Circle game hand signal gets fan banned

[Lamb]

Chicago has failed big time and once again those who cry offense are getting their way and but now it's over a simple hand gesture that for years has been part of what's called the Circle Game. Even this 52 year old woman knows what the Circle Game is! I have former students as friends on Facebook who have posted the symbol for years and it's always been part of the game and not once has it been for white supremacy. How can I say that? Because one poster is black.

Chicago Cubs Ban Fan for Flashing 'White Supremacist' Sign, Otherwise Known as the OK Symbol

So the internet trolls decided to take a simple silly hand signal and convince others it was something that it wasn't...and the people fell for it. Ridiculous.

 

[psalms 91]

I hate this PC stuff

 

[vince284]

Maybe it has been adopted by hate groups? I don't know what the motive was for the Cubs Fan to make the gesture. Maybe he was playing the game with everyone on national TV. WGN is national right? It's still a "super-station".

https://www.thedailybeast.com/brenton-tarrant-idd-new-zealand-shooting-suspect

 

[Albion]

I am willing to bet that a "white supremacist" has been seen at one time or another giving "the finger" to someone...or a "thumbs up" sign...or maybe even the "live long and prosper" hand sign used by Mr. Spock.

The mystery here is why companies, advertisers, nationally known sports teams, and the like would immediately cave to the unsubstantiated demands and ridiculous reasoning conveyed to them by an email (!) or text written by an unknown person. But it happens all the time.

The companies that advertised on some TV program until told by an extremist who contacted them as part of an organized crusade to say they were no longer supposed to advertise there have lost my patronage forever. How many patrons do we suppose they gained compared to the people they lost??

 

[Andrew]

Three pointers signals should be banned from the NBA then...
let's just ruin everything and blame white people for it

 

[Albion]

One fascinating element in the NBC report is this:

"But his hand, which appeared in a frame behind analyst Doug Glanville, was positioned in the “OK" hand gesture, often associated with the white supremacist movement."

The fact is that virtually no one thought of that sign as a white supremacist gesture until networks like NBC started saying everybody should think of it as such. And another interesting note is that the "white supremacist movement" is not a movement. But that's NBC again for ya.

 

[Andrew]

One fascinating element in the NBC report is this:

"But his hand, which appeared in a frame behind analyst Doug Glanville, was positioned in the “OK" hand gesture, often associated with the white supremacist movement."

The fact is that virtually no one thought of that sign as a white supremacist gesture until networks like NBC started saying everybody should think of it as such. And another interesting note is that the "white supremacist movement" is not a movement. But that's NBC again for ya.

These so called "white supremacists" seem to be very well hidden and pretty harmless, seems to me that it's the networks that create the fear of these shy and quiet "white supremacists" boogie men

 

[Albion]

And all of that might be just passed off as the usual fake news that the media glory in these days, except that there are actual stormtroopers operating on behalf of the far left that rarely, if ever, get profiled or reported on by the media. And when Antifa does get a mention, that's about the sum total of all that appears.

 

[tango]

Maybe it has been adopted by hate groups? I don't know what the motive was for the Cubs Fan to make the gesture. Maybe he was playing the game with everyone on national TV. WGN is national right? It's still a "super-station".

https://www.thedailybeast.com/brenton-tarrant-idd-new-zealand-shooting-suspect

Even if it has been adopted by hate groups, why surrender it so willingly? Should we prohibit breathing given that every extremist in history has breathed, as have all their followers? If we prohibit everything that any fringe/hate/terrorist/extremist/whatever group decides to adopt it's only a question of time before all that is permitted is anything that has been confirmed to never have been used by any group considered even remotely undesirable in any way. But then, maybe we are already there.

 

[tango]

I am willing to bet that a "white supremacist" has been seen at one time or another giving "the finger" to someone...or a "thumbs up" sign...or maybe even the "live long and prosper" hand sign used by Mr. Spock.

The mystery here is why companies, advertisers, nationally known sports teams, and the like would immediately cave to the unsubstantiated demands and ridiculous reasoning conveyed to them by an email (!) or text written by an unknown person. But it happens all the time.

The companies that advertised on some TV program until told by an extremist who contacted them as part of an organized crusade to say they were no longer supposed to advertise there have lost my patronage forever. How many patrons do we suppose they gained compared to the people they lost??

I think there are two problems here.

Firstly the left have effectively weaponised social media, to the point that the howling about a company allowing itself to be associated with a symbol that "everybody knows" is associated with white supremacists (or sexists, or other racists, or Islamophobes, or whatever other -ist or -phobic group is in vogue today) causes fear of reputational damage.

Secondly, few moderates seem to speak up to tell the company something like "I'll stop shopping with you unless you stop bowing down to this silliness" and even if they do it can be misrepresented as "Unless you resume using this symbol that everybody knows is racist I'll shop elsewhere", which in turn means little more than "I'm a racist and I don't like you any more". It gives the company an easy out, in the form of "that's fine, we don't care if self-confessed racists dislike our new stance".

 

[Albion]

I think there are two problems here.

Firstly the left have effectively weaponised social media, to the point that the howling about a company allowing itself to be associated with a symbol that "everybody knows" is associated with white supremacists (or sexists, or other racists, or Islamophobes, or whatever other -ist or -phobic group is in vogue today) causes fear of reputational damage.

Okay. I did not mean to suggest that these companies are cowardly or unprincipled--and even act counter to their own best interests--for no reason. They may well fear the haters and what the latter might do to their property, etc. But the fact is that the companies that stand up to the totalitarians normally do better because of it.

