to understand (the age of responsibility) and not as an infant (what is known as paedobaptism) or after acceptance of the Lord Jesus Christ as one's Lord and Savior.

So, what's your opinion on the subject of infant baptism, everyone?
 

Lamb

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Jesus said to baptize all nations, and that includes infants. God is the one who baptizes using the water along with His promises He's attached, so definitely baptize infants as long as there is a plan to teach them the way of faith. Baptizing and teaching is how disciples are made.
 

tango

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I personally wouldn't baptise an infant. To me baptism is a personal decision to repent of sin and follow Jesus, and I don't see that as something that can be done on your behalf.

I don't have a problem with dedicating a child to God, acknowledging that the child is a gift and accepting the responsibility to raise the child in accordance with Scripture, encouraging the child to make their own commitment to follow Jesus when they understand what it means.

I was baptised as an infant, and I do not regard it as having any significance whatsoever in my spiritual life. When I made my own commitment to follow Jesus, as an adult, I was baptised as an adult with the understanding of what I was doing.
 

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ARE INFANTS IN NEED OF THE BLESSINGS THAT BAPTISM GIVES?

Psalm 51:5.
Surely I was sinful at birth, sinful from the time my mother conceived me.

Ecclesiastes 7:20. For there is not a just man on earth who does good and does not sin.

Romans 3:20. For all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God.

John 3:6. That which is born of the flesh is flesh, and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.

Romans 8:7. For the mind that is set on the flesh is hostile to God, for it does not submit to God's law; indeed, it cannot.

Ephesians 2:1. And you were dead in your trespasses and sins.
 

Lamb

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ARE INFANTS CAPABLE OF RECEIVING GOD’S BLESSINGS?

Luke 1:15.
For he [John the Baptist] will be great in the sight of the Lord; and he will drink no wine or liquor, and he will be filled with the Holy Spirit while yet in his mother's womb.

Luke 1:41-44. When Elizabeth heard Mary's greeting, the baby leaped in her womb; and Elizabeth was filled with the Holy Spirit. And she cried out with a loud voice and said, 'Blessed are you among women, and blessed is the fruit of your womb! And how has it happened to me, that the mother of my Lord would come to me? For behold, when the sound of your greeting reached my ears, the baby leaped in my womb for joy.'"

* John the Baptist is an example of the Holy Spirit being active in an infant. Since Baptism is associated with receiving the Holy Spirit (Acts 2:38), this indicates that infants can receive this benefit of Baptism. We are not to deny this gift to children, but are to bring them to Him for this blessing.

Luke 18:15-17. And they were bringing even their babies to Him so that He would touch them, but when the disciples saw it, they began rebuking them. But Jesus called for them, saying, 'Permit the children to come to Me, and do not hinder them, for the kingdom of God belongs to such as these. Truly I say to you, whoever does not receive the kingdom of God like a child will not enter it at all.''

* Note: The Greek word translated “babies” in this passage (brephe) referred to children in the womb and newborns. These were babies, not older children.

* Note: Our Lord Jesus clearly states that infants can receive the kingdom of God. Since they were sinful from conception, and because that which is born of the flesh is flesh (which is hostile to God), this means that it must also be possible for infants to be born of the Spirit — otherwise, they could not receive the kingdom of God.

Matthew 18:1-6. At that time the disciples came to Jesus and said, “Who then is greatest in the kingdom of heaven?'' And He called a child to Himself and set him before them, and said, “Truly I say to you, unless you are converted and become like children, you will not enter the kingdom of heaven Whoever then humbles himself as this child, he is the greatest in the kingdom of heaven. And whoever receives one such child in My name receives Me; but whoever causes one of these little ones who believe in Me to stumble, it would be better for him to have a heavy millstone hung around his neck, and to be drowned in the depth of the sea."

Matthew 21:15-16. But when the chief priests and the teachers of the law saw the wonderful things he did and the children shouting in the temple area, "Hosanna to the Son of David," they were indignant. "Do you hear what these children are saying?" they asked him. "Yes," replied Jesus, "have you never read, 'From the lips of children and infants you have ordained praise'?"

* Note: Since we already know from God’s Word that infants can receive the Holy Spirit and can receive the kingdom of God, it should not surprise us that Jesus here refers to small children believing in Him (which could also be translated as having faith in Him) and children and infants praising Him. It is the Holy Spirit who creates faith, and the kingdom of God is received by faith.

* Note: Since Jesus says that small children can believe in Him, we can properly speak of small children who are believers in Christ — “Christians.” If they are capable of being Christians, they should not be denied Baptism.

