Common Figure of Speech?

[psalms 91]

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In Post # 39 we saw that the Jewish shops were closed long before the women who were with Jesus at His crucifixion and accompanied His body and watched as it was buried, had time to shop for the spices. (Quite apart from the Inspired Biblical Record telling us that the women bought spices after the sabbath – which must have been the first of two, because they then rested on the sabbath after preparing those spices – a second sabbath.)

But not to be deprived of a last-ditch stand, the Friday-Sunday belief-cherishers have yet one last card in reserve. They say that the shops run by the pagans (gentiles) in their midst would have remained open, and the women would have bought the spices there.

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There are two rather obvious problems with that argument.

The first is that a strong priority of the Roman occupiers was to keep the peace – to keep the lid on unrest. It was that consideration that prompted Pontius Pilate’s capitulation to the restive Jewish crowd. (A mishandling of a later incident led to his ultimate recall to Rome.) If the gentiles had tried to keep their shops open, there would have been a riot. Those shopkeepers would have been in big trouble with the Roman authorities, and they knew it.

But more importantly, let’s have a look at Acts 10:27-28 – Jewish Peter visiting the gentile Cornelius:
27 And as he talked with him, he went in, and found many that were come together.
28 And he said unto them, Ye know how that it is an unlawful thing for a man that is a Jew to keep company, or come unto one of another nation; but God hath shewed me that I should not call any man common or unclean.

The women wouldn’t have been seen dead walking into a gentile shop. Nor would they have considered using religiously contaminated (unclean) spices on the body of their Beloved One.

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The Holy Scripture is unequivocal. The rearguard actions fail.

There were two sabbaths and an intervening day between Jesus’ crucifixion and His resurrection.

He was in the tomb for three whole days (three days and three nights) just as He said He would be.

And the stated request of rstrats in Post #17 (Again, the topic request for examples is with regard to the commonality of forecasting a daytime or a night time when no part of the daytime or no part of the night time could occur.) has been satisfied by the example that has the most unequivocal evidence both from Scripture and from the religious cultural society of Jesus’ day.


And once again, Readers can reevaluate where their true loyalties actually lie, should they wish to.

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Eloquently put and backls up what I also said about two sabbeths.

 

[rstrats]

Pedrito,
"And the stated request of rstrats in Post #17 (Again, the topic request for examples is with regard to the commonality of forecasting a daytime or a night time when no part of the daytime or no part of the night time could occur.) has been satisfied..."

Actually, it hasn't. You have not provided any examples of instances where a night time or a daytime was forecast or said to be involved with an event when no part of a daytime or no part of a night time could have occurred.

 

[rstrats]

Eloquently put and backls up what I also said about two sabbeths.

That would be an issue for a different topic.

 

[SilkenBast]

Hi rstrats.

I know the answer to your dilemma, and I know 3 days and 3 nights means exactly that. The terms "after 3 days I will rise" and "rise on the 3rd day" are also literal.

I also know you will wonder about it your entire life as a Christian until you start to do certain things. Then you will be given the answer. Those certain things have to do with obedience and asking God for wisdom.

I could spell it out for you here, but it is against all the Christian denominations (that I am aware of) tradition and it will not be accepted. What I can say is this, all the statements above are true. Plainly, true. No special reckoning of days are needed, no need to move back the time to a point before Crucifixion. No obscure half witted dismissals of "just understand High Sabbath" as if that clears anything up. The answer is simple, but you must really seek it, trust God and have a will to obey. Then you will find it.

 

[rstrats]

SilkenBast,
re: "Then you will find it."

Actually, it's "them", i.e., examples from the period which show instances where a night time or a daytime was forecast or said to be involved with an event when no part of a daytime or no part of a night time could have occurred. And since it appears that you are not a 6th day of the week crucifixion advocate, you probably don't know of any.

 

[SilkenBast]

SilkenBast,
re: "Then you will find it."

Actually, it's "them", i.e., examples from the period which show instances where a night time or a daytime was forecast or said to be involved with an event when no part of a daytime or no part of a night time could have occurred. And since it appears that you are not a 6th day of the week crucifixion advocate, you probably don't know of any.

