How do you handle persecution based on a lie?

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1689Dave

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I've seen this before in "Christian" forums and depending on the source, you are without defense. This happens too in everyday life where I early on coined the phrase "I've been treated the worst by the best"
 
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Lamb

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Some people claim they're being persecuted when they aren't wanting to follow someone else's boundaries. How do you handle that? You follow their boundaries or you leave the forum. Don't go around telling people that they're lying in a lot of threads just because they call you out on something. That's my advice.
 

1689Dave

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Some people claim they're being persecuted when they aren't wanting to follow someone else's boundaries. How do you handle that? You follow their boundaries or you leave the forum. Don't go around telling people that they're lying in a lot of threads just because they call you out on something. That's my advice.
Some people are accused by those who should understand bible doctrine but don't. “Believest thou not that I am in the Father, and the Father in me? the words that I speak unto you I speak not of myself: but the Father that dwelleth in me, he doeth the works.” John 14:10 (KJV 1900)

Lied about when Jesus teaches the same.
 

Lamb

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Some people are accused by those who should understand bible doctrine but don't.

Some people think they know more than others and go to forums to "teach" them that other Christians are wrong and they're right even though other Christians correct their heresies.
 

1689Dave

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Some people think they know more than others and go to forums to "teach" them that other Christians are wrong and they're right even though other Christians correct their heresies.
I study a lot and check myself out with the creeds before saying anything on the internet. I believe your lack of time spent in the Ecumenical creeds and scripture gave rise to my persecution on this board and your false accusations about me. When Jesus says: “Believest thou not that I am in the Father, and the Father in me? the words that I speak unto you I speak not of myself: but the Father that dwelleth in me, he doeth the works.” John 14:10 (KJV 1900) He proves it. Also;

“To wit, that God [the indivisible Trinity] was in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself, not imputing their trespasses unto them; and hath committed unto us the word of reconciliation.” 2 Corinthians 5:19 (KJV 1900)
 
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Albion

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I study a lot and check myself out with the creeds before saying anything on the internet.
If you actually did careful study you wouldn't always be coming up with some crackpot theory and then pontificating on how stupid 2000 years of Christian wisdom and study has been.

The Trinity isn't the Trinity to you, the message of salvation isn't accepted by you, Faith doesn't figure into it at all, all churches and denominations are unworthy of you, and of course, all the great figures of Christian history were phonies or villains.

The truth is that you enjoy the idea that you have acquired some sort of 'edge' over conventional Christians every time you find some alternate way of looking at both Scripture and history...and you have to demonstrate it wherever possible.

Other people have gone through the same process. Many of the most admired Christian thinkers of our own times went down the road of accepting, then doubting, then adhering to their new alternative, and then finally really understanding the truth that was there all along. Perhaps you will too.
 

1689Dave

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If you actually did careful study you wouldn't always be coming up with some crackpot theory and then pontificating on how stupid 2000 years of Christian wisdom and study has been.

The Trinity isn't the Trinity to you, the message of salvation isn't accepted by you, Faith doesn't figure into it at all, all churches and denominations are unworthy of you, and of course, all the great figures of Christian history were phonies or villains.

The truth is that you enjoy the idea that you have acquired some sort of 'edge' over conventional Christians every time you find some alternate way of looking at both Scripture and history...and you have to demonstrate it wherever possible.

Younger people go through a phase that is much the same. What they learned as children is sooner or later seen to be superficial, but then they learn more and begin to see themselves as smart for having discovered some religious theory that ordinary churchgoers never heard of. Of course they want to tell everyone about it, too. Many of the most admired Christian thinkers of our own times went through the same process of accepting, then doubting, then adhering to the new alternative, and then finally really understanding the truth that was there all along. Perhaps you will too.
Prove from any of the Ecumenical Creeds what you say about me is true. Not to mention scripture. Or be proven a liar.
 

Lucian Hodoboc

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I study a lot and check myself out with the creeds before saying anything on the internet.
How have you come to the conclusion that the creeds are infallible pillars of authority? How do you know that what they say is correct?
 

1689Dave

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The Creeds become more detailed over time. So as scripture says: “.... in the multitude of counsellers there is safety.” Proverbs 11:14 (KJV 1900)
 

Lucian Hodoboc

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So as scripture says: “.... in the multitude of counsellers there is safety.” Proverbs 11:14
How have you come to the conclusion that the scripture that says this is an infallible pillar of authority? How do you know that what it says is correct? As opposed to scripture of other religions, I mean.
 

1689Dave

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How have you come to the conclusion that the scripture that says this is an infallible pillar of authority? How do you know that what it says is correct? As opposed to scripture of other religions, I mean.
The saved hear Jesus' voice and follow him. The rest are confused by it in spiritual matters.
 

Josiah

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Lied about when Jesus teaches the same.


I find it common among false teachers and heretics that ...


1. They themselves CLAIM for they themselves alone that they are especially guided by the Holy Spirit, that they are just ever so brilliant and superior in brain, and that THEY uniquely understand. The rest of Christianity is just wrong cuz they are right. They don't care about the words in Scripture, they don't care about the church fathers or church councils or the witness of the church because the Holy Spirit only teaches ONE (them) and there is only ONE who infallibly learns and follows the Holy Spirit (them).