* Note: This (small children being believers) is reflected in early Christian tomb inscriptions. The faith of infants is also referred to in the writings of important teachers in the early church (such as Augustine). Following are quotes from a few pastors and theologians about the faith of these little ones who believe in Christ:
 

Lamb

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ARE THERE ANY INDICATIONS IN THE BIBLE THAT INFANTS WERE BAPTIZED?

Colossians 2:11-12.
In Him you were also circumcised with a circumcision made without hands, in the removal of the body of the flesh by the circumcision of Christ, having been buried with Him in Baptism, in which you were also raised up with Him through faith in the working of God, who raised Him from the dead.

* Note: Circumcision was a rite associated almost exclusively with infants (eight days old). It would be odd to refer to Baptism as the “circumcision of Christ” if Baptism of infants was to be forbidden while circumcision was given almost exclusively to infants. (Note also that infants did receive Jewish proselyte baptism.)

Acts 2:37-39. Now when they heard this they were cut to the heart, and said to Peter and the rest of the apostles, "Brothers, what shall we do?" And Peter said to them, "Repent and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins, and you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit. For the promise is for you and for your children and for all who are far off, everyone whom the Lord our God calls to himself."

Acts 16:14-15. One of those listening was a woman named Lydia, a dealer in purple cloth from the city of Thyatira, who was a worshiper of God. The Lord opened her heart to respond to Paul's message. When she and the members of her household were baptized, she invited us to her home.

1 Corinthians 1:16. Yes, I also baptized the household of Stephanas. `

Acts 16:33. And he took them that very hour of the night and washed their wounds, and immediately he was baptized, he and all his household.

* Note: Households included all members of the family (which usually included extended family) as well as servants and their families. For this reason, it would be unlikely that none of the households referred to above included a baby.
 

tango

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Arguing that children are sinful is all well and good but where does it stop? The guy down the road from me is, as far as I can tell, not a Christian. He needs God's saving grace, Should I throw some water over him and consider him to be baptized, citing the many verses indicating that he needs salvation?

The primary issue for me is the simple concept of informed consent. When I am ready I can repent of my sins. Nobody else can repent of my sins for me. So "repent and be baptized" isn't fulfilled if someone is dunked in the water (or sprinkled, or whatever else) without repenting, and they can't repent until they understand that they need to repent.
 

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Arguing that children are sinful is all well and good but where does it stop? The guy down the road from me is, as far as I can tell, not a Christian. He needs God's saving grace, Should I throw some water over him and consider him to be baptized, citing the many verses indicating that he needs salvation?

The primary issue for me is the simple concept of informed consent. When I am ready I can repent of my sins. Nobody else can repent of my sins for me. So "repent and be baptized" isn't fulfilled if someone is dunked in the water (or sprinkled, or whatever else) without repenting, and they can't repent until they understand that they need to repent.

Jesus told the disciples how to make disciples and that's by baptizing and teaching. So throwing water and not teaching about the Savior and forgiveness of sins would do no good, correct? But baptizing and teaching is what Jesus wants.
 

jswauto

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✦ Infant / Child Baptism

It is not about the child’s personal decision, but the parent's commitment to protect and raise the child properly and of course: their opening up to: God’s claim on the child.
 
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hobie

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Reformation Red Pill Podcast: Episode 22 - A Biblical Defense of Infant Baptism

Been listening to the Reformation Red Pill Podcast (TL/DR: Interesting podcast but there are a bunch of points that, as an Adventist, I have contention with those in the Reformed/Calvinist camp over) and one of those contentions is over baptism. For the record, I believe one should be baptized only at the age in which they are able to understand (the age of responsibility) and not as an infant (what is known as paedobaptism) or after acceptance of the Lord Jesus Christ as one's Lord and Savior.

So, what's your opinion on the subject of infant baptism, everyone?
Well the Calvinist say it does matter as you are 'predestined' so can skip it, do it any which way and are fine. The devil is clever how he twists it...
 

Webster

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Well the Calvinist say it does matter as you are 'predestined' so can skip it, do it any which way and are fine.
I've long thought that is as close to a "get out of jail free card" as you will find in Christianity.
If true, then I can well see people who get away with murder knowing they're predestined to go to heaven while others who've lived a righteous life are destined to hell. What kind of Christianity is that?!?
 

hobie

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I've long thought that is as close to a "get out of jail free card" as you will find in Christianity.
If true, then I can well see people who get away with murder knowing they're predestined to go to heaven while others who've lived a righteous life are destined to hell. What kind of Christianity is that?!?
That is the flaw in this view as you can justify any sin by saying you are 'locked in'...
 
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