Discussions on the Sabbath & Resting in Jesus

[jswauto]

And those are irrelevant as the Sabbath long predates the Mosaic law, Bruce.

You're not speaking of the Ten Commandments but creation, is that correct?

 

[mailmandan]

And those are irrelevant as the Sabbath long predates the Mosaic law, Bruce.

Now although God's rest on the seventh day (Genesis 2:3) did foreshadow a future sabbath law, there is no Biblical record of the sabbath being kept before the children of Israel left the land of Egypt. *Nowhere in Scripture is there any hint that sabbath keeping was practiced from Adam to Moses. The word "sabbath" first appears in Exodus 16:23 - Then he said to them, “This is what the Lord has said: ‘Tomorrow is a sabbath rest, a holy sabbath to the Lord. Bake what you will bake today, and boil what you will boil; and lay up for yourselves all that remains, to be kept until morning. Sabbath observance was a sign between God and Israel: “The Israelites are to observe the sabbath, celebrating it for the generations to come as a lasting covenant. It will be a sign between me and the Israelites forever, for in six days the Lord made the heavens and the earth, and on the seventh day he abstained from work and rested.” (Exodus 31:16-17)

 

[Webster]

Now although God's rest on the seventh day (Genesis 2:3) did foreshadow a future sabbath law, there is no Biblical record of the sabbath being kept before the children of Israel left the land of Egypt. *Nowhere in Scripture is there any hint that sabbath keeping was practiced from Adam to Moses. The word "sabbath" first appears in Exodus 16:23 - Then he said to them, “This is what the Lord has said: ‘Tomorrow is a sabbath rest, a holy sabbath to the Lord. Bake what you will bake today, and boil what you will boil; and lay up for yourselves all that remains, to be kept until morning. Sabbath observance was a sign between God and Israel: “The Israelites are to observe the sabbath, celebrating it for the generations to come as a lasting covenant. It will be a sign between me and the Israelites forever, for in six days the Lord made the heavens and the earth, and on the seventh day he abstained from work and rested.” (Exodus 31:16-17)

We're both good, decent Christian folk so I assume you follow, like I do, the Ten Commandments....remind me again why we should follow all of them except for the 4th Commandment, the one on the Sabbath? I've asked that question to many a Sunday keeper and I've yet to get a decent, factual and most importantly, Biblical answer.

But I'll present one for you as a counterpoint....

(Sabbath Truth) In 1 Corinthians 16:1-3, the apostle Paul writes, "Now concerning the collection for the saints, as I have given orders to the churches of Galatia, so you must do also: On the first day of the week let each one of you lay something aside, storing up as he may prosper, that there be no collections when I come. And when I come, whomever you approve by your letters I will send to bear your gift to Jerusalem."

In this passage, the apostle was writing a special appeal to the churches in Asia Minor. Famine conditions were not unusual in areas of the Middle East (see Acts 11:28-30), and at the time, many of the Christians in Jerusalem were suffering greatly. Paul asked the church at Corinth to "lay something aside" until he could send helpers to transport the collection to Jerusalem. The expression 'lay something aside' in the original Greek comes with the connotation of putting something aside at home. Even Sunday-worship advocates agree with this interpretation.

Thus, there was no religious meeting held on the first day of the week and no collection plate passed at church on Sunday. Instead, they were to gather and store up their donations at home on that day.

If there was no religious meeting on Sunday, why did Paul specifically suggest that this work be done on Sunday? Simply, the letter would have been shared with the church on the Sabbath when they were all gathered for worship, and the first opportunity for them to do the work would be the next day - the first day of the week.

>"Now I am going to Jerusalem to minister to the saints. For it pleased those from Macedonia and Achaia to make a certain contribution for the poor among the saints who are in Jerusalem. It pleased them indeed, and they are their debtors. For if the Gentiles have been partakers of their spiritual things, their duty is also to minister to them in material things. Therefore, when I have performed this and have sealed to them this fruit, I shall go by way of you to Spain' (Romans 15:25-28).

