What does it mean when someone says they weren't saved in the first place?

Wilhemena

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Does salvation hinge on something that makes it so man can't downslide and no longer believe which is why there is this idea out there that maybe they weren't saved in the first place? Now I have heard this proclaimed by some very godly Christians although I can't for the life of me see Jesus saying that to anyone in the bible but I can see Jesus saying that the seeds can whither and not grow.
 

psalms 91

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YES! absolutely
 

Brighten04

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Does salvation hinge on something that makes it so man can't downslide and no longer believe which is why there is this idea out there that maybe they weren't saved in the first place? Now I have heard this proclaimed by some very godly Christians although I can't for the life of me see Jesus saying that to anyone in the bible but I can see Jesus saying that the seeds can whither and not grow.

Well, Jesus also talked about the tares planted among the wheat.
 

Rens

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Does salvation hinge on something that makes it so man can't downslide and no longer believe which is why there is this idea out there that maybe they weren't saved in the first place? Now I have heard this proclaimed by some very godly Christians although I can't for the life of me see Jesus saying that to anyone in the bible but I can see Jesus saying that the seeds can whither and not grow.

There are enough atheists who were once saved. Just pray they come back. I came to the point that I didnt believe He existed anymore because of a divorce and sin and hate. I was saved though before, so if they tell an atheist he was never really saved that's just stupid to fit your theology. Baby christians can backslide and come back again.
 

user1234

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Answers to this vary bc of the different meanings that have been applied to these terms . Saved. Some ppl say it means just that. Settled. Done. Guaranteed.There are those who say no way. There's a 'provision' clause .... Saved provided ...... And then any number of things may be listed.

Some may argue that saying 'provided' is adding to the finished work of Christ on the cross, and therefore adds to the gospel, meaning there IS no gospel.

Some others may argue that saying Done Finished Complete means the life that the saved person lives henceforth is made meaningless (regarding salvation).

And if they are living like the devil, how can they claim to be saved? And ppl will say they can make good points on both of these positions, and scripture is used for support. And I'm sure some would say there are more positions than these.

I think that since this topic has been debated for a long long time by many great and deep thinkers, it might be best for me to say both and neither.

Jesus paid it all. Our salvation is secure in Him.

If we believe in Him, His atoning death for our sins, His resurrection from the grave, we're saved. It's the object of our faith that matters ... In this case, the Lord Jesus Christ Himself ... Not our faith in and of itself, nor how much of it we can muster up to make sure we're not crossing some invisible line that says OOPS, too much sin, you aren't saved anymore.

Will Jesus lose any that are His? No.
Are we saved by our own righteousness? No.

We stand in His righteousness.

How we go moving forward may be better left as personal sanctification, and maybe God deals with each of us in different ways at different stages of our life.Is one person convinced that God wants them doing something, and perhaps it's bothering their conscience to the point of questioning their salvation? Then maybe they need to do (or stop doing) what God is telling them.

I personally don't believe anyone's salvation is based on their own performance, but if it brings that person to accept Jesus' substitutionary sacrifice on their behalf and they're saved, then Praise the Lord.

If someone else is already there, and are convinced that Jesus saved them, then Praise the Lord! We're not their judge to tell them no!

And if someone is somewhere in the tension between, well, we're called to love one another, pray for one another, encourage each other, build each other up in the faith.THE faith.Jesus is our Saviour. He's the One who loves us with an everlasting love, and gave Himself FOR us!

I guess the only unforgiveable sin from that point on is if a person decides they don't care, they're not interested, and make a willful, determinative decision to reject the Lord Jesus Christ, and His gift of salvation, and all that that means.

And who knows if that person continues to be alive, God may get them saved yet! He's our loving heavenly Father, and His mercies are new every morning, and His grace and love abounds.

This was a great question, Wilhemena, and I'm sure I didn't get any closer to answering it than before, but thanks for letting me toss two cents in, and thanks for inspiring us to think a little deeper. I DO have more I'd like to say, and have a more convinced position than perhaps I stated here, but I'd like to hear some others as well. God bless you with His grace in Jesus.
 

atpollard

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What does it mean when someone says they weren't saved in the first place?
It means that they are confused about something and have probably suffered some hurt.
With respect to their ultimate eternal destination, it means nothing.