I have underlined your sentence as it appears strange to me. As it is either morning, evening, day or night, what possible time could you be referring to?

I accept that the crucifixion took place before a Sabbath, a High Sabbath in this case, and reject the notion of 2 sabbaths having occurred that week. That will of course not make sense on a purely linear timeline if the sign of Jonah is literal (which I believe it is), but that's ok, I don't need it to be because I understand all the terms used from a different perspective.

 

[rstrats]

SilkenBast,
re: "As it is either morning, evening, day or night, what possible time could you be referring to?"

All three. Why do you ask?

 

[rstrats]

Perhaps someone new visiting this topic may know of examples.

 

[rstrats]

It appears that there are no folks visiting this topic who believe that the crucifixion took place on the 6th day of the week.

 

[MoreCoffee]

It appears that there are no folks visiting this topic who believe that the crucifixion took place on the 6th day of the week.

On Friday? Don't the vast majority of Christians believe that the Lord, Jesus Christ, was crucified, died, and was buried on Good Friday and that he rose again from the dead on Sunday?

 

[rstrats]

MoreCoffee,
re: "Don't the vast majority of Christians believe that the Lord, Jesus Christ, was crucified, died, and was buried on Good Friday..."

I think that the majority do. However, it doesn't seem that any of them look in on this topic - at least none who believe that the "heart of the earth" is referring to the tomb or at the earliest to the moment when the Messiah's spirit left His body, and who try to reconcile the lack of a 3rd night by saying that the Messiah was employing a common figure of speech of the time.

 

[rstrats]

But perhaps someone new looking in may.

 

[rstrats]

Three of the more usual explanations that are given for the lack of a 3rd night with a 6th day of the week crucifixion/1st day of the week resurrection are:

1. The count of days and nights began when the Messiah was arrested at night in the Garden.

2. The 3 hours of darkness while the Messiah was on the cross was counted as the 1st night.

3. The Messiah was using common figure of speech of the period when He said that three days and three nights would be involved with His time in the "heart of the earth".

This topic is only concerned with the 3rd explanation, i.e., that it was common to say that a daytime or a night time would be involved with an event when no part of a daytime or no part of a night time could occur.

 

[rstrats]

Point #5 in the OP should be chaged to read: To account for the lack of a 3rd night, there may be some of those mentioned above who say that the Messiah was employing common figure of speech/colloquial language.

 

[rstrats]

Since it's been awhile, maybe someone new visiting this topic may know of examples.

 

[Michael]

Since it's been awhile, maybe someone new visiting this topic may know of examples.

My two cents...

It is commonly believed that all the events of John 18:1 - John 19:37 and Luke 22:47 - Luke 23:49 took place on the same day, and in fact within a brief 12 hour period.

The Scripture actually does not confirm this all absolutely occurred in that short time frame. Personally, I believe these events took place over the course of a few days.

And I do take the Lord as His Word, when He declared -
"For as Jonah was in the belly of the huge fish three days and three nights, so the Son of Man will be in the heart of the earth three days and three nights." - Matt 12:40 HCSB

As the Lord said specifically "three nights", I find it hard to accept that He was speaking of partial days.

But that it just my opinion. Have not yet received clear revelation on this.

God's Wisdom and Understanding to all.

 

[rstrats]

Michael,

I'm afraid your comments deal with issues for a different topic.

 

[Michael]

Michael,

I'm afraid your comments deal with issues for a different topic.

No need to be afraid!

You had mentioned the "three days, three nights" in your first point, so it brought to mind what I posted.

Peace' :ange06:

 

[rstrats]

Michael,
re: "You had mentioned the 'three days, three nights' in your first point, so it brought to mind what I posted."

OK, just so it's understood that the first 5 points are merely setting forth the requirements for the folks to whom this topic is directed, i.e., anyone who believes the crucifixion took place on the 6th day of the week, and thinks the "heart of the earth" refers to the tomb, and tries to explain the lack of a third night by saying that the Messiah was employing common figure of speech of the period.

 

[rstrats]

Someone new looking in may know of examples.