Secondly, few moderates seem to speak up to tell the company something like "I'll stop shopping with you unless you stop bowing down to this silliness"....

I agree with you about that. However, that is the way of people on the right or in the center. They are not constantly out to control everybody they meet, monitor their speech, issue threats, always working on some political scheme, etc. Still, some response from them might be helpful in these situations. In the cases where they did react (Chick-fil-A, for example) it was met with some success.

 

[ImaginaryDay2]

My mixed race (White/Filipino) niece and nephews should be ashamed. Darned supremacists...

 

[tango]

My mixed race (White/Filipino) niece and nephews should be ashamed. Darned supremacists...

Filipino supremacists, man, they gotta be the worst of all

 

[vince284]

Even if it has been adopted by hate groups, why surrender it so willingly? Should we prohibit breathing given that every extremist in history has breathed, as have all their followers? If we prohibit everything that any fringe/hate/terrorist/extremist/whatever group decides to adopt it's only a question of time before all that is permitted is anything that has been confirmed to never have been used by any group considered even remotely undesirable in any way. But then, maybe we are already there.

I commented that I didn't know the motive for the hand gesture in this particular case, which to me the meaning and intent of the message is more important than the signal or gesture. So should the fan be banned, I think his intent would need to be investigated. Then it's up to the people in charge to make the call. I wouldn't want to own a store and have gang members coming in and flashing their hand signs. But, I wouldn't say that a hand signal is the same as breathing. This hand sign isn't essential for life.

 

[tango]

I commented that I didn't know the motive for the hand gesture in this particular case, which to me the meaning and intent of the message is more important than the signal or gesture. So should the fan be banned, I think his intent would need to be investigated. Then it's up to the people in charge to make the call. I wouldn't want to own a store and have gang members coming in and flashing their hand signs. But, I wouldn't say that a hand signal is the same as breathing. This hand sign isn't essential for life.

The hand sign might not be essential for living, my question was where we draw the line at meekly surrendering anything that any hate group anywhere in the world decides to claim as its own.

Getting involved in trying to judge a motive is likely to be a fruitless exercise, especially with a symbol that may or may not have some sinister meaning to extremist groups but has a well known meaning that is widely accepted in the west. If someone's intent was to intimidate non-whites in the area but they claimed they were merely motioning to a friend that all was well, how can anyone possibly prove that their intent was to intimidate others?

 

[maryruthinhilo]

OMG, this “OK” hand sign is also what all certified scuba divers use to tell one another, under water, that they are doing OK.

Do people now want to condemn all certified SCUBA divers as white nationals?

This whole delusional system that says “I can decide what another person is thinking when they use a (LONG recognized) hand signal (like the OK sign—also INTERNATIONALLY RECOGNIZED BY SCUBA DIVERS TO MEAN OK UNDER WATER OR ABOVE!)” is unique to this current climate where I want to stop your free speech by labeling you as a hate monger.

The younger generation needs to understand that my father and his father B4 him went to war so that we would have the right to say anything we want with VERY few limits (shouting fire in a crowded theatre is likely to condemn many to death and this is forbidden, etc) people need to “grow a pair!” (Oops, I forgot that is sexist, even tho I am a woman using it figuratively and almost anyone reading this post knew what I meant and that I actually was not excluding women...) really, can anyone determine on their own that I am a white nationalist? I’ve even seen blacks labeled as white nationalist (current case in point.)

Well, I’m going to take it a step further. So what if I AM A LAW ABIDING WHITE NATIONALIST throwing some hateful sign? How has that injured anyone? Did it draw blood or cause brain damage? NO IT DID NOT. These “so called micro-aggressions” are absurd! You know what, if you “micro-scratch” my arm, it has time to heal B4 the next person insensitively micro-scratches me in the same place, right? So no big deal.

But, with micro-aggressions, it looks like there is NEVER any healing? They just add up day after day until—WHAT? You cry? Get a life folks. Start living it. Start adulting and you might find out you are not a delicate little flower just waiting for someone (usually a big mean white male) to step on you and squish out all of your joy... Instead, worry about the big things: Cancer, Global Dominion, the near death of our oceans, obtaining a career that you like AND can get paid well for, etc. Good luck with that!


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[tango]

I believe there are some cultures in which the "OK" circle gesture is considered very offensive - apparently the circle is indicative of a body part that isn't known for smelling great and that isn't usually aired in public. That said it's impossible to know just what any given sign that is widely known and accepted in one culture might mean in another, foreign, culture. Sometimes things have a totally different meaning to members of other cultures, it just happens. A few years back I knew a lovely Indian lady who was once very confused because she had let someone out in front of her in heavy traffic and they responded with a very rude gesture. The rude gesture was a thumbs up - in our culture it was clearly a way of saying "thankyou" but in her culture it's something very different. She didn't go into details other than to say it was very rude. When she realised what it means in our culture everything made sense to her.

This idea of microaggressions and the notion that every verbal slight, however unintentional, is not only as damaging as physical violence but can be regarded as being equivalent to physical violence is growing increasingly ridiculous.

Start adulting and you might find out you are not a delicate little flower just waiting for someone (usually a big mean white male)

You forgot to mention the big mean white male has to be heterosexual, cisgendered and able-bodied. This omission is hugely offensive to big non-mean heterosexual cisgendered able-bodied white males such as myself