John 6:37-40
37 All those the Father gives me will come to me, and whoever comes to me I will never drive away. 38 For I have come down from heaven not to do my will but to do the will of him who sent me. 39 And this is the will of him who sent me, that I shall lose none of all those he has given me, but raise them up at the last day. 40 For my Father’s will is that everyone who looks to the Son and believes in him shall have eternal life, and I will raise them up at the last day.”
 

MoreCoffee

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Does salvation hinge on something that makes it so man can't downslide and no longer believe which is why there is this idea out there that maybe they weren't saved in the first place? Now I have heard this proclaimed by some very godly Christians although I can't for the life of me see Jesus saying that to anyone in the bible but I can see Jesus saying that the seeds can whither and not grow.

It comes from a misconception that once one is "saved" it is a permanent condition. The use of "saved" in the past tense is what does it. People read in the holy scriptures that "we are saved" and conclude that once it happens it can never be undone. It's a mistake in reading. Kind of like misunderstanding when somebody tells you something. For example, "I will always love you", is not intended to be a promise made for eternity. It is hyperbole. An expression of ardent affection and love now but not a promise for all time. The brutal truth is that humans beings do not live forever and their love cannot outlive them. And even if one takes it to be said in Christian faith that there is a resurrection and the love will continue in the resurrection it ought to be remembered that in the resurrection men and women will be like the angels neither marrying nor being given in marriage. So the love of man & wife will not survive the resurrection unaltered.
 

psalms 91

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The other problem is that people forget that Jesus is a judge and will judge all of us either at the judgement seat of Christ or the Great White ZThrone Judgement. Yes Gos is love but He is also a God of justice and judgement
 

user1234

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It comes from a misconception that once one is "saved" it is a permanent condition. The use of "saved" in the past tense is what does it. People read in the holy scriptures that "we are saved" and conclude that once it happens it can never be undone. It's a mistake in reading. Kind of like misunderstanding when somebody tells you something. For example, "I will always love you", is not intended to be a promise made for eternity. It is hyperbole. An expression of ardent affection and love now but not a promise for all time. The brutal truth is that humans beings do not live forever and their love cannot outlive them. And even if one takes it to be said in Christian faith that there is a resurrection and the love will continue in the resurrection it ought to be remembered that in the resurrection men and women will be like the angels neither marrying nor being given in marriage. So the love of man & wife will not survive the resurrection unaltered.
^How sad^
And incorrect on so many levels.
Not so much goodness or hope there.

The gospel of the Lord Jesus Christ is Good News!
He is Risen ... He is Risen indeed!
And He's coming again!
To take us home to be with Him in His Kingdom!
Salvation is not a temporary condition, it's forever settled in heaven.
Love is not hyperbole, it's eternal and everlasting.
Thank you, Jesus! Praise the Lord!
Please take a further read into scripture
and see the goodness and mercy of the Lord,
and receive His love and salvation.
Praying for you.
 

MoreCoffee

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It's such a surprise to see how some Protestants read what is written in the holy scriptures and how they do so badly at reading what I write. I haven't said that God's love is hyperbole. Nor have I implied that salvation - once accomplished - is temporary. What I did say is that salvation is not a past tense thing. It is something that God works in the faithful and brings to completion in due time. Like the Lord said in the passage I quoted from earlier. anyone who stands firm to the end will be saved. [SUP]Matt 10:22[/SUP]
 

Brighten04

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^How sad^
And incorrect on so many levels.
Not so much goodness or hope there.

The gospel of the Lord Jesus Christ is Good News!
He is Risen ... He is Risen indeed!
And He's coming again!
To take us home to be with Him in His Kingdom!
Salvation is not a temporary condition, it's forever settled in heaven.
Love is not hyperbole, it's eternal and everlasting.
Thank you, Jesus! Praise the Lord!
Please take a further read into scripture
and see the goodness and mercy of the Lord,
and receive His love and salvation.
Praying for you.