2. They hold that the Holy Spirit did a really HORRIBLE job of inspiring the Scriptures. Indeed, the Spirit never got it right. BUT (thanks be to God) THEY uniquely and individually know what the Holy Spirit should have inspired (if He didn't goof so often). They'll even quote Scripture but deny the words there, changing them to correct the Spirit (adding a "NO" or "NOT" or "ONLY" etc. to correct God). They hold that God really appreciates their corrections. So much of "Ignore that the Bible states, what it MEANS is ... well... whatever I say it does."


3. They won't discuss, they can't listen. Because they themselves hold that they themselves can't be wrong. God can be (and often is the words He put in the Bible) but they cannot. They claim more for self than the Pope does because they don't have to agree with the church or councils, just themself. False teachers just rant.... on and on and on and on... never listening, never thinking, just regurgitating the same falsehoods ad nausium. False teachings often piled on top of each other like garbage. They are like deadly black holes - just trying to suck in others (misery loves company). And they HATE it when anything or anyone gets in their way. (Hey, want to get their goat? Just quote John 3:16 to them, always seems to get them mad).



@Lamb

False teachers are always looking for new territory, fresh meat, new folks to such into their black hole, longing for those who will bow before them in utter adoration, those they can rip away from historic, biblical Christianity, those for whom they can destroy the Gospel.

Problem is, they quickly turn off Christians. At most sites, Christians just write them off as the false teachers they are. They rather quickly shoot themselves in the foot, and occasionally engage in flaming others at the site (which just turns off even more). Their "audience" grows smaller and smaller and may vanish completely. And staff grows tired of their flaming, spamming and complaints to staff - and eventually ban them. And so they look for fresh meat.

I hold that discussion forums like this should be open. Let them shoot themselves in the foot, let them prove their error, let them destroy their audience. BUT here's MY problem: I have a hard time letting heresy go.... letting a false teacher destroy the gospel and damage faith - especially of new or simply vulnerable believers. You can't tell the heretic anything (they don't listen, they won't read things, they won't think) BUT it's hard to me to leave HORRIBLE error up for all to see and not respond. Even though sometimes this only feeds them (Black holes suck in everything).


Merry Christmas to you and yours...


- Josiah




.
 
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1689Dave

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I find it common among false teachers and heretics that ...


1. They themselves CLAIM for they themselves alone that they are especially guided by the Holy Spirit, that they are just ever so brilliant and superior in brain, and that THEY uniquely understand. The rest of Christianity is just wrong cuz they are right. They can't care about the words in Scripture, they don't care about the church fathers or church councils or the witness of the church because the Holy Spirit only teaches ONE (them) and there is only ONE who infallibly learns and follows (them).


2. They hold that the Holy Spirit did a really HORRIBLE job of inspiring the Scriptures. Indeed, the Spirit never got it right. BUT (thanks be to God) THEY uniquely and individually know what the Holy Spirit should have inspired (if He didn't goof so often). They'll even quote Scripture but deny the words there, changing them to correct the Spirit (adding a "NO" or "NOT" or "ONLY" etc. to correct God). They hold that God really appreciates their corrections. So much of "Ignore that the Bible states, what it MEANS is ... well... the opposite."


3. They won't discuss, they can't be talked to. Because they themselves hold that they themselves can't be wrong. God can be (and often is the words He put in the Bible) but they cannot be. They claim more for self than the Pope does because they don't have to agree with the church or councils, just themself. False teachers just rant.... on and on and on and on... never listening, never thinking, just regurgitating the same falsehoods ad nausium. They are like deadly black holes - just trying to suck in others (misery loves company). And they HATE it when anything or anyone gets in their way.



@Lamb

False teachers are always looking for new territory, new folks to such into their black hole, longing for those who will bow before them in utter adoration, those they can rip away from historic, biblical Christianity, those for whom they can destroy the Gospel.

Probably is, they quickly turn off Christians. At most sites, Christians just right them off as the false teachers they are. They rather quickly shoot themselves in the foot, and occasionally engage in flaming others at the site (which just turns off even more). Their "audience" grows smaller and smaller and may vanish completely. And staff grows tired of their flaming, spamming and complaints to staff - and eventually ban them. And so they look for fresh meat.

I hold that discussion forums like this should be open. Let them shoot themselves in the foot, let them prove their error, let them destroy their audience. BUT here's MY problem: I have a hard time letting heresy go.... letting a false teacher destroy the gospel and damage faith - especially of new or simply vulnerable believers. You can't tell the heretic anything (they don't listen, they won't read things, they won't think) BUT it's hard to me to leave HORRIBLE error up for all to see and not respond. Even though sometimes this only feeds like (Black holes such in everything).


Merry Christmas to you and yours...


- Josiah




.
Only God knows the truth about my heart-held beliefs. Hatred only calls me a liar. And I know them by their fruits. You and a few others need to repent. If you cannot, it's because God hardened you in sin.
 

Lucian Hodoboc

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The saved hear Jesus' voice and follow him. The rest are confused by it in spiritual matters.
Are you able to describe this voice to the unsaved ones? What does it sound like?
 

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Lucian Hodoboc

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They turn it into a "Jesus" idol they think is Jesus.
Who turns what into a "Jesus" idol?
The unsaved turn the voice of Jesus into an idol?
 

1689Dave

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Who turns what into a "Jesus" idol?
The unsaved turn the voice of Jesus into an idol?
Any human being who is not born again. They have only the wicked flesh they can call on and it loves false religion.
 

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This thread is in a non-debate area of the site so I'm closing this thread.
 
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