Here the apostle touched a tender spot in his eloquent appeal. The Roman Christians owed a great debt of gratitude to the church in Jerusalem, which had sent teachers to evangelize them. Paul urged them to return material gifts in appreciation of the spiritual truths received. He described it as sealing to them 'this fruit.' The Greek word used here is 'karpos,' which is the universal term used for literal fruit. It can also have the connotation of 'fruits of one's labor.

Thus, in these verses, the reference to the day of Sunday gives no indication of a change in religious observance.

Thus, when Paul mentions Sunday as he does, he's not mentioning it in terms of worship but in terms of work; they still observed the Sabbath on the day before and didn't begin the work in question until the first day of the week, Sunday.

 

[mailmandan]

We're both good, decent Christian folk so I assume you follow, like I do, the Ten Commandments....remind me again why we should follow all of them except for the 4th Commandment, the one on the Sabbath? I've asked that question to many a Sunday keeper and I've yet to get a decent, factual and most importantly, Biblical answer.

But I'll present one for you as a counterpoint....

Thus, when Paul mentions Sunday as he does, he's not mentioning it in terms of worship but in terms of work; they still observed the Sabbath on the day before and didn't begin the work in question until the first day of the week, Sunday.

I'll start here. Since the old covenant has been made obsolete, does this leave us with no moral direction? Absolutely not. God made obsolete the old covenant to legally put into place the new covenant. (2 Corinthians 3:6-9; Hebrews 8:6-13) The life of discipleship flows out of the new command, to love one another as He loved us (John 13:34), which Paul refers to as the "law of Christ." (Galatians 6:2) Love fulfills the law. (Romans 13:8-10) Out of this single command comes other commands, including references for the moral aspect of 9 of the 10 commandments from the Old Testament law which are reiterated under the new covenant, yet the command to keep the sabbath day is not binding on Christians under the new covenant. (Colossians 2:16-17)

1. You shall have no other gods before Me. - Acts 14:15
2. You shall make no idols. - 1 John 5:21
3. You shall not take the name of the Lord your God in vain. - 1 Timothy 6:1; James 2:7; James 5:12
4. Keep the Sabbath day holy. - Not binding on the Church - Colossians 2:16-17
5. Honor your father and your mother. - Ephesians 6:1-2
6. You shall not murder. - Romans 13:9-10; 1 John 3:15
7. You shall not commit adultery. - Romans 13:9-10; 1 Corinthians 6:9-10
8. You shall not steal. - Romans 13:9-10; Ephesians 4:28
9. You shall not bear false witness against your neighbor. - Romans 13:9-10; Colossians 3:9-10
10. You shall not covet. - Romans 13:9-10; Ephesians 5:3

Hebrews 4:9 - There remains a Sabbath rest for the people of God. (NASB) Everyone should take note that the Greek word "sabbatismos" here is used nowhere else in the Bible. I often hear Sabbatarians suggest that this is the word for "keeping the weekly sabbath" when it is never used anywhere else in the Bible!

W. E. Vine, Greek Dictionary points out:

Sabbath rest (4520) (sabbatismos from sabbatízo = keep the Sabbath) literally means a keeping of a sabbath or a keeping of days of rest. It is used in this passage not in the literal sense (meaning to keep a specific day, the "Sabbath" day) but to describe a period of rest for God’s people which is modeled after and is a fulfillment of the traditional Sabbath.

SABBATISMOS a Sabbath-keeping, is used in Heb. 4:9, R.V., "a Sabbath rest," A.V. marg., "a keeping of a Sabbath" (akin to sabbatizoµ, to keep the Sabbath, used, e.g., in Ex. 16:30, not in the N.T.); here the Sabbath-keeping is the perpetual Sabbath rest to be enjoyed uninterruptedly by believers in their fellowship with the Father and the Son, in contrast to the weekly Sabbath under the Law.

Because this Sabbath rest is the rest of God Himself, its full fruition is yet future, though believers now enter into it. In whatever way they enter into divine “rest,” that which they enjoy is involved in an indissoluble relation with God. (Vine's Expository Dictionary of New Testament Words)

Sabbath rest (4520) sabbatismos by Greek Word Studies

Sabbath rest (4520) (sabbatismos from sabbatízo = keep the Sabbath) literally means a keeping of a sabbath or a keeping of days of rest. It is used in this passage not in the literal sense (meaning...

www.bibleportal.com

 

[Frankj]

I'll start here. Since the old covenant has been made obsolete, does this leave us with no moral direction? Absolutely not. God made obsolete the old covenant to legally put into place the new covenant. (2 Corinthians 3:6-9; Hebrews 8:6-13) The life of discipleship flows out of the new command, to love one another as He loved us (John 13:34), which Paul refers to as the "law of Christ." (Galatians 6:2) Love fulfills the law. (Romans 13:8-10) Out of this single command comes other commands, including references for the moral aspect of 9 of the 10 commandments from the Old Testament law which are reiterated under the new covenant, yet the command to keep the sabbath day is not binding on Christians under the new covenant. (Colossians 2:16-17)

1. You shall have no other gods before Me. - Acts 14:15
2. You shall make no idols. - 1 John 5:21
3. You shall not take the name of the Lord your God in vain. - 1 Timothy 6:1; James 2:7; James 5:12
4. Keep the Sabbath day holy. - Not binding on the Church - Colossians 2:16-17
5. Honor your father and your mother. - Ephesians 6:1-2
6. You shall not murder. - Romans 13:9-10; 1 John 3:15
7. You shall not commit adultery. - Romans 13:9-10; 1 Corinthians 6:9-10
8. You shall not steal. - Romans 13:9-10; Ephesians 4:28
9. You shall not bear false witness against your neighbor. - Romans 13:9-10; Colossians 3:9-10
10. You shall not covet. - Romans 13:9-10; Ephesians 5:3

Hebrews 4:9 - There remains a Sabbath rest for the people of God. (NASB) Everyone should take note that the Greek word "sabbatismos" here is used nowhere else in the Bible. I often hear Sabbatarians suggest that this is the word for "keeping the weekly sabbath" when it is never used anywhere else in the Bible!

W. E. Vine, Greek Dictionary points out:

Sabbath rest (4520) (sabbatismos from sabbatízo = keep the Sabbath) literally means a keeping of a sabbath or a keeping of days of rest. It is used in this passage not in the literal sense (meaning to keep a specific day, the "Sabbath" day) but to describe a period of rest for God’s people which is modeled after and is a fulfillment of the traditional Sabbath.

SABBATISMOS a Sabbath-keeping, is used in Heb. 4:9, R.V., "a Sabbath rest," A.V. marg., "a keeping of a Sabbath" (akin to sabbatizoµ, to keep the Sabbath, used, e.g., in Ex. 16:30, not in the N.T.); here the Sabbath-keeping is the perpetual Sabbath rest to be enjoyed uninterruptedly by believers in their fellowship with the Father and the Son, in contrast to the weekly Sabbath under the Law.

Because this Sabbath rest is the rest of God Himself, its full fruition is yet future, though believers now enter into it. In whatever way they enter into divine “rest,” that which they enjoy is involved in an indissoluble relation with God. (Vine's Expository Dictionary of New Testament Words)

Sabbath rest (4520) sabbatismos by Greek Word Studies

Sabbath rest (4520) (sabbatismos from sabbatízo = keep the Sabbath) literally means a keeping of a sabbath or a keeping of days of rest. It is used in this passage not in the literal sense (meaning...

www.bibleportal.com

Where is Sunday indicated as a replacement to Saturday as a holy day?

 

[mailmandan]

Where is Sunday indicated as a replacement to Saturday as a holy day?

Sunday has not replaced Saturday as the Sabbath day. Christians worship on Sunday as a memorial of the resurrection of Jesus Christ. While the New Testament describes Christians gathering together on Sunday (first day of the week) to break bread and lay something aside, storing up as he may prosper, (Acts 20:7; 1 Corinthians 16:2) which we see in Sunday worship services in Christian assemblies, our worship is not limited merely to one day of the week. We are free to worship the Lord every day.