Amen!:amen:
 

Rens

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It's such a surprise to see how some Protestants read what is written in the holy scriptures and how they do so badly at reading what I write. I haven't said that God's love is hyperbole. Nor have I implied that salvation - once accomplished - is temporary. What I did say is that salvation is not a past tense thing. It is something that God works in the faithful and brings to completion in due time. Like the Lord said in the passage I quoted from earlier. anyone who stands firm to the end will be saved. [SUP]Matt 10:22[/SUP]

I think it's both true. You are saved and you will be saved.
 

MoreCoffee

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I think it's both true. You are saved and you will be saved.

Yes, there is a past present and future to one's salvation. Effected in the past by the work of the Lord Jesus Christ, his work is applied in the present by word and sacrament as well as the good we do, and it is consummated in the future when our bodies are redeemed. But some people appear to dislike it when the future aspect is highlighted.
 
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Brighten04

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It's such a surprise to see how some Protestants read what is written in the holy scriptures and how they do so badly at reading what I write. I haven't said that God's love is hyperbole. Nor have I implied that salvation - once accomplished - is temporary. What I did say is that salvation is not a past tense thing. It is something that God works in the faithful and brings to completion in due time. Like the Lord said in the passage I quoted from earlier. anyone who stands firm to the end will be saved. [SUP]Matt 10:22[/SUP]

Maybe you used too many words MC. I understood your post the same way Snerfle understood it, but now you say different.
 

MoreCoffee

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Maybe you used too many words MC. I understood your post the same way Snerfle understood it, but now you say different.

Most of my posts are brief. Only a few are long.
 

Lamb

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I have a friend from another site who has autism. Every now and again she will message me saying how she got saved over the weekend because she committed herself to Jesus...again. She does this often. It's a sign that she doesn't understand the connection of the cross and the forgiveness of sins to salvation. Because of altar calls that some churches do to put the focus on man instead of the Savior, she has followed by thinking she has to do something for salvation.

So this friend thinks that she wasn't saved the first time she gave herself to Jesus. Isn't that sad? What a doubting type of faith to not trust in Him who saves.
 

Rens

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I have a friend from another site who has autism. Every now and again she will message me saying how she got saved over the weekend because she committed herself to Jesus...again. She does this often. It's a sign that she doesn't understand the connection of the cross and the forgiveness of sins to salvation. Because of altar calls that some churches do to put the focus on man instead of the Savior, she has followed by thinking she has to do something for salvation.

So this friend thinks that she wasn't saved the first time she gave herself to Jesus. Isn't that sad? What a doubting type of faith to not trust in Him who saves.

oh yes i always did that too every week in some legalistic church. After a few weeks he just ignored me if I put up my hand to say the sinner's prayer again. They had that song we sung every week. Lord I come to You sinful and unclean hahahahahahaha ooh it was so sad actually it's funny.
I played guitar there but they had 2 services every sunday and I thought one was enough. Wow then youd get a preaching that if you deliberately skipped a service there was no forgiveness possible anymore.
And then he'd pray for a good faithful guitar player. Not an unfaithful one like me LOL.
Got sick of it. Never wanted to go to church anymore. He was God's personal speak pipe dunno in english hahahahaha. Then I went to my moms church and all of a sudden God was nice to me lolz.
 

Lamb

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oh yes i always did that too every week in some legalistic church. After a few weeks he just ignored me if I put up my hand to say the sinner's prayer again. They had that song we sung every week. Lord I come to You sinful and unclean hahahahahahaha ooh it was so sad actually it's funny.
I played guitar there but they had 2 services every sunday and I thought one was enough. Wow then youd get a preaching that if you deliberately skipped a service there was no forgiveness possible anymore.
And then he'd pray for a good faithful guitar player. Not an unfaithful one like me LOL.
Got sick of it. Never wanted to go to church anymore. He was God's personal speak pipe dunno in english hahahahaha. Then I went to my moms church and all of a sudden God was nice to me lolz.

Do you think the more legalistic the church the more that salvation is what man does instead of salvation by grace through faith?
 

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Do you think the more legalistic the church the more that salvation is what man does instead of salvation by grace through faith?

Yes. Those legalistic reformed churches people have to feel like theyre so evil as if theyre the devil himself otherwise they arent really saved.
 

Brighten04

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Some people act like you can become unborn if you sin after you have been born again.